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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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 Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| My school in America had better looking food than that, and we had the choice to get a salad, along with a choice to get papa-johns or chick-filet everyday. Most of the normal stuff wasn't terrible, and some was good. The thing, to me, about the Korean school lunches was the lack of variety. I liked most of it for the most part, but the boringness of eating the same things everyday got to me. That was where the American lunches were better, it was a much wider variety of foods, plus everyday there were several choices to pick from instead of just the same thing for everyone. |
This sounds more like the problem than the solution. Fast food really, really shouldn't be in schools for a host of reasons. |
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Hokie21
Joined: 01 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Those Korean lunches look pretty nasty. All my students complain about the "dirty kimchi" and "dirty rice" they have to eat for school lunch. The Italian and French meals looked good though. |
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Hokie21 wrote: |
| Those Korean lunches look pretty nasty. All my students complain about the "dirty kimchi" and "dirty rice" they have to eat for school lunch. The Italian and French meals looked good though. |
That doesn't sound quite right. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| My school in America had better looking food than that, and we had the choice to get a salad, along with a choice to get papa-johns or chick-filet everyday. Most of the normal stuff wasn't terrible, and some was good. The thing, to me, about the Korean school lunches was the lack of variety. I liked most of it for the most part, but the boringness of eating the same things everyday got to me. That was where the American lunches were better, it was a much wider variety of foods, plus everyday there were several choices to pick from instead of just the same thing for everyone. |
| Quote: |
| There's also the fact that Korean food is flavorless and lacking in complexity and variety. |
As opposed to American school lunches?
This debate was on a thread a while back and I actually broke it down comparing a Korean school menu to a typical American one. The Korean one had a significantly greater variety of meats, vegetables, fruits, grains, and sauces. If you looked at it chromatically, the overwhelming majority of foods served were either yellow or brown in color. The one green vegetable of broccoli was drowned in velveeta. In fact for multiple meals they were vegetableless with either potatoes or corn counting as the vegetable.
Now I'd be willing to bet the European school menus would kick the Korean menu's butt.
Also an Iceberg Lettuce salad drowned in ranch dressing and a McChicken sandwich is not a nutritious meal. And getting to choose between Chick-Fil-A and pizza is worse variety than the Korean menu. THAT would be a tastebud death sentence. Seriously, how can one say they had greater variety when their two choices were pizza or Fried chicken sandwiches and french fries?
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| Before food is eaten, it's looked at. Kids are pickier than adults and if it doesn't look appetizing, most of the time they'll just not touch it. Which makes it a wasteful experience. |
Yes, but kids tend not to care if something is served in styrofoam or a paper wrapper. They look at the food, not whether or not the place has cloth napkins and engraved cutlery. In fact if its too nice, kids probably would be uncomfortable. Unless I'm mistaken and kids would rather dine at Le Earle than McDonald's.
And no, putting the Monsters Inc crew on a handcrafted box-pack of the most delicious vegetables in the world wouldn't make a hoot of difference vs. one slice of greasy-cooked by a 19 year old-heat lamp pizza served on a styrofoam plate.
So instead of the unaesthetically pleasing option of metal I should get the fine dining ware of industrial plastic? Or should we give a bunch of six year olds ceramic plates and crystal glassware? It's a school and it's kids
Or you could institute a policy that the kids MUST finish their meal in order to leave and go to recess and have their teacher watch them to make sure they do it.
That being said and all, those meals from Europe looked darn good. Couscous! |
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motiontodismiss
Joined: 18 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
As opposed to American school lunches?
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I never said American school lunches are better. And what I was talking about was flavor. Most Korean dishes have boring flavor profiles.
| Steelrails wrote: |
Or you could institute a policy that the kids MUST finish their meal in order to leave and go to recess and have their teacher watch them to make sure they do it. |
This only encourages behavior that increases the likelihood of obesity. Children should be trained to eat until they're satisfied, and ONLY until they're satisfied and not a bite more. The "finish your meal" type policies only encourage overeating. And ramming your horrible cooking down your kids' throats only perpetuates their preference for McDonald's (believe it or not, healthy food can be made to taste good).
| Steelrails wrote: |
That being said and all, those meals from Europe looked darn good. Couscous! |
+1 |
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wishfullthinkng
Joined: 05 Mar 2010
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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| motiontodismiss wrote: |
Children should be trained to eat until they're satisfied, and ONLY until they're satisfied and not a bite more. The "finish your meal" type policies only encourage overeating. And ramming your horrible cooking down your kids' throats only perpetuates their preference for McDonald's (believe it or not, healthy food can be made to taste good).
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no. this is called gluttony.
children should be given the standard caloric value that their bodies needs depending on their age and how active they are, and not a calorie more. maybe they will feel hungry still at first, but they will eventually get used to it and maybe, just maybe, it will promote proper eating in their futures. |
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warmachinenkorea
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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My HS back in The States had 3 lines to choose from, hamburger line, pizza line, and the choice line. The choice line would have pasta, burritos, chicken nuggets, etc... It could have been better but when you're a teenage athlete then you are eating all day everyday and it doesn't matter. The problem is so many kids are inactive that it matters a lot today.
It all depends on your school nutritionalist. If you have a good one then the meals will be as balanced as he/she can make them. If it's anything like the school I worked at before coming to Korea it will be carbs all day long.
That being said I don't think Korea wins this one. Some of the other countries didn't seem too bad.
As far as aesthetics go when was the last time you were in a cafeteria in your home country? Kids don't care. I took a field trip to the Daegu American School with my Korean students and at lunch time it's all about socializing. You could give a kid a rock on their plate and they would shovel it in their mouth while gabbing to their friend. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Leon wrote: |
| My school in America had better looking food than that, and we had the choice to get a salad, along with a choice to get papa-johns or chick-filet everyday. Most of the normal stuff wasn't terrible, and some was good. The thing, to me, about the Korean school lunches was the lack of variety. I liked most of it for the most part, but the boringness of eating the same things everyday got to me. That was where the American lunches were better, it was a much wider variety of foods, plus everyday there were several choices to pick from instead of just the same thing for everyone. |
| Quote: |
| There's also the fact that Korean food is flavorless and lacking in complexity and variety. |
As opposed to American school lunches?
This debate was on a thread a while back and I actually broke it down comparing a Korean school menu to a typical American one. The Korean one had a significantly greater variety of meats, vegetables, fruits, grains, and sauces. If you looked at it chromatically, the overwhelming majority of foods served were either yellow or brown in color. The one green vegetable of broccoli was drowned in velveeta. In fact for multiple meals they were vegetableless with either potatoes or corn counting as the vegetable.
Now I'd be willing to bet the European school menus would kick the Korean menu's butt.
Also an Iceberg Lettuce salad drowned in ranch dressing and a McChicken sandwich is not a nutritious meal. And getting to choose between Chick-Fil-A and pizza is worse variety than the Korean menu. THAT would be a tastebud death sentence. Seriously, how can one say they had greater variety when their two choices were pizza or Fried chicken sandwiches and french fries?
| Quote: |
| Before food is eaten, it's looked at. Kids are pickier than adults and if it doesn't look appetizing, most of the time they'll just not touch it. Which makes it a wasteful experience. |
Yes, but kids tend not to care if something is served in styrofoam or a paper wrapper. They look at the food, not whether or not the place has cloth napkins and engraved cutlery. In fact if its too nice, kids probably would be uncomfortable. Unless I'm mistaken and kids would rather dine at Le Earle than McDonald's.
And no, putting the Monsters Inc crew on a handcrafted box-pack of the most delicious vegetables in the world wouldn't make a hoot of difference vs. one slice of greasy-cooked by a 19 year old-heat lamp pizza served on a styrofoam plate.
So instead of the unaesthetically pleasing option of metal I should get the fine dining ware of industrial plastic? Or should we give a bunch of six year olds ceramic plates and crystal glassware? It's a school and it's kids
Or you could institute a policy that the kids MUST finish their meal in order to leave and go to recess and have their teacher watch them to make sure they do it.
That being said and all, those meals from Europe looked darn good. Couscous! |
I think perhaps you misunderstood what I wrote. At my school, everyday you were free to choose from a salad bar, papa johns, chic- filet, along with at least two different choices of entrees, along with a variety of different choices in regards to sides and vegetables. Compared with a Korean meal where everyone eats the same thing, it is a lot of variety. Granted, this was in high school, in middle school and elementary school the pizza, chic-filet, salad option wasn't available. The chic fillet sandwiches were provided by the Chic-filet restaurant, which I'm sure every American from the south knows of, and not the school, and were far tastier than any Korean school lunch. Was any of it great, no, but I would choose it over a Korean lunch, where you get a soup, rice, kimchi and some meat and vegtables- usually covered in some gochujang, every day. As far as health goes, the Korean was probably healthier in most ways, but when I was a kid I didn't really care too much and was physically active enough that it didn't matter much one way or another. |
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motiontodismiss
Joined: 18 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 12:19 am Post subject: |
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| wishfullthinkng wrote: |
| motiontodismiss wrote: |
Children should be trained to eat until they're satisfied, and ONLY until they're satisfied and not a bite more. The "finish your meal" type policies only encourage overeating. And ramming your horrible cooking down your kids' throats only perpetuates their preference for McDonald's (believe it or not, healthy food can be made to taste good).
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no. this is called gluttony.
children should be given the standard caloric value that their bodies needs depending on their age and how active they are, and not a calorie more. maybe they will feel hungry still at first, but they will eventually get used to it and maybe, just maybe, it will promote proper eating in their futures. |
The problem is that the standard caloric value tends to vary wildly based on their activity level, weight, and other factors. One of the more dependable metrics seems to be "when you're satiated". |
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JustinC
Joined: 10 Mar 2012
Location: We Are The World!
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 4:04 am Post subject: |
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I thought the Chinese meal looked the best but is preposterous - there's no way in HELL that Chinese kids get a whole fish for lunch. When I taught there it was rice, soup, vegetables and bones (with a little meat hanging off).
And the UK lunch looks ridiculous too. I never ate school meals - always preferred to take in my own - but that picture is not a typical school meal in the UK. Where are the fries, greasy pizza, turkey twizzlers and dry burgers?
The Italian and Singaporean dishes look the most appetizing, especially the part The majority of Italian schools serve lunches made from organic ingredients, mostly grown nearby. With the freshest ingredients what's not to like? |
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littlelisa
Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 5:30 am Post subject: |
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| JustinC wrote: |
I thought the Chinese meal looked the best but is preposterous - there's no way in HELL that Chinese kids get a whole fish for lunch. When I taught there it was rice, soup, vegetables and bones (with a little meat hanging off).
And the UK lunch looks ridiculous too. I never ate school meals - always preferred to take in my own - but that picture is not a typical school meal in the UK. Where are the fries, greasy pizza, turkey twizzlers and dry burgers?
The Italian and Singaporean dishes look the most appetizing, especially the part The majority of Italian schools serve lunches made from organic ingredients, mostly grown nearby. With the freshest ingredients what's not to like? |
The part about the Italian lunches being mostly organic and grown nearby is true. Italian lunches are amazing. I did a summer course in a high school in Italy once and the food was amazing, especially all the fruits and veggies! |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| The chic fillet sandwiches were provided by the Chic-filet restaurant, which I'm sure every American from the south knows of, and not the school, and were far tastier than any Korean school lunch.Was any of it great, no, but I would choose it over a Korean lunch, where you get a soup, rice, kimchi and some meat and vegtables. as any of it great, no, but I would choose it over a Korean lunch, where you get a soup, rice, kimchi and some meat and vegtables- usually covered in some gochujang, every day. |
We should do the Dr. Salisbury experiment with that one. Feed a Chic-Fil-A sandwich and a 20 oz Coke. for lunch everyday to a bunch of kids for 80 days and then see what happens to their health. Then feed those same kids a Korean meal and see what happens.
I guess it all depends on what kind of person you are. Would you be think "YES, that's what I want to eat" over a bowl of spinach, a piece of fish, and some couscous, maybe with some barley tea or would you rather have a Chic-Fil-a sandwich, some fries, and a coke?
Someone I know actually said he refused to eat Korean food because he only ate "good food". The dude ate pizza or fast food 7days a week. He also came down with multiple GI and colon conditions while here.
Now I have met some types who only eat "good food" and wouldn't touch Korean food usually. They eat organic, no empty carbs, possibly vegan, no added salt, no deep-fried in heavy oil, and so on. Those people have a point. There's a lot of junk these days in Korean food and I think Korean lunches need reform.
Reduce servings of spiced food no more than 3 days a week in schools. Greatly reduce the salt in the soups. Stop white rice (more millet please). Some of the mixed side dishes are processed and sugared/salted. Mandate 1 green vegetable each day. When it comes to noodles, use buckwheat or whole wheat.
America needs a complete overhaul though. First, is the mindset- Don't eat until you feel stuffed. Differentiate between what tastes good and what is good for you. Understand what a real vegetable is- (corn, potatoes, reduction in starchy vegetables, not drowning vegetables in butter/cheese, greatly reducing processed/sugared/salted/cheesed/heavy sauced foods. Understanding that meat does not have to the focus of a meal (especially a salad) and can be a small side/complimentary item. Getting kids on a semi-standard menu and seeing that they stick to it. De-corporatizing school lunch. Get people used to smaller servings of soda and treating soda as a dessert, not a beverage. Treating certain foods like pizza as occasional foods to be eaten as a treat, not food staples. Overall de-yellowing the food and making it more green. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
| The chic fillet sandwiches were provided by the Chic-filet restaurant, which I'm sure every American from the south knows of, and not the school, and were far tastier than any Korean school lunch.Was any of it great, no, but I would choose it over a Korean lunch, where you get a soup, rice, kimchi and some meat and vegtables. as any of it great, no, but I would choose it over a Korean lunch, where you get a soup, rice, kimchi and some meat and vegtables- usually covered in some gochujang, every day. |
We should do the Dr. Salisbury experiment with that one. Feed a Chic-Fil-A sandwich and a 20 oz Coke. for lunch everyday to a bunch of kids for 80 days and then see what happens to their health. Then feed those same kids a Korean meal and see what happens.
I guess it all depends on what kind of person you are. Would you be think "YES, that's what I want to eat" over a bowl of spinach, a piece of fish, and some couscous, maybe with some barley tea or would you rather have a Chic-Fil-a sandwich, some fries, and a coke?
Someone I know actually said he refused to eat Korean food because he only ate "good food". The dude ate pizza or fast food 7days a week. He also came down with multiple GI and colon conditions while here.
Now I have met some types who only eat "good food" and wouldn't touch Korean food usually. They eat organic, no empty carbs, possibly vegan, no added salt, no deep-fried in heavy oil, and so on. Those people have a point. There's a lot of junk these days in Korean food and I think Korean lunches need reform.
Reduce servings of spiced food no more than 3 days a week in schools. Greatly reduce the salt in the soups. Stop white rice (more millet please). Some of the mixed side dishes are processed and sugared/salted. Mandate 1 green vegetable each day. When it comes to noodles, use buckwheat or whole wheat.
America needs a complete overhaul though. First, is the mindset- Don't eat until you feel stuffed. Differentiate between what tastes good and what is good for you. Understand what a real vegetable is- (corn, potatoes, reduction in starchy vegetables, not drowning vegetables in butter/cheese, greatly reducing processed/sugared/salted/cheesed/heavy sauced foods. Understanding that meat does not have to the focus of a meal (especially a salad) and can be a small side/complimentary item. Getting kids on a semi-standard menu and seeing that they stick to it. De-corporatizing school lunch. Get people used to smaller servings of soda and treating soda as a dessert, not a beverage. Treating certain foods like pizza as occasional foods to be eaten as a treat, not food staples. Overall de-yellowing the food and making it more green. |
Again, it was just one of the options. Very, very few people ate the pizza or chic-fil-a option every single day. I think it's part of a more communal mindset, where the meal is shared and everyone eats the same thing. There are some Korean foods that I dislike, and when I saw those for lunch I had no option but to eat those things. I'm just saying options are great, variety makes life, and lunch, interesting. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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It would be nice in middle school and up to see a line of several choices- Rice dish or soup or noodle dish. One with pork, one with seafood, and one with chicken. (Well, beef and vegetarian options would be ideal, but there is that budget thing). That and a buffet of vegetables wouldn't be a bad choice. I could get my Korean spinach every day.
For elementary school it probably isn't practicable, but I can see it in bigger schools.
Watch, sadly they'll expand the choices but bring in Lotteria or some KimBap joint that will sell the kids corn syruped ddukbokki or Sweet and Sour Deep Fried Pork. |
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motiontodismiss
Joined: 18 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
It would be nice in middle school and up to see a line of several choices- Rice dish or soup or noodle dish. One with pork, one with seafood, and one with chicken. (Well, beef and vegetarian options would be ideal, but there is that budget thing). That and a buffet of vegetables wouldn't be a bad choice. I could get my Korean spinach every day.
For elementary school it probably isn't practicable, but I can see it in bigger schools.
Watch, sadly they'll expand the choices but bring in Lotteria or some KimBap joint that will sell the kids corn syruped ddukbokki or Sweet and Sour Deep Fried Pork. |
For middle school and up, cafeteria-style is the way to go. Let them make their own choices. If the school itself is too small to do that, maybe cooperate with neighboring school districts so they could build a communal cafeteria.
In my high school with 550 students and 70 faculty, we had a cafeteria that served 2-3 entrees every day, a cereal bar, pasta bar, salad bar, and a place where you could make toast or bagels. It's definitely doable. |
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