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The Sultan of Seoul
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Location: right... behind.. YOU
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 Posted: Tue May 08, 2012 9:44 pm Post subject: |
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1. Her accent was West Indies.
2. Personally I like the fact that in Shanghai and Seoul if I'm pissed I can unzip and take a leak by the side of the street, down an alley or drain etc withoutit being a big deal. Some people are culturally oversensitive. We are only human.
3. They have tried anti smoking / spitting campaigns in Seoul before and they always fail, due to the main culpruits being middle aged men whom no traffic cop or kid on his millitary service is going to try telling htem what to do.
Can you imagine it? 22 year old goes up to an adjoishi (not gonna happen) driving a lexus and spitting out the window and asks him to put out his fag and stop spitting out the window.
Aigo! Will not work. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2012 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
| Personally I like the fact that in Shanghai and Seoul if I'm pissed I can unzip and take a leak by the side of the street, down an alley or drain etc . |
You sound charming. I've often thought that the people who feel most comfortable in Korea, and least bothered by the vulgarity of certain aspects of Korean culture, are people who are themselves very rough around the edges. For the rest of us, not raised in barns, we will continue to be less than amused. But don't let us stop you. Carry on with your public urinating and horking. You're fitting in just fine. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2012 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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| fermentation wrote: |
| In related news, Seoul is initiating a crack down on spitting and cigarette littering. Personally not happy about it. |
Why in heaven's name would you object to a ban on spitting and littering?
Who are you people? Where are you getting your values from? |
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The Sultan of Seoul
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Location: right... behind.. YOU
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| Posted: Tue May 08, 2012 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Scorpion wrote: |
| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
| Personally I like the fact that in Shanghai and Seoul if I'm pissed I can unzip and take a leak by the side of the street, down an alley or drain etc . |
You sound charming. I've often thought that the people who feel most comfortable in Korea, and least bothered by the vulgarity of certain aspects of Korean culture, are people who are themselves very rough around the edges. For the rest of us, not raised in barns, we will continue to be less than amused. But don't let us stop you. Carry on with your public urinating and horking. You're fitting in just fine. |
I'd do the same in London; as does the lawyer, physicist and dentist I usually hang out with there. 
I know some posters on this forum live in a land where every one acts like a prep school prince and is constantly having amiable debates about Nietzche over crepes and passionate discussions about Kafka in 'bookaccino' coffee shops etc, whilst being mild mannered and not drinking, smoking or gambling, but some of us (and more than likely, the intellectual / artist you're discussing) manage to do ALL OF those things from time to time AND take a leak down an alleyway if there is no public restroom around and we are bursting. And if we encounter someone doing the same we think 'meh human nature, harmless' and get over it in aprox 1.2 gazilli-seconds.
And the world continues to turn! Not like we're pissing through somebody's letter box or in a mall.
It's amazing how non black and white the world can be at times eh? |
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byrddogs
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 2:33 am Post subject: |
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The spitting doesn't bother me in the least. I don't walk around barefooted while outside and I don't wear shoes in my house. Problem solved, as far as I'm concerned.
@TSoS, I agree with you on the taking a leak thing. BUT, Shanghainese men take that to the extreme (Korean adjossis aren't much better). Just this morning on the way to catch my bus there was some dude taking a whiz pretty darn close to the front door of the police station that I pass on the way. |
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fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:01 am Post subject: |
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| Scorpion wrote: |
Why in heaven's name would you object to a ban on spitting and littering?
Who are you people? Where are you getting your values from? |
1. It seems like waste of government power to enforce people from stop doing something trivial as littering and spitting. Not everybody thinks those two things are so heinous that you need to have the government involved. Mind you, I don't like it when people do either although it depends where you spit.
2. There's a lack of trashcans that needs to be addressed first.
3. Yeah, I can kinda get the not throwing away used cigs part but I like I mentioned, there's not many places to throw them away. I don't smoke but I don't think it'll be pleasant to keep them in your pockets. As for the spitting, what if some thing gets in my mouth? Have you breathed the air in Seoul?
4. This being Korea, this "crack down" will amount to very little. But I take issue with my government enacting policies and passing bills that increases it's power, yet nobody really objects to it because they know it's gonna be half-assed anyway. I object to enacting shit that amounts to nothing. Even if they did enforce this, do I want to live in a society where there are cops lurking at every corner checking for people who spit?
5. Passing laws and government enforcement does little to change things. Look at the affect the myriad of government campaigns have on Korean manners and walking on the right. It's an ingrained cultural issue that needs to be changed via education and awareness over time, rather than a half-assed top down approach these politicians love.
6. My values come from thinking about shit. |
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yodanole
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: La Florida
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sure you're what Little Lord Fautleroy was expected to become.
| Scorpion wrote: |
| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
| Personally I like the fact that in Shanghai and Seoul if I'm pissed I can unzip and take a leak by the side of the street, down an alley or drain etc . |
You sound charming. I've often thought that the people who feel most comfortable in Korea, and least bothered by the vulgarity of certain aspects of Korean culture, are people who are themselves very rough around the edges. For the rest of us, not raised in barns, we will continue to be less than amused. But don't let us stop you. Carry on with your public urinating and horking. You're fitting in just fine. |
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transmogrifier
Joined: 02 Jan 2012
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Having been away for over three years and coming back, the spitting seems to be a lot more common than I remember. It's pretty gross. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
3. They have tried anti smoking / spitting campaigns in Seoul before and they always fail, due to the main culpruits being middle aged men whom no traffic cop or kid on his millitary service is going to try telling htem what to do.
Can you imagine it? 22 year old goes up to an adjoishi (not gonna happen) driving a lexus and spitting out the window and asks him to put out his fag and stop spitting out the window.
Aigo! Will not work. |
Wow I guess those occasional traffic checks where they check for drunk drivers and arrest them must be just for show. They must have telepathically known that I'd be there just then.
http://www.totaldui.com/blog/korea-sorts-out-dui-laws/ |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| People shouldn't need laws to tell them that they shouldn't spit, litter or urinate in public. They should have learned these things in childhood. Most do, and the laws aren't directed at them. They don't refrain from doing foul things out of fear of being fined. They refrain from them because they are foul. It's only because of mannerless scofflaws that we need to have these laws. Unfortunately this thread shows that they are direly needed. |
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fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Scorpion wrote: |
| People shouldn't need laws to tell them that they shouldn't spit, litter or urinate in public. They should have learned these things in childhood. Most do, and the laws aren't directed at them. They don't refrain from doing foul things out of fear of being fined. They refrain from them because they are foul. It's only because of mannerless scofflaws that we need to have these laws. Unfortunately this thread shows that they are direly needed. |
You need laws to enforce manners? Should you be fined if you chew with your mouth open or don't say excuse me if you bump into someone? |
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Patrick Bateman
Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Location: Lost in Translation
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| fermentation wrote: |
You need laws to enforce manners? Should you be fined if you chew with your mouth open or don't say excuse me if you bump into someone? |
As much as I dislike spitting on the sidewalk and the like, I don't think it's the government's job/business/right to go around being nannies.
On the other hand, I do think that there should be laws regarding littering. That is not just a matter of manners.
But in order for littering laws to be effective/justified, the number of public waste-bins would have to be increased. |
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The Sultan of Seoul
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Location: right... behind.. YOU
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| The Sultan of Seoul wrote: |
3. They have tried anti smoking / spitting campaigns in Seoul before and they always fail, due to the main culpruits being middle aged men whom no traffic cop or kid on his millitary service is going to try telling htem what to do.
Can you imagine it? 22 year old goes up to an adjoishi (not gonna happen) driving a lexus and spitting out the window and asks him to put out his fag and stop spitting out the window.
Aigo! Will not work. |
Wow I guess those occasional traffic checks where they check for drunk drivers and arrest them must be just for show. They must have telepathically known that I'd be there just then.
http://www.totaldui.com/blog/korea-sorts-out-dui-laws/ |
I specifically only mentioned spitting and smoking. You fail. Again. |
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komerican
Joined: 17 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| byrddogs wrote: |
| komerican wrote: |
| I don't like spitting but that's better than all the millions of dogs pissing and pooping outside in the West. Pets should only be for farms and places with wide open rural areas, not for the city or crowded suburban parks. It's better for the animal too. |
Hmmm....I disagree with pets only living in the areas mentioned. It's not too difficult to pick up after your dog. I seem to remember lots of dog owners in Seoul just letting their dog do their business anywhere without cleaning up afterwards. Pissing is one thing (although it isn't so cool to let them do that near front doors and on people's cars/scooters/bikes). There isn't much one can do to clean that, but the lack of picking up poop thing is a no-no in the city. That happens quite a bit here in Shanghai as well. |
Spitting is truly disgusting. I'm just asking why aren't people equally disgusted with dogs doing their business in the open. A lot of parks in the West are used as bathrooms for pets! I'm equally disgusted by spitting and dogs urinating in parks and sidewalks. I don't get how people can be disgusted with the former and not the later!
| Scorpion wrote: |
| komerican wrote: |
| I don't like spitting but that's better than all the millions of dogs pissing and pooping outside in the West. Pets should only be for farms and places with wide open rural areas, not for the city or crowded suburban parks. It's better for the animal too. |
1. People who don't pick up after their pets are disgusting. They have my contempt. No fine is large enough
2. Having said that. It is not unreasonable for animals to deposit bodily fluids in public. They are, after all, only animals! I do, however, hold humans to a higher standard. Spitting on the street is animal behavior and it's revolting. Even dogs don't make the horrid sounds that Korean men do before they make their deposit.
Bodily fluids do not belong on the street. The sooner Koreans realize this the better for all involved. |
How is it really that different? Why aren't you equally disgusted by a dog peeing on your lawn as a human spitting? If you hold humans to a higher standard then how about holding those human pet owners also to a higher standard? How about not owning large pets in urban and crowded suburban settings?
Keep in mind Scorpion that having pets in such large numbers in society is a relatively new cultural phenomenon brought on by the rise of a middle class. Before that dogs were mostly owned for utilitarian reasons. Dogs would be much happier in rural areas with enough space for them to run without a leash. And if we had less pets we would certainly cut down on the millions of dogs that are killed each year in animal shelters. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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I think I made it clear that I'm disgusted by both. The human owner of the dog is disgusting, and the person who spits in public is disgusting. The difference is that the dog is a dumb animal. Yet even it doesn't go out of its way to add sound effects to its unpleasant act. The person loudly (and disgustingly) coughing up his lung before tossing it onto the sidewalk does. We're supposed to be the more highly evolved species for christ's sake, Why are some of us still behaving like farm animals.
If you want to spit, litter and urinate indiscriminately you are free to do so within the confines of your home. Go to town lads. That is your space. (What's that? You're saying you'd never do that because it's gross?) Yet the public sphere belongs to everyone. It's not yours to abuse. You are not permitted to litter, spit, or urinate on other peoples property. To do so shows disrespect for others.
I simply can't believe I have to explain this to university graduates.  |
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