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Flight reimbursement policy change?
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warmachinenkorea

Joined: 12 Oct 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:18 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

Quote:

you need to realize that 100 % of the worlds' population is not in the same boat as you.

Therefore, Korea is responsible for paying us airfare? I am missing your logic. How has the rest of the world's financial problems become Korea's responsibility? Instead of sounding like a greedy teenager, learn to budget yourself. There is no reason why you can't pay monthly bills while still saving. A person with $1,500/month in loans has some serious issues. Do the math, that would mean a person would owe $18,000!!! At which point should they take the responsibility and not borrow more money? After 20,000? 40,000? How much does one person need to have?

Also, paying off loans instead of investing your money is not a smart move. If you do a little homework, you can learn to pay off loans with money you make through investing.

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Many Chinese hakwons are starting to pay for flights and give free housing allowances.

You mean rent by "housing allowances"? The housing issue then is not really a variable here then, since no one is asking the teacher to pay any of the security deposits (called yajin in Chinese) but the yajin would be just a 7th month of rent if you rented for 6 months. Some places allow for 3, but they try to get you to sign up for 1 year or 6 months. In Korea, the security deposits are much higher. Not even in the same ballpark. The flight money they give in China isn't as much as you think. I am in Beijing, and I was in Shanghai in 2010. Of any of the places, these are the highest.

And, if you read the contracts, you will see they don't pay for the airfare upfront usually. You have to finish 6 months to get it back. Both your comparisons with airfare in China and security deposits don't even come close to what Korea gives.

Quote:

Never had any money for a deposit deducted from my account.

I never said you did. I even signed one contract in Korea which said they would, and they never did. The point of bringing it up wasn't to state a fact, but a negotiable term. If they aren't, then it makes the argument stronger, they don't want teachers leaving before 6 months.

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Took this gig because of student loan debt.

Then, you get my sympathies in regard to monthly payments. If you want Korea to be your sugar daddy so you can pay it off earlier, look elsewhere. It makes it look bad for the rest of us.

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I'm the first in my family to go to college. I got debt that way.

That's odd, you would think the oldest would get the money so they could go to college, then get a job. The money they make after college could help the younger siblings. The fact you say you don't have money means what? Your parents would have a lot more money after you left? Were you really a financial burden to them? Your actions support this. Either that, or you are hoping your younger siblings win the lotto.

Quote:

95% of jobs ads for China do at least $800-1000 on a plane ticket.

Read the contracts, they say they will pay them after 6 months. Also, you guys are comparing this to a Chinese job which pays half the salary of a Korean job. You really prefer earning half the monthly salary so you can pretend on these forums you get full airfare before you start a contract period? You simply don't have your facts. Maybe you are wishing the grass is greener over here. It may be, but not for financial reasons.

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If the employer offers to bring you over they need to buy the ticket or pay you in a reasonable time. 6 months is not a reasonable time.

Tell that to China and the Korean Labor Board. They don't agree with you.

Quote:

But are you sure you're just not angry today. No one has said anything about 3/4 of the stuff you're spitting out.

Not angry, just bursting bubbles in dreamland. You think it's your right to demand airfare, and while you have nothing to support this, you reference China of all countries as a basis to support your fragile argument.

I am humbly informing you that you are lacking a lot of information and that you should look into this more to see what I am saying. Then, maybe your attitude will change.

Also, I never said you shouldn't try to get airfare. Just don't expect it. That is a contractual arrangement between you and the employer. It's not a labor law issue.

I really think you're looking for a fight. I have no siblings. I have no idea where you're getting this. Did you miss the part about my parents being crack addicts? Crack addict's have no money so I got grants and loans.

No one is saying Korea is a sugar daddy. They(Korea) offer air fare. No one is asking for it. It's part of the job. They want native speakers so they offer airfare, housing, and salary.

They're offering these things as payment.

I still have no idea where you're getting 3/4 of the stuff you're saying.

YTMND

Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:56 pm Post subject:

Quote:

I really think you're looking for a fight.

No, you aren't telling us the complete story, so I am trying to figure out based on what little you have given. However, when you fill in the missing information, it still doesn't support the argument that Korean employers should always have to pay for airfare. Read on and see.

Quote:

I have no siblings.

Well, before you stated, "I'm the first in my family to go to college."

Logically, if we were to understand your situation as being somehow "handicapped" where you needed financial support from the working class, then it would have made more sense to have taken that leap that you did have younger siblings.

However, you are clarifying it by stating that your parents didn't go to college. Fine, but how does not having parents who went to college equal Korean employers need to pay airfare? Do explain please.

Quote:

Did you miss the part about my parents being crack addicts? Crack addict's have no money so I got grants and loans.

Crack addicts probably do have money. They just spend it on crack. Now you are saying because your parents are crack addicts, you should be financially rewarded from cradle to grave?

If you were under 18, social services should step in and help. After that, you are an adult and you need to learn to make your own money. You are a far cry from Liz Murray.

Quote:

They(Korea) offer air fare. No one is asking for it. It's part of the job. They want native speakers so they offer airfare, housing, and salary.

You are mistaken. They can choose to offer airfare. They don't have to. If you change jobs within Korea, a lot of the contracts state you will NOT get airfare. This is another case of you not having your facts straight.

Quote:

I still have no idea where you're getting 3/4 of the stuff you're saying.

I am getting it from working in Asia for 10 years almost. I am getting it from sifting through contracts in several countries over the years. I am getting it from what other experienced teachers share.

You really ought to read up on this and get out of your cocoon. No one is going to spoon feed you your whole life. You are an adult now. Forget your past parent problems. Forget your grants, loans, hand outs. Work and save.

Guajiro

Joined: 04 Dec 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:20 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

The point, as I take it, is that most jobs in Korea offer to pay the teacher's airfare if applying from abroad. This is one of the reasons many choose Korea over other countries. I took a job in Korea as opposed to Taiwan because of rent-free housing and airfare reimbursement. Without those benefits, I would have gone to Taiwan. Unless the contract is offering a significantly better than average salary, I wouldn't advise anyone to take a job without airfare.

My two cents...

YTMND

Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Unless the contract is offering a significantly better than average salary, I wouldn't advise anyone to take a job without airfare.

Unfortunately, that is what many people only care about, the money and not the country or culture. Why don't you guys go to Saudi Arabia? I heard the money is even better over there.

Guajiro

Joined: 04 Dec 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:17 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

Quote:

Unless the contract is offering a significantly better than average salary, I wouldn't advise anyone to take a job without airfare.

Unfortunately, that is what many people only care about, the money and not the country or culture. Why don't you guys go to Saudi Arabia? I heard the money is even better over there.

Now you're just changing the subject. I thought that I would equally learn from and enjoy the various cultural differences of Taiwan and Korea. I had friends and family members that had taught in, and enjoyed, both of those countries. Having to pay off student loans, I chose Korea as the more financially beneficial option with equal opportunity for cultural exploration. Whether the school in Korea offered airfare or not, both would offer the opportunity to experience Korean culture.

While I realize that you are probably being somewhat tongue-in-cheek, suffice it to say that I don't believe I would enjoy the culture and climate of Saudi Arabia. Additionally, at the time I probably wouldn't have qualified to work there.

I've read these forums enough to know that I shouldn't get into a debate with you, but for some reason I did. Cheers...

YTMND

Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:33 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Whether the school in Korea offered airfare or not, both would offer the opportunity to experience Korean culture.

Quote:

Unless the contract is offering a significantly better than average salary, I wouldn't advise anyone to take a job without airfare.

Yea, ok, I am not seeing how those two can co-exist. I understand you might want both, but if you want to experience the culture of a country you don't have to have a higher paying job or airfare.

Quote:

While I realize that you are probably being somewhat tongue-in-cheek

No, I am seriously wondering. If you start off saying you would only go to Korea if they gave airfare or a higher paying job in Korea, then I am going to read it that way. If you say instead you want the "opportunity to experience Korean culture" I am not going to include airfare as part of Korean culture. That's just me I guess Confused

Who's Your Daddy?

Joined: 30 May 2010
Location: Victoria, Canada.

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:53 pm Post subject:

They pay us more than Thailand because we get to "experience Korean culture."

Guajiro

Joined: 04 Dec 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:56 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

Quote:

Whether the school in Korea offered airfare or not, both would offer the opportunity to experience Korean culture.

Quote:

Unless the contract is offering a significantly better than average salary, I wouldn't advise anyone to take a job without airfare.

Yea, ok, I am not seeing how those two can co-exist. I understand you might want both, but if you want to experience the culture of a country you don't have to have a higher paying job or airfare.

Quote:

While I realize that you are probably being somewhat tongue-in-cheek

Maybe my post wasn't clear. Due to the desire to pay off student debt, I weighed Taiwan and Korea based on equal cultural value with the winner being the more lucrative option. I did not consider Saudi Arabia for various reasons.

As for the second point, comparing Korean contracts, it's quite simple. Job #1 has Korean culture, typical Korean salary, airfare and housing while Job #2 has Korean culture, typical Korean salary, housing and no airfare. In this hypothetical situation both jobs are in the same city, are with the same chain of reputable schools and provide equally positive references. In this case, it seems obvious to take the offer with airfare, does it not? Of course you can experience the culture without having the benefit of airfare included, but why would you unless you're independently wealthy? I fail to grasp your reasoning. If you got bumped up to first class would you decline because you aren't required to take it and you can experience the joys of turbulence just as well in economy?

warmachinenkorea

Joined: 12 Oct 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:05 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

Quote:

I really think you're looking for a fight.

Quote:

I have no siblings.

Quote:

Did you miss the part about my parents being crack addicts? Crack addict's have no money so I got grants and loans.

Quote:

They(Korea) offer air fare. No one is asking for it. It's part of the job. They want native speakers so they offer airfare, housing, and salary.

Quote:

I still have no idea where you're getting 3/4 of the stuff you're saying.

Do you have me mixed up with the OP? I'm an adult, I pay my bills. Never have and never will ask for handouts. I made a simple statement about credit cards. If you wanna talk to my face like this I'll pay your train ticket . I live 5 min from the train station in Gyeongsan.

Social services would step in?

What world do you live in? I've seen kids come to school(I was a SPED teacher in the States) dirty, bleeding, bruised, and I've seen a parent and child fight in front of a school. I've had more than one student threaten me with bodily harm while they were high themselves. And nothing was done to the parents or kids.

Social services take me from my parents just because they do/did drugs? You must be from another world.

YTMND

Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:38 pm Post subject:

Quote:

In this case, it seems obvious to take the offer with airfare, does it not?

I don't know what you are talking about. In the original post, it stated, "I recently accepted a position with a pubic school in Busan."

I didn't see anything about 2 jobs. I thought this was an across the board argument that EVERY job must come with airfare. The reality is that it doesn't.

Quote:

I made a simple statement about credit cards.

No, you talked about having crack addict parents. I don't want to get into this. Let's just move on.

Quote:

Social services would step in?

If you are under age, yes. This doesn't mean I am stating you are underage, I was talking about a hypothetical. If they didn't do it in your case, then that is an unfortunate past. Time to make a fortunate future.

warmachinenkorea

Joined: 12 Oct 2008

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject:

YTMND wrote:

Quote:

In this case, it seems obvious to take the offer with airfare, does it not?

Quote:

I made a simple statement about credit cards.

No, you talked about having crack addict parents. I don't want to get into this. Let's just move on.

Quote:

Social services would step in?

So My first comment was a simple statement about people wanting to get the charge off their credit card.

I was under age from 0-18. Social Services never, and many many times, did nothing.

You made a real big *beep* of yourself and painted yourself in a corner.

YTMND

Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Location: You're the man now dog!!

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:54 pm Post subject:

Quote:

So My first comment was a simple statement about people wanting to get the charge off their credit card.

You make monthly payments. That's how it is done. For example, you get a 2,000 dollar credit (about 1 month's salary). You fly to Korea on 75% of that or less (65-70). Then, you budget the rest until pay day. Don't take a job that pays after the 10th of the following month. Try to get them to pay you before the 5th.

Send half of whatever you get home to pay off the card. Budget the rest of the second month. You should have more to work with. Get pay the first week of the 3rd month for your 2nd month of work. You should now be in a position where you can pay off the credit card in full. Buy some new clothes, try out some fancy restaurants and Korean dishes, treat yourself. Then, go back to saving money for a couple more weeks. Chances are, if you meet Koreans, they will want to take you out to restaurants in exchange for helping them with their English. Seize the day.

By the 6th month, you will have saved up more than you need to spend and you should be getting at least 1.5 month's worth of pay because you will then be reimbursed for the flight money. Voila...you did this without saving a dime before you left US.

Quote:

I was under age from 0-18. Social Services never, and many many times, did nothing.

Because social services didn't help you, they shouldn't help others? That's a pretty mean spirit to carry around with you in life. While you are in Korea, make note of the all the freebie niceties Koreans will give you.

isitts

Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:40 am Post subject:

Could you guys stay on topic?

isitts

Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:45 am Post subject: Re: Flight reimbursement policy change?

JulieBethCO wrote:

I recently accepted a position with a pubic school in Busan. My recruiter seems to be straight forward; however, I was surprised he didn't mention that there was a policy change in flight reimbursement until now. He said now you must wait 6 months to be reimbursed.

Does anyone know of the policy change that occurred in February? Or is this a common policy?

Excerpt from his email:

"Previously, I informed you that once you have your ARC, the flight entrance allowance will be transferred into your Korean bank account. However, new policy has come into effect since February this year whereby you will only receive your flight entrance allowance once you have been here for a total of 6 months."

Um, I still get mine within a month. I did, however, notice that they changed when you can take your extra 14 days vacation at the end of your contract from "within two weeks of the completion of the contract" to "within six months of completion." So that was quite a difference. I'm with GEPIK, though. Not sure what EPIK's contract is like.

Guajiro

Joined: 04 Dec 2008

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:51 am Post subject: Re: Flight reimbursement policy change?

isitts wrote:

JulieBethCO wrote:

According to the EPIK website:

"Entrance Allowance
- Within the first month of the contract, all EPIK Teachers, regardless of level, will be provided with 1,300,000 KRW
of Entrance Allowance.
- To prevent early termination of contracts, the Entrance Allowance is issued as a form of a loan from the employer
to the EPIK Teachers. In the event that the contract is terminated within six (6) months of its implementation,
including renewal contracts, regardless of course or grounds, the EPIK Teachers will repay the above- mentioned
loan to the EPIK office immediately."

I guess it's possible that they haven't updated the website, or that Busan Metropolitan City Office of Education is doing things differently, but I would say it is definitely the norm to get the reimbursement or "entrance allowance" within the first month.

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