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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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 Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| DIsbell wrote: |
The wording in the article is poor; I imagine it'll just be part of the annual NHIC check. Korea seems to have a large hidden problem with mental health (high suicide, stress, and unhappiness rates with a culture that harshly stigmatizes mental problems). While we don't want to see every energetic kid doped up on pills, as teachers we've probably seen some kids with legitimate problems that don't get any sort of mental health assistance. It's probably a good thing that the government is finally deciding to do something about it. Making mental health checks a blanket thing will reduce a lot of stigma- if everyone has to get a check, no one will be gossiped about for talking to a psych.
And just because America does something and has some related problems doesn't mean that Korea will have the exact same problems. For example, Korea has hundreds of McD's and Burger Kings and plentiful selections of soda, but the obesity rate isn't near what America deals with. Conversely, in spite of having an excellent public transportation infrastructure, Korea also has a lot of cars and freeways like America, but actually have worse problems with auto-related fatalities and pollution. I guess my point is that everything doesn't need to be compared to America. |
My, you're very optimistic here. 'No one will be gossiped about'? This is Korea here! The individual who is willing to do and be damned is in very short supply. The whole culture works against coming out and admitting weaknesses.
We're talking about people who cannot admit making a mistake that can be easily rectified. I will tell you one day about the circus surrounding a senior English teacher at one of my public schools who invented a whole new grammar structure so he wouldn't have to admit he made a mistake and the students who wrote the bad English were given points in their tests, the students who were correct got zero...
It's not that all Koreans do this - it's that it's acceptable here to do that kind of oddball face saving at all costs. As usual the Koreans who are mentally ill including ones we have to work with will not be seen as a problem and the Koreans who don't fit into the mould or have individuality more along non Korean lines will be stigmatised as 'mentally ill'.
As for the myth that Koreans will not get obese from all the junk the kids eat instead of meals at home with family because the kids are stuck at school or in hagwons, and the copious amounts of soft drinks etc, look around you. It's already happening.
True the average Korean has a smaller frame and so does not grow huge the way Americans and other westerners do but relative to their normal proportions, I see a lot of females with flabby, fatty legs, stumpy bodies are more usual than you think along with the thin ones, and every school I've worked in has had at least 4 obese kids per class. And that's obese - big kids who have the kind of fat that fat kids have outside Korea except relative to the smaller Korean frame.
There will be more to come. It will be a next generational thing the way Brits of certain age groups are generally slim but those under 55 have a comparitively high proportion of obesity among those age groups. |
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earthquakez
Joined: 10 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| DIsbell wrote: |
The wording in the article is poor; I imagine it'll just be part of the annual NHIC check. Korea seems to have a large hidden problem with mental health (high suicide, stress, and unhappiness rates with a culture that harshly stigmatizes mental problems). While we don't want to see every energetic kid doped up on pills, as teachers we've probably seen some kids with legitimate problems that don't get any sort of mental health assistance. It's probably a good thing that the government is finally deciding to do something about it. Making mental health checks a blanket thing will reduce a lot of stigma- if everyone has to get a check, no one will be gossiped about for talking to a psych.
And just because America does something and has some related problems doesn't mean that Korea will have the exact same problems. For example, Korea has hundreds of McD's and Burger Kings and plentiful selections of soda, but the obesity rate isn't near what America deals with. Conversely, in spite of having an excellent public transportation infrastructure, Korea also has a lot of cars and freeways like America, but actually have worse problems with auto-related fatalities and pollution. I guess my point is that everything doesn't need to be compared to America. |
My, you're very optimistic here. 'No one will be gossiped about'? This is Korea here! The individual who is willing to do and be damned is in very short supply. The whole culture works against coming out and admitting weaknesses.
We're talking about people who cannot admit making a mistake that can be easily rectified. I will tell you one day about the circus surrounding a senior English teacher at one of my public schools who invented a whole new grammar structure so he wouldn't have to admit he made a mistake and the students who wrote the bad English were given points in their tests, the students who were correct got zero...
It's not that all Koreans do this - it's that it's acceptable here to do that kind of oddball face saving at all costs. As usual the Koreans who are mentally ill including ones we have to work with will not be seen as a problem and the Koreans who don't fit into the mould or have individuality more along non Korean lines will be stigmatised as 'mentally ill'.
As for the myth that Koreans will not get obese from all the junk the kids eat instead of meals at home with family because the kids are stuck at school or in hagwons, and the copious amounts of soft drinks etc, look around you. It's already happening.
True the average Korean has a smaller frame and so does not grow huge the way Americans and other westerners do but relative to their normal proportions, I see a lot of females with flabby, fatty legs, stumpy bodies are more usual than you think along with the thin ones, and every school I've worked in has had at least 4 obese kids per class. And that's obese - big kids who have the kind of fat that fat kids have outside Korea except relative to the smaller Korean frame.
There will be more to come. It will be a next generational thing the way Brits of certain age groups are generally slim but those under 55 have a comparitively high proportion of obesity among those age groups. |
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slothrop
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:25 am Post subject: |
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edit
Last edited by slothrop on Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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| earthquakez wrote: |
[qu
My, you're very optimistic here. 'No one will be gossiped about'? This is Korea here! The individual who is willing to do and be damned is in very short supply. . |
This is true of all cultures.
As for the gossip if mental health checks are MANDATORY for everyone...exactly who is going to be gossiping about who?
They are all in the same boat...any finger pointing can be pointed right back at the person. |
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fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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| minos wrote: |
Mental illness is viewed as such an embarrasment here that it's rarely treated.
Hence these measures to fix that.
Ever wonder why so many people have problems with hagwon bosses. Geez perhaps some of them could use a visit to a psychiatrist? |
I think trying to make every single citizen take mandatory psych tests in a nation of 50 million is a sign of mental illness. And to get rid of a sitgma? Couldn't think of a better way? This isn't a real solution. These people have never been interested in actual solutions anyway. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| minos wrote: |
| fermentation wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Wow! Mandatory mental health checks? No concept of personal rights or civil liberties here is there? |
My first thought as well. Politicians never fail to amaze me with their stupidity and their view of citizens as idiotic children who need to be constantly watched over. Still, I would like to see some details over how this will be carried out before I make harsh judgements.
The good thing is that this is a proposed plan, and there are people who are against it. So maybe it won't pass. I did a bit of reading on this and so far, I'm disappointed for the reasons why people are against it. They're against it for practical reasons (costs too much, not realistic, not effective, etc) rather than on a basis of rights. So as long as its cheap and effective, they don't care that this is an infringement on our civil liberties. |
Mental illness is viewed as such an embarrasment here that it's rarely treated.
Hence these measures to fix that.
Ever wonder why so many people have problems with hagwon bosses. Geez perhaps some of them could use a visit to a psychiatrist? |
Or local education office supervisors? Most have been ok, but this one I had a couple of years ago. Crazy, emotional, illogical, ect. Yeah, he could have used a mental health check up. |
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slothrop
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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edit
Last edited by slothrop on Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:23 am Post subject: Re: Citizens to undergo mandatory mental check-ups |
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| korea times wrote: |
| Citizens to undergo mandatory mental check-ups. |
That's crazy. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:29 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| earthquakez wrote: |
[qu
My, you're very optimistic here. 'No one will be gossiped about'? This is Korea here! The individual who is willing to do and be damned is in very short supply. . |
This is true of all cultures.
As for the gossip if mental health checks are MANDATORY for everyone...exactly who is going to be gossiping about who?
They are all in the same boat...any finger pointing can be pointed right back at the person. |
This is true, but there is a big difference in terms of medical privacy. In Korea, your boss thinks nothing of demanding to know what is wrong with you if you call in sick (sometimes including sending someone from your school to the doctor with you, in the case of foreign teachers). That would be grounds for a lawsuit in most NET home countries. |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:33 am Post subject: |
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| slothrop wrote: |
�Insanity in individuals is something rare, but in groups, parties, nations and epochs it is the rule�
Friedrich Nietzsche
�Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.�
Albert Einstein
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
Krishnamurti |
Don't forget the all important question, "Who decides who's crazy?" |
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isitts
Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:37 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| ...exactly who is going to be gossiping about who? |
Um, the people who didn't get diagnosed as crazy will be gossiping about the people who did get diagnosed.
Isn't that obvious? 
Last edited by isitts on Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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minos
Joined: 01 Dec 2010
Location: kOREA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 6:36 am Post subject: |
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| slothrop wrote: |
| minos wrote: |
If anything society needs more pills not less... |
according to who? hunter s. thompson, big pharm, the politicians they give money to, and YOU?LOL
| minos wrote: |
Most of the criticism of modern psychotherapy and psychologists tends to come from...
Scientology funded PR and front companies
Journalists on a slow news day
TV sitcoms
New age healing practitioners(aka, cons) |
i'm not a scientologist, journalist, or new age healer and don't even own a tv so i don't know what they talk about on sitcoms.
| minos wrote: |
If you go to a doctor requesting pills and are on the fence, they'll usually ask you to think about or give you a sample, tiny dosage. If they think your faking(many junkies do) they'll kick you out the office. Most doctors do not want to be known as the "pill" doctor unless they enjoy meeting dope heads.
They don't get you to sign up for 12 month subscription....infact, trying to get more 2-4 weeks prescription is a real pain on some drugs. So much for the big pharma conspiracy.
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it is estimated that 1 in 10 americans take antidepresants. that's big business. whether it's a conspiracy or not. kaching!
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/19/us-usa-antidepressants-idUSTRE79I7FI20111019
as for not giving too many per prescription...maybe they don't want to give you too many at once because all the pills keep ending up at high school parties on NY's upper east side. or maybe they make money each time you show up for a 10 minute 'consult' to get your next prescription.LOL
and if docs are so reluctant to hand them out then why are there so many threads on dave's about where esl teachers can easily get psychotropic drugs or prescriptions from docs, no questions asked... even from dermatologists?LOL
| minos wrote: |
Something about pills and mental health brings out the tin foil hat people like nothing else. Probaly becuase they ironically aren't taking anything for the nagging case of paranoid schizophenia. |
well, this topic has sure brought out the best in you. perhaps therapy could lessen your hostility and benefit you in your future business dealings. LOL
btw, i clearly stated that i believe there are people who benefit from these drugs. did i not? is it so controversial to question whether there are too many people in the US who are given these? and that the noble health care industry could possibly be motivated by profits over the well being of patients? jeez. if that's all one has to suggest these days to be considered wearing a tin foil hat, then i guess i'd better get a case of the stuff and stock up.LOL
and if psychologists want to stop koreans from being depressed and offing themselves all they have to do is make them see that all the pressures and unrealistic expectations that their parents, teachers, bosses, and they as individuals put on themselves are not so important. if you feel life isn't worth living there is another option to suicide and being constantly depressed... CHANGE YOUR LIFE... for example... quit your job... don't go to university, or else go to a lesser one and study what you want, not what your parents want... marry the person you want, even if your parents forbid it, or better yet... don't get married at all if you don't want to.
the buddha called it the middle way. i call it the middle finger way. basically, if you feel you're always depressed or suicidal, then give the middle finger to your boss, parents and anyone else you feel has been repressing you. warning;doing this may be addictive, but it is 100% natural, it feels really good, and best of all it's free. if there was an emoticon to show this i'd show it to you right now.  |
Have you ever been to a doctor to request Psych pills? It's hardly a sales pitch.....more like a interview at best, interrogation with MRI scans at worst.
Many people ask because public health records are easy to access. The stigma about having any issue mentally is pretty bad.
As for Koreans and pressure. Pressure doesn't lead to suicide in normal people. It canin mentally unstable people.
I suggest buying a book about suicide(or go to the wiki). Your doing a disservice to anyone who's had a relative that committed suicide with your dime store philosophy about suicide prevention.
Call a suicide prevention hot line sometime; they won't yell at you carpe diem and quit your job. Then again maybe they're on big pharma's payroll too.
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slothrop
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:49 am Post subject: |
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edit
Last edited by slothrop on Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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minos
Joined: 01 Dec 2010
Location: kOREA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| slothrop wrote: |
| minos wrote: |
Call a suicide prevention hot line sometime; they won't yell at you carpe diem and quit your job. Then again maybe they're on big pharma's payroll too.
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if the reason you want to kill yourself is your job then maybe they should suggest you quit it.
if 10% of americans take antidepressants and other countries have much lower percentages, then do you think that americans are really that much more depressed than those other nationalities? or that those other countries aren't as good as diagnosing mental illness? is it possible that some people in the US are pushing for expanding those who are considered mentally ill because it means bigger profits? if there was no profit motive then i would have to reconsider. you know there are farmers in the US who don't let their families eat the crops they grow to sell to the public right? they keep a separate plot to raise organic vegetables for their family to eat. don't you think there are psychatrists and doctors who do the same thing? prescibe meds to patients because thats their job and how they make money but if it was their own child would only consider it as a last resort? doctors are just people, man, they aren't saints. and politicians and CEO's of pharmaceutical companies are on the same level mentally as psychopaths. LOL according to the book 'the psychopath test'. |
Most other countries are far behind the curve on mental health. Health insurance for psychiatric health is usually limited or doesn't cover the medicine unlike the USA.
Yes, psychiatrists and psychology also take pills or visit other doctors. I've met quite a few doctors who admitted this. It's certainly not unusual.... "last resort" lol, When your prescribed pills, there is a test phase to see if you like it. Pills don't cause irreversible damage.
Have you even met a suicidal person?!?
Contrary to popular belief, they don't go around announcing it before hand, planning elaborate death strategies like jumping off cliffs, and leaving 50 notes behind.
Can you please read up on Suicide? You keep qouting the psychopath test book.....how about a suicide prevention book(crazy eh?) |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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I read today that the mental health check will start with a questionnaire, then if you fail that part you must go in for a regular psych exam. I did think it would be logistically impossible 50 million people to meet with headshrinkers.
However, it seems this plan has the usual "wtf?" we have come to expect from bureaucracy here. Each person will have to complete the mental health questionnaire twice BEFORE starting elementary school, twice while in elementary school, once in middle school, once in high school, three times in their twenties, and twice every ten years after that.
How does a five year old gauge his mental health? |
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