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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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 Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:10 am Post subject: |
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I don't buy it. When does the cartoon character wears basketball jerseys, gold chains, and clock pendants like Flava Flav?
As for moral parity, the world isn't flat. This is the third time in the past year that MBC has had blackface cause a huge backlash. There's a lot more scrutiny on what is aired publicly nowadays. Shouldn't they know better by now? As for Crystal, he's an a**hole for doing what he did, if he did indeed perform in blackface.
Here's a new link to it (at about 47 minutes in):
http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/0OokwcBGrak/?resourceId=0_06_02_99?fr=1
I got a translation. The song itself wasn't racist. Also, I have Reese's PB cups. Yay! 
/end
Last edited by NYC_Gal 2.0 on Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:49 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Feloria
Joined: 02 Sep 2006
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| Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:18 am Post subject: |
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Uhhh--just watched it,
That was repugnant--
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cwflaneur
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
As for Crystal, he's an a**hole for doing what he did, if he did indeed perform in blackface.
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He didn't. He just had on some clothes and make-up that made him look like Sammy Davis Jr. That would be proper "blackface" only if the intent and effect of the costume (and performance) were to ridicule black people, which is wasn't.
I never thought I would find myself on a forum defending Billy Crystal, but that's not really what I'm doing, just trying to make you see the difference.
As for the MCB skit, judging by the appearances alone, the style of the representation was a lot closer to blackface. It it were broadcast in America, the racism would have been undeniable. But the thing is Korea doesn't have the legacy of 19th century minstrel shows and African slavery to contend with, so when they do this sort of thing, it's comparatively innocent. It looks horrifying to us because we see it through a certain lens of historical and cultural experience, and that lens is less relevant in Korea. That's not to justify it in any way. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| cwflaneur wrote: |
| But the thing is Korea doesn't have the legacy of 19th century minstrel shows and African slavery to contend with, so when they do this sort of thing, it's comparatively innocent. It looks horrifying to us because we see it through a certain lens of historical and cultural experience, and that lens is less relevant in Korea. That's not to justify it in any way. |
+1
When Koreans do it, its simply insensitive. After all, the Koreans have no history of Jim Crow, lynchings, chattel slavery, or any of the rest. |
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Blockhead confidence
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| It's been happening for ages |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:35 am Post subject: |
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^^^ Ages? That link shows 6 years ago. Am I missing something?
| Kuros wrote: |
| cwflaneur wrote: |
| But the thing is Korea doesn't have the legacy of 19th century minstrel shows and African slavery to contend with, so when they do this sort of thing, it's comparatively innocent. It looks horrifying to us because we see it through a certain lens of historical and cultural experience, and that lens is less relevant in Korea. That's not to justify it in any way. |
+1
When Koreans do it, its simply insensitive. After all, the Koreans have no history of Jim Crow, lynchings, chattel slavery, or any of the rest. |
This makes sense to me.
+1 |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| cwflaneur wrote: |
| But the thing is Korea doesn't have the legacy of 19th century minstrel shows and African slavery to contend with, so when they do this sort of thing, it's comparatively innocent. It looks horrifying to us because we see it through a certain lens of historical and cultural experience, and that lens is less relevant in Korea. That's not to justify it in any way. |
+1
When Koreans do it, its simply insensitive. After all, the Koreans have no history of Jim Crow, lynchings, chattel slavery, or any of the rest. |
Exactly. Does anyone honestly think there was malicious intent behind this ridiculous attempt at comedy? |
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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Korea has been called out for this type of thing before. They KNOW that it is wrong. They may not have the history, but they have the knowledge. That they continue to do this sort of thing is not innocent. |
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Blockhead confidence
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
| ^^^ Ages? That link shows 6 years ago. Am I missing something? |
How embarassment. My credentials as an archaeologist are in tatters. |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| Korea has been called out for this type of thing before. They KNOW that it is wrong. They may not have the history, but they have the knowledge. That they continue to do this sort of thing is not innocent. |
"Korea" has? "They" do?
I can't believe that these "comedians" were aware of the racial connotations (evident to most Americans) behind black face. I'm Canadian and had no idea of the stigma behind black face until at least University. It's not like there's an active international committee trying to get the word out that certain caricatures of black people have very bad connotations in the US that the rest of the world must avoid to assuage their guilt. |
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madoka
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
"Korea" has? "They" do?
I can't believe that these "comedians" were aware of the racial connotations (evident to most Americans) behind black face. I'm Canadian and had no idea of the stigma behind black face until at least University. It's not like there's an active international committee trying to get the word out that certain caricatures of black people have very bad connotations in the US that the rest of the world must avoid to assuage their guilt. |
+1 Furthermore, it's not evident to most Americans. Even those in college:
http://www.dailyorange.com/2.8657/blackface-makes-its-way-to-college-campuses-1.1247695#.T1btYGDR1GE
"At Auburn, several white members of two fraternities dressed up as KKK Klansmen and black gang members. An Oklahoma State party went even further when students dressed as Klansmen and pretended to lynch students in blackface. At the University of Mississippi, pictures emerged from a party showing a student in a police costume holding a gun to the head of a student in blackface who was pretending to pick cotton
"It's a mockery of a group of people as a race," said Monica Roberts, co-chairwomen of the Team Against Bias. "It has a historical context that emerged out of slavery and was used to keep black people in their place."
Syracuse's own history with blackface dates to the 2002 incident when a student dressed as Tiger Woods, complete with black face paint.
The student, then-senior Aaron Levine, was seen walking around the campus area by many groups of people, said Marlene Hall, director of the Department of Public Safety. When a call was placed to Public Safety, Hall said, the dispatcher was at first confused by the call because she did not know what blackface was.
"There wasn't a consistent knowledge of what blackface was when I started here," said Hall, who was in her first year at SU when the Levine incident occurred. "I'd say that there was a 50/50 split between people who were aware of it and people who weren't." |
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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| Korea has been called out for this type of thing before. They KNOW that it is wrong. They may not have the history, but they have the knowledge. That they continue to do this sort of thing is not innocent. |
"Korea" has? "They" do?
I can't believe that these "comedians" were aware of the racial connotations (evident to most Americans) behind black face. I'm Canadian and had no idea of the stigma behind black face until at least University. It's not like there's an active international committee trying to get the word out that certain caricatures of black people have very bad connotations in the US that the rest of the world must avoid to assuage their guilt. |
Oh, Jebus. You knew that I meant the Korean media. If not, I apologize for being unclear. Still, the audience and panelists seemed to be eating it up.
US history or not, dressing and donning make up of a negative stereotype of ANY race is just plain ig'nant. The fact that it's been called out to THE KOREAN MEDIA several times in the past year should have educated THE KOREANS INVOLVED IN MEDIA.
What do you think would happen if foreigners started taping back their eyes, sticking out their front teeth in a severe overbite, and started mocking their culture. Yeah. Cultural differences my tush.
The fact that you had no idea is just ignorance. Don't they teach global history in Canadian schools? It's a requirement in New York, at least, though I can't speak for the rest of my country. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| NYC_Gal 2.0 wrote: |
| Korea has been called out for this type of thing before. |
Link?
Oh and whining about it on Dave's does not equal calling Korea out. Find a KOREAN newspaper that criticizes these kind of performances and then you may have a point (most of them don't read English newspapers). |
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NYC_Gal 2.0
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
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cwflaneur
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:46 am Post subject: |
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I have to say there's one point of view that I regard with contempt - the attitude that Korea doesn't even have any problems with inclusivity, or that if it does, outsiders have no right to point it out. It's sad enough when a Korean makes a priority of excusing his own country right or wrong, and it's just as pathetic when a foreigner does it for him.
My own experience here leaves me with conflicting impressions. On one hand, working here I've spoken with hundreds of Koreans, most of whom are tolerant and sane, and many of whom are curious, open minded, and interested in change. On the other hand I continually sense the suffocating pressure of a homogenous society with a heritage of insularity and conformity that objectively makes anything akin to today it in the West pale in comparison. When rueful incidents like this MBC skit happen, Korea makes herself seem that she's either not serious about developing an international presence, or just not ready for it. The touchstone is not going to be whether things like this stop happening in the Korean media - scandals and embarrassments happen in every society's entertainment world - but rather the extent to which the response of the Korean public reveals a self-critical mindset. |
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