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Dalton
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
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 Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:28 am Post subject: |
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If I buy a car and rent it out or let people use it for free am I a thief?
If I buy a movie and rent it out or let people use it for free am I a thief?
If I buy food and decide to give it away and eat less am I thief?
This argument is absurd.
You are having to work very hard with unrelated examples to disparage the character of file sharers. The Internet is what it is. People have to adapt or die. Darwinism at it's most inconvenient for those who've expounded it's principles for their own purposes for so long.
Is this irony?
Edit: Aluminum used to be very expensive. Is the guy who invented the process to make it cheap a thief? Or just the customers.
Is Walmart a thief? Costco? Discount stores in general? Their customers? |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:55 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| If I buy a movie and rent it out or let people use it for free am I a thief? |
Again, ether dense or trolling.
Under copywrigt laws if you are a liscenced vendour renting videos and are paying a sum to the distributor and owners for renting out their products -that is legal. Otherwise it is illegal, has been for decades. Everyone knows this.
Come on folks, really.
Sharing food and sharing a file with 4000 potential customers is not the same thing and you either already know this or are being silly. |
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fosterman
Joined: 16 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
The auto companies have sold 1million units in that scenario.
In my 'seeder with 4000 peers example' - only ONE unit has been bought and is being given to 4000 others for free.
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so where do you draw the line?
so in your eyes it's illegal when a certain amount of people share the file?
what about a file where there is only one seeder?
1 or 1 million? you can't put a number on the crime.
either sharing is illegal or it's not.
and if sharing is illegal then we have a serious problem don't we?
sharing without intent to profit.
or sharing with intent to profit?
it doesn't make sense what Hollywood is trying to do.
I agree that selling pirated material is illegal as someone is profiting from the sale of stolen material.
but you giving me your transformer dvd to borrow is not stealing.
if that is the case, then libraries need to be put on trial! |
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Dalton
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 2:21 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
| Quote: |
| If I buy a movie and rent it out or let people use it for free am I a thief? |
Again, ether dense or trolling.
Under copywrigt laws if you are a liscenced vendour renting videos and are paying a sum to the distributor and owners for renting out their products -that is legal. Otherwise it is illegal, has been for decades. Everyone knows this.
Come on folks, really.
Sharing food and sharing a file with 4000 potential customers is not the same thing and you either already know this or are being silly. |
Copyright laws in what country or planet?
Many years ago in my country I was interested in starting up a video store. All I needed was a business licence to buy movies for about $100.00 a pop to rent out at my hearts desire. I could have let people rent them for free as a promotion. 4000x if I chose. 10,000x. Or maybe I could have started a video library and let people sign out movies and songs to their heart's content as long as they bring them back on time. |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:41 am Post subject: |
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| Libraries need licences lol. |
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Dalton
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:00 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
| Libraries need licences lol. |
So do dogs.
But people who wish to share files online do not. |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:42 am Post subject: |
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For the time being. It wont be long.  |
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Dalton
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 5:18 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
| For the time being. It wont be long. |
Maybe. But Sopa is dead and Acta is bleeding out.
The industries affected have to adjust. Trying to make all earthlings criminals instead is historically stupid. What if you could watch a premier at home on your system for only $10.00? Would it stop you from going to see a terrific movie on the big screen? I've done that after watching a dl. Would Hollywood suffer? They'd have made a lot of money off me for movies that I would never pay current prices to see but I was curious about. They lose maybe a hundred bucks a year from me by my model for being obstinate, neo-luddite bullies.
The Internet. Use it or lose it. Hollywood and their brethren are losing it in fantastic, Hollywood style. IMHO |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:16 am Post subject: |
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Ok, so you're saying they could offer us movies to watch over the net, which should be cheaper as the overheads such as rental outlets, vehicular distribution, staffing costs, building rentals and utilities that go into cinemas and stores that sell and / or rent movies are cut out of the equation? As essentially all they have to do is set up a method of transaction and then literally 'wire' the file to our laptops / pc's?
Yeah that makes sense.
Do companies offer movies at cheaper prices than they can be bought for on dvd over the net? Are the movie companies making any such concessions?
I really do not know the answer to that as I'm not too pc savvy tbh. I know you can buy songs on itunes but they don't seem to work out any cheaper than buying a physical cd, I think. And if that is the case, yeah that is silly as they are saving on a lot of physical production costs.
Replies very much welcomed! |
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Dalton
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:38 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
Ok, so you're saying they could offer us movies to watch over the net, which should be cheaper as the overheads such as rental outlets, vehicular distribution, staffing costs, building rentals and utilities that go into cinemas and stores that sell and / or rent movies are cut out of the equation? As essentially all they have to do is set up a method of transaction and then literally 'wire' the file to our laptops / pc's?
Yeah that makes sense.
Do companies offer movies at cheaper prices than they can be bought for on dvd over the net? Are the movie companies making any such concessions?
I really do not know the answer to that as I'm not too pc savvy tbh. I know you can buy songs on itunes but they don't seem to work out any cheaper than buying a physical cd, I think. And if that is the case, yeah that is silly as they are saving on a lot of physical production costs.
Replies very much welcomed! |
No. I'm saying you're fighting a losing battle.
I can get the movies for free today and in the foreseeable future.
There is nothing on the horizon challenging that. |
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Carbon
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
You are either a dullard or trying to be disengenius, Fosterman.
| Quote: |
| god forbid 1 million people lend their cars to family or friends this weekend. |
The auto companies have sold 1million units in that scenario.
In my 'seeder with 4000 peers example' - only ONE unit has been bought and is being given to 4000 others for free.
You either know that and are trolling me or you, like the craptain, need to smarten up.
Apologies for typos, I'm on a five mon break |
All they are saying is that they are not like you.
Your baseline assumption is that everyone simply doesn't want to pay for things, which is not true at all. There are many reasons for downloading copyrighted material and while the result is seen in the same way by authorities, the motivations differ. This is a fair argument being here in Korea, where some things are simply not available to people for one reason or another. If I were to download Korean TV shows in America, the same argument would apply.
There is the concept of downloading out of necessity, which again, the authorities don't see as being legal, but you are not talking about legalities; you are talking about personal ethics. Is it wrong to download material that one cannot find by other means? Well, I suppose one must temper their desires here - not want what they cannot have - but personally, I wouldn't hold someone in that situation as accountable as in others (like the ones you outline). |
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Adam Carolla
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
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| Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Dalton wrote: |
| The Floating World wrote: |
Ok, so you're saying they could offer us movies to watch over the net, which should be cheaper as the overheads such as rental outlets, vehicular distribution, staffing costs, building rentals and utilities that go into cinemas and stores that sell and / or rent movies are cut out of the equation? As essentially all they have to do is set up a method of transaction and then literally 'wire' the file to our laptops / pc's?
Yeah that makes sense.
Do companies offer movies at cheaper prices than they can be bought for on dvd over the net? Are the movie companies making any such concessions?
I really do not know the answer to that as I'm not too pc savvy tbh. I know you can buy songs on itunes but they don't seem to work out any cheaper than buying a physical cd, I think. And if that is the case, yeah that is silly as they are saving on a lot of physical production costs.
Replies very much welcomed! |
No. I'm saying you're fighting a losing battle.
I can get the movies for free today and in the foreseeable future.
There is nothing on the horizon challenging that. |
It doesn't take much imagination to see that if Hollywood stops making money from producing movies, it will stop producing movies. So, I would call that "on the horizon" for sure. |
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fosterman
Joined: 16 Nov 2011
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| Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Adam Carolla wrote: |
| Dalton wrote: |
| The Floating World wrote: |
Ok, so you're saying they could offer us movies to watch over the net, which should be cheaper as the overheads such as rental outlets, vehicular distribution, staffing costs, building rentals and utilities that go into cinemas and stores that sell and / or rent movies are cut out of the equation? As essentially all they have to do is set up a method of transaction and then literally 'wire' the file to our laptops / pc's?
Yeah that makes sense.
Do companies offer movies at cheaper prices than they can be bought for on dvd over the net? Are the movie companies making any such concessions?
I really do not know the answer to that as I'm not too pc savvy tbh. I know you can buy songs on itunes but they don't seem to work out any cheaper than buying a physical cd, I think. And if that is the case, yeah that is silly as they are saving on a lot of physical production costs.
Replies very much welcomed! |
No. I'm saying you're fighting a losing battle.
I can get the movies for free today and in the foreseeable future.
There is nothing on the horizon challenging that. |
It doesn't take much imagination to see that if Hollywood stops making money from producing movies, it will stop producing movies. So, I would call that "on the horizon" for sure. |
Hollywood doesn't lose enough money for piracy to be a concern, they are just losing out on more profits that's all.
you don't think pirates of the carribean made money?
you don't think Avatar made money even though millions of copies were downloaded?
Tv shows like 24, madmen, two and half men, even though they are being downloaded, they still make MILLIONS of dollars a day and then go into syndication and make more millions for a few people at the top.
the only thing I see on the Horizon is Hollywood dries up with talent and original ideas and all that will be coming out of hollywood will be Transformers 8, men and black 11, and a sequel to everything else.
if they make quality then they will make money.
I don't see why I have to pay 10 dollars for a movie at the cinema when the film only cost 1 million dollars to make, but I have to pay 10 dollars for a film which cost 100 million to make. and I am getting sick and tired paying for bad movies.
maybe if they stopped paying their actors 20 million dollars and their director 5 million dollars, then perhaps they might see some profits! |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:14 am Post subject: |
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| The Floating World wrote: |
No but amazon does, once the tv show is put on sale on dvd.
Just because you go abroad doesn't mean you're enitled to all the creature comforts of home.
'Uh, not taking the job if I can't watch the latest Fox drama... whinge, whine, boo hoody hoo hoo...'
In fact some might say you'd expect things to be a lot different (gasp! Shock Horror!) and some might even move abroad for those very reasons (Oh mai gaht!)
Come on craptain, get wise. |
Does Amazon ship all over the world? No limitations on where it'll ship certain titles to?
You sure on that?
| The Floating World wrote: |
Stop childishly skirting the issue.
You know as well as I do you might share that dvd with one or two friends, potentially costing the movie company the sale of one or two units, not several thousand.
A seeder with 4000 peers is potentially loing the producers and distributors thousands of units.
You know it, I know it, you pretend otherwise to make yourself feel good.
Simple. |
Theft is theft. Why would it matter if you stole one apple or one thousand. if it's theft, then it's theft.
If I show a video I bought to my buddy, is it theft?
No.
Looks like you're losing yet another of your rambling vendettas on here. lol |
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The Floating World
Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here
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| Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:26 am Post subject: |
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| I've already given my thoughts on both of your points in reply to others. |
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