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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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 Posted: Thu May 03, 2012 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Patrick Bateman wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| radcon wrote: |
Why do universities in the States have Korean student unions, African American student unions, Latino student unions if they don't want these type of events to happen. In my experience these were the most racist people on campus.
The comments on that article were interesting. Many stated that the asians self segregated and are very cliquey. I also saw a lot of that in my college days.
This wasnt the first time white spectators chanted USA while playing another team made up of ethnic minorities. |
One could ask the same thing of NETs here. After all if a bunch of Koreans started chanting stuff at some foreigners here, they have only themselves to blame because the self-segregate and hang out at foreigner bars and parties. |
You don't see any difference that makes your comment completely inane? |
Yeah, to make it worse, unlike NETs here who ARE foreigners, those chants were being directed at American citizens.
What, if an all black team was playing, would it be okay to start throwing banana peels?
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| What has this got to do with race relations in the US? |
This is a Korean board, and some posters say that there was nothing wrong with those chants. Comparing it to something that might happen in Korea might enable one to see that yes, those chants were stupid and bigoted.
We have the thread on microaggression, and then we have acts like this. I think it all ties in with truly respecting people of different races and cultures and regarding them as equal human beings.
Sadly, many people back home seem to believe that they aren't prejudiced simply because they don't use racial slurs and have some minority friends. There's more to it than that.
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| Why do universities in the States have Korean student unions, African American student unions, Latino student unions if they don't want these type of events to happen |
The problem isn't that those unions exist, its the fact that if there was a "white student union" it would be labeled a radical hate group even if all they did was meet up and play Go Fish and eat hot dogs.
Thankfully, our school did have student unions for European kids and if anyone wanted to "get in touch with their roots" they were welcome to join.
I bet if there was an Irish Student Union anyone with as little as 1/16th Irish heritage would try to join that. |
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Patrick Bateman
Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Location: Lost in Translation
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| Posted: Thu May 03, 2012 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Steelrails"]
Yeah, to make it worse, unlike NETs here who ARE foreigners, those chants were being directed at American citizens.
What, if an all black team was playing, would it be okay to start throwing banana peels?
I'm not in any way defending the people that chanted "USA" so I don't see why you find it necessary to create another scenario.
But you are comparing a group of actual foreigners (NETs in Korea) to a group of citizens (Americans in America). I don't think that's a fair comparison.
| Steelrails wrote: |
The problem isn't that those unions exist, its the fact that if there was a "white student union" it would be labeled a radical hate group even if all they did was meet up and play Go Fish and eat hot dogs. |
So you admit that there is something inherently wrong with this system?
I didn't see anyone (yet) defending the action. You're raising a stink and clouding the issue. This may be a Korean board, but not every thread has to be derailed into a NET's vs. Korea kind of argument. Believe it or not, we can have conversations where neither are mentioned. Gasp. |
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luckylady
Joined: 30 Jan 2012
Location: u.s. of occupied territories
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 12:50 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| atwood wrote: |
| bigverne wrote: |
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| Because that is who we are: we are Asian-Americans. |
Not simply, Americans? |
Excellent question. |
Yes it is.
Please explain why the chants of USA! USA! occurred? What possible reason was there for those chants? |
it's very common at ALL American sporting events - professional, community, college, etc. it's just a chant is all that the crowd hypes itself up with.
the proper thing to do is for the teams to keep playing and get on with the game already. |
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The Sultan of Seoul
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Location: right... behind.. YOU
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 8:09 am Post subject: |
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If there were a 'White American Student' club / group / union, I wonder what they would do at meetings...? How would they celebrate their culture? what foods would they eat? What 'traditional' activities would they do...?
I agree though, if the others have their groups, anyone starting a white student union should have the right to do so. |
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luckylady
Joined: 30 Jan 2012
Location: u.s. of occupied territories
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
| If there were a 'White American Student' club / group / union, I wonder what they would do at meetings...? How would they celebrate their culture? what foods would they eat? What 'traditional' activities would they do...? |
talk about how threatened they are by the other groups then practice invading those very same student groups? take over their spaces?
as for foods, maybe add catsup to it and rename it ? |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
If there were a 'White American Student' club / group / union, I wonder what they would do at meetings...? How would they celebrate their culture? what foods would they eat? What 'traditional' activities would they do...?
I agree though, if the others have their groups, anyone starting a white student union should have the right to do so. |
I think that a "White" student union would read the US Constitution over and over. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| it's very common at ALL American sporting events - professional, community, college, etc. it's just a chant is all that the crowd hypes itself up with. |
Very common when Team America plays another country in international sports.
But you don't really hear it at a Vikings-Packers game.
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| So you admit that there is something inherently wrong with this system? |
Absolutely.
It's a shame that not all people can have an ethnic student union. It's also a shame that people are so narrow minded that they can't accept that it's possible for someone to be part of an ethnic student union and still consider themselves part of the greater whole.
The underlying problem is still this- Asian-American, Indian-American, and Arab-American students especially were somehow not considered American, for what reason? |
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ghostrider
Joined: 27 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
If there were a 'White American Student' club / group / union, I wonder what they would do at meetings...? How would they celebrate their culture? what foods would they eat? What 'traditional' activities would they do...?
I agree though, if the others have their groups, anyone starting a white student union should have the right to do so. |
"White" is a very loaded term and has a history of being used in racist contexts such as restaurants that hung signs that read "Whites Only." It would be better to use a term that is more free of negative connotations such as "European American." |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| The underlying problem is still this- Asian-American, Indian-American, and Arab-American students especially were somehow not considered American, for what reason? |
Because they were part of a team that was comprised of pretty much them and no one else? Maybe a lot of those people chanting genuinely thought it was an international team and not a fellow American team. Then again, Emory apparently has a healthy number of 'Asian / Pacific Islander' and 'Other' students, sitting at 20% and 10% respectively, so maybe those Betas really were just dicks.
| ghostrider wrote: |
| "White" is a very loaded term and has a history of being used in racist contexts such as restaurants that hung signs that read "Whites Only." It would be better to use a term that is more free of negative connotations such as "European American." |
What do you say to the black and hispanic student unions? |
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metalhead
Joined: 18 May 2010
Location: Toilet
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 12:08 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| The underlying problem is still this- Asian-American, Indian-American, and Arab-American students especially were somehow not considered American, for what reason? |
Because they only socialise with other members of their race, in general? I thought this was already mentioned.
As for your comment about foreigners just hanging out at foreigner bars in Korea, do you think not being allowed into Korean clubs has anything to do with it? Do most foreigners here speak Korean? Do most ethnicities studying at a tertiary institution in the States speak English, yet distance themselves from white people as much as they can? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Because they were part of a team that was comprised of pretty much them and no one else? |
And the Betas were a rainbow mosaic of diversity?
And how do you know that the people on that volleyball team only hang out with Asians? Maybe some members have friends of other races? Maybe some have a predominantly Asian group they sometimes chill and drink with and they have a more diverse group that they party with?
| Quote: |
| Because they only socialise with other members of their race, in general? I thought this was already mentioned. |
As opposed to white frat boys who are part of some multiracial model of diversity?
When white people only hang out with other white people do they lose their "Americanness?" Should we consider them more "European-Americans"? Would a predominantly Irish or Italian-American frat get chants of "USA" and be told that they don't integrate enough?
I mean, would you look at an all white table at Emory and think "Look at those white folks, always sticking to themselves".
| Quote: |
| As for your comment about foreigners just hanging out at foreigner bars in Korea, do you think not being allowed into Korean clubs has anything to do with it? |
Sorry, but foreigners are allowed into 99% of bars in Korea. Foreigners can go into pretty much any bar in any of area of Seoul and get the same bar experience.
Clubs might be a bit different, but bars are bars.
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| Do most foreigners here speak Korean? |
Are they even trying to learn?
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| Do most ethnicities studying at a tertiary institution in the States speak English, yet distance themselves from white people as much as they can? |
I'd say some students who study abroad stay closely linked to other students of their heritage, while others join more diverse scenes.
But the underlying issue is what makes them un-American. It can't be because they only hang out with people that look like themselves. White people do that and they aren't considered un-American or told to integrate more. What makes them un-American? How they look. You take a volleyball team of a bunch of Irish-American kids from South Boston and those "USA" chants don't happen. |
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metalhead
Joined: 18 May 2010
Location: Toilet
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 5:00 am Post subject: |
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I'm not getting into a quote-fest with you, but it was mentioned in the comments on the site by other students that the Asians hang out with other Asians.
As for Korean bars, you're right, foreigners can go to most of them; on a personal level, I do not like them though, as I tend to find them boring, overpriced and opportunities for socialising are not what they are at a 'foreigner' bar. Chalk that up to cultural differences then.
Why indeed would someone who is short-term in Korea put a lot of effort into learning the language? I suspect usefulness of Korean once one leaves Korea may be part of it. If, however, someone intends to live in Korea for a long period, or marries a Korean, yes then I think they should learn Korean. Still very different to the situation of Asians born in America that speak fluent English yet only hang out in groups comprised of other Asians.
As for your last comment, I am sure you realise that American culture comes from European culture, therefore white culture, so of course white Americans are not going to look un-American, so yes, they are un-American because they are not white and because they distance themselves from white people. By the same token, we can say that people of a non-Korean ethnicity in Korea are un-Korean, even if they were born in Korea. Perhaps not fair but it appears to be a majority opinion. But this is a Korean message board, so why not ask a Korean? When your average Korean thinks of America, which race do they associate with America? |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 9:33 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Because they were part of a team that was comprised of pretty much them and no one else? |
And the Betas were a rainbow mosaic of diversity?
And how do you know that the people on that volleyball team only hang out with Asians? Maybe some members have friends of other races? Maybe some have a predominantly Asian group they sometimes chill and drink with and they have a more diverse group that they party with? |
You're being oversensitive. I wasn't criticizing the Asians for not being diverse in their team composition; I was offering an explanation for why the chanters may have assumed the team wasn't American.
Nationally, whites make up ~75% of the population while Asians (Indians included here) make up only ~5%, and the demographics for the school itself are posted above. It's not much of a stretch at all to think that some people in the stands looked at the opposing team and thought that they were exchange students rather than native-born.
And before you counter with another 'what if,' I already admitted that the Betas may have simply been jackasses. It certainly wouldn't be the first time a group of frat guys did something that pissed a lot of people off. |
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madoka
Joined: 27 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="geldedgoat"]Maybe a lot of those people chanting genuinely thought it was an international team and not a fellow American team. [quote]
It was an intramural volleyball game; the operative word being intramural, not international.
Not to mention taunts against the Asian-American students to "learn English" and "speak English" such as this reported exchange:
Beta fans: USA! USA!
KUSA team member: I was born in New York!
Beta fans: Speak English!
Everyone understands the implication of the USA in this context, just like a couple months ago at a high school basketball game:
A Texas school district has apologized for what some perceived as a racist chant from fans after one of its teams beat a rival in a high school basketball playoff game.
Alamo Heights High School, which is made up mostly of white students, beat Edison High, which is predominantly Hispanic, in the Region IV-4A championship in San Antonio on Saturday. As Alamo players celebrated the win on the court, a large group of students began cheering �USA! USA!� |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| madoka wrote: |
| It was an intramural volleyball game; the operative word being intramural, not international. |
That doesn't mean much. International students regularly compete in intramural games in universities around the country (and, I imagine, around the world). The Indian exchange students at the university I attended always seemed to find each other in time for intramural soccer and badminton (I would say cricket, too, but I don't recall anyone other than them getting involved).
| Quote: |
Not to mention taunts against the Asian-American students to "learn English" and "speak English" such as this reported exchange:
Beta fans: USA! USA!
KUSA team member: I was born in New York!
Beta fans: Speak English! |
That wasn't in the article (but, again, it wouldn't surprise me to find a frat doing something like that). |
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