|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
|
 Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:00 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| Adventurer wrote: |
I think, in Korea, many folks still don't understand enough about multiculturalism just like you could have an old relative from the South who will say things that are pretty ignorant, but she doesn't mean any harm. Obviously, the person who wrote that didn't mean harm, but it's not the best way to market yourself to Africans who want to be seen as modern. So many Africans complain about people thinking they don't have cars or cities and live in tribes. They could have consulted someone from Kenya or an English native speaker and avoid this problem, possibly. I don't think Koreans know much about Africa beyond the stereotypes. That's very true of the U.S., too. However, marketing an airline route and focusing on indigenous themes because you're going to Africa is not the best idea. I wouldn't do it. I know it would offend my African friends.
|
Most Koreans probably think of primitive tribes when they think of Africa, and that's what they mostly show of Africa in the media. It's always a documentary about tribes, lions or some celebrity going over and helping out starving kids. It's kinda funny when I remember when the Korean media got offended because some hollywood movie had a short scene that depicted Korea as a poor rural country. I think it was a James Bond movie. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
| fermentation wrote: |
| T-J wrote: |
It's much closer in meaning to "original" and does NOT have anything close to the negative connotation we in the English speaking world place on the word primitive.
If they had wanted to be derogatory they would have used 미개한 in the original.
But of course you knew that. 
|
You sure about that? You can argue semantics but the fact is that Koreans use the word the same way English speakers use the word "primitive." Not sure if you're fluent in Korean but, why do you think caveman is "원시인" and primitive tribe is "원시부족" in Korean? I'm sure most Koreans won't consider it a compliment if you tell them, "한국 사회는 원시적이네요." |
Disclaimer-drunken post.
원시 again if you refer to the chinese origin is closer in meaning to origin or beginning.
Secondly by attaching ~적 as opposed to ~의 as was the original Korean post the meaning is obviously changed. If you referred to Koren culture as 원시의 문화 it would be taken as a compliment.
/end drunken response. Going to bed now.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Los Angeloser
Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Location: Korea
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
�It was a misunderstanding based off bad translation.�
How do you know? For anyone to know for sure they�d better work for KA. Kenyans got an official apology, not an explanation. Thanks for trying though.
�It's a shame there are no native English speakers in the country who could have proof read it for them.�
KA usually hires female native English speakers(do you know why?) to teach mostly Korean female stewardesses. If it was passed by a native English speaker to check I can see a KA marketing manager ignoring the native female English speaker. Since an apology was required the belief by some might be that the image of Korea has been tarnished, aren't some Koreans ridiculed and ostracized for doing this, will anyone get fired or step down?
As far as Korea is concerned Kenya is not an �official� English speaking country, they don�t know English do they? It took a journalist named Wouter van Cleef to identify the phrase in question. The horror!
�They apologized which is cool.�
You mean apologies are sometimes accepted? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| 원시 again if you refer to the chinese origin is closer in meaning to origin or beginning. |
Like I said, Koreans use the word the same way primitive is used. The exact Chinese meaning isn't always used. If they did, nobody would look at a car and call it a 차 since a car is more than a just a wheel. Besides 원시 사회 doesn't sound that great either. What we're discussing moot since we don't even know what the original Korean wording was anyway.
| Quote: |
| Disclaimer-drunken post. |
You're drunk on a Tuesday night? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| fermentation wrote: |
| You're drunk on a Tuesday night? |
You say that like it was a bad thing.
Cheers to T-J |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
passport220
Joined: 14 Jun 2006
Location: Gyeongsangbuk-do province
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I wonder how many Kenyans are really �outraged� by Korean Air's advertisement? If they are, they might want to drop the petty nonsense (Korean Air already apologized for want was likely just a misunderstanding over language) and focus more on the fact that the ad is an announcement that the air carrier is making a significant economic investment to open up a new air route to Kenya. A country that most of the world does not care about, let alone make investments in. Funny (not the "ha,ha" kind), how that point was lost so quickly in the discussion.
Focus on actions, not words and then decide how disrespectful Korean Air is being toward Kenya. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| fermentation wrote: |
| Adventurer wrote: |
I think, in Korea, many folks still don't understand enough about multiculturalism just like you could have an old relative from the South who will say things that are pretty ignorant, but she doesn't mean any harm. Obviously, the person who wrote that didn't mean harm, but it's not the best way to market yourself to Africans who want to be seen as modern. So many Africans complain about people thinking they don't have cars or cities and live in tribes. They could have consulted someone from Kenya or an English native speaker and avoid this problem, possibly. I don't think Koreans know much about Africa beyond the stereotypes. That's very true of the U.S., too. However, marketing an airline route and focusing on indigenous themes because you're going to Africa is not the best idea. I wouldn't do it. I know it would offend my African friends.
|
Most Koreans probably think of primitive tribes when they think of Africa, and that's what they mostly show of Africa in the media. It's always a documentary about tribes, lions or some celebrity going over and helping out starving kids. It's kinda funny when I remember when the Korean media got offended because some hollywood movie had a short scene that depicted Korea as a poor rural country. I think it was a James Bond movie. |
Well, you made a point. When even the most educated, when thinking of Africa, focus on indigenous tribes and "primitive" tribes, that led to the person writing the advertisement to focus on the indigenous people as something to see. Though most of the posters in this thread don't see that as a problem, I think plenty of Africans would. I have had African friends complain about how they're perceived and how people focus on some of the people in the continent being tribal.
No matter how this would have been translated, it would have reinforced such opinions; that is not a good idea, IMHO. I think their apology should be accepted. There were no evil intentions. Korea is still new to multiculturalism and how to address other groups. That said, it doesn't make the mistake okay, and they need to start having more people in responsible positions actually researching places, talking to people before coming out with nonsense like this. This could have been easily avoided. Imagine if someone had an ad "Come to America, go to Disneyland and see the Native Americans pow wow". That's kind of how this sounds. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dairyairy
Joined: 17 May 2012
Location: South Korea
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| It doesn't sound intentional, but you'd think that Korean Air would be more culturally sensitive. After all, they deal with foreign people and foreign cultures all of the time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mayorgc
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Have you guys ever seen Africa/Africans depicted in Korean text books or lesson videos?
Anybody who's taught in Gepik has probably come across the black person in a loin cloth seen in one of the lesson videos. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jonpurdy
Joined: 08 Jan 2009
Location: Ulsan
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| busanliving wrote: |
| It's a shame there are no native English speakers in the country who could have proof read it for them. |
This times 1,000.
It's a continual embarrassment that companies that can afford it don't bother to hire native speakers. Even hire an F5 gyopo for an hour a week and send out English copy to her. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've proofed things for companies here... only to have them reject my advice.
They do what they want to do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jonpurdy
Joined: 08 Jan 2009
Location: Ulsan
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Captain Corea wrote: |
I've proofed things for companies here... only to have them reject my advice.
They do what they want to do. |
I figured it was stubbornness like that rather than ignorance. Thanks for the insight, Captain. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jane
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Captain Corea wrote: |
I've proofed things for companies here... only to have them reject my advice.
They do what they want to do. |
This^^ It's an exercise in patience at times to deal with proofing documents in Korea. Companies are usually more concerned at how it looks or sounds, than whether it makes sense.
In addition, speed is often given priority over quality of workmanship; hence you get poor English spelling/grammar more often than not. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I can see it now
"Korea Airlines is proud to offer non-stop flights to East St. Louis. To commemorate this we are holding a drawing for a new car, named after a famous Korean war hero- Gen. Lee"
Cue Dukes of Hazzard Gen. Lee pulling onto tarmac and honking Dixie.
Or to borrow one from the Simpsons- "Live, from the Apollo, It's the Korean Komedy Klassics!" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Captain Corea wrote: |
I've proofed things for companies here... only to have them reject my advice.
They do what they want to do. |
That, or it goes through 10 different people.
This was a few years back, but my company had won the contract for Korean Air's annual report that year. And prominently displayed on the front was the logo "Beyond XX Years" - like beyond 40 years or whatever the number was.
Well I didn't like the copy, so I made some suggestions of my own. A couple of days later, I get a phone call from someone over at Korean Air. She sounded like a native speaker, and questioned me about why I was shooting down "Beyond XX Years" - which was intended to reference what the company would achieve in the next XX years. She seemed adamant about it being acceptable, and I just let her win the issue.
I have no idea if the lady still works there, but Korean Air certainly has at least one person on their payroll it can consult about English matters. Advertising department, I would assume, has access to said consultation.
The menu thing I get, you'd think Mr. Kim would know someone who has a friend that is an English speaker who could proof the menu real quick for a free meal or something, but don't bother.
This Korean Air thing, though, major firms here will have people they can consult on English matters, but these people are at the bottom of the totem pole. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
