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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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 Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
I'd agree more with the seatbelt issues than some of the other one's raised. That's a pretty obvious one.
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Not sure if the seatbelts are an issue with drivers...passengers though may be another story.
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| Legislation on the use of safety restraints must be accompanied by strict enforcement in order to be effective. In Korea, usage rates among drivers rose from 23% to 98% in less than a year following a well-publicized national police enforcement campaign and the doubling of the penalty for non-use... |
http://www.paho.org/English/DD/PUB/safety_restraints_en.pdf
This report is from the WHO so it's not just some Korean journalist making stuff up. Then again it is from 2004.
However it does seem that enforcement and increasing fines do work here...they did before. |
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crescent
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: yes.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Sorry, but a dingy bottle of Clorox on the bathroom floor holds the same allure as a dingy rock on the ground. Seriously, you could put an unopened bottle of Pepsi on the bathroom floor next to the mop and no one would drink it. |
Wrong. I caught the kids playing with (mixing) the chemicals. Strangely, no incidents of desk/chair/rock throwing. Plenty of rocks outside the building.
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| I trust that the appeal of using a map or broom as a weapon outweighs the allure of drinking a dirty bottle of bleach (and we all know how lovely that smells and tastes), therefore you don't have to worry. At that point you could claim that anything is dangerous and anything has the potential to kill. |
You failed to understand the first time; cleaners and bleach now smell like fruit and flowers. You also failed to understand that chemicals need not be ingested in order to injure. Furthermore, why do you insist on focusing on death? Ah, yes... you do love those extremes.
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| Sorry, but there's a reason we haven't heard about 1000 kids dropping dead from chemicals in the school bathroom. It's because chemicals on the school bathroom floor don't look that fun to drink and play with it. It's a non-issue. |
Wrong. The reasons we haven't heard about this specific statistic are because:
1. We haven't looked.
2. Hyperbole. How many injuries/deaths would make it an issue.
3. There are NO recent stats on child injury at all in Korea.
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| And using the logic that because something is dangerous (which is pretty much everything), it should be out of the reach of kids is what? Brilliant reason? |
I see you need to add your own hyperbole again. To say everything is dangerous is like saying if you drink enough water, you can kill yourself. Some things are OBVIOUSLY more dangerous than others. The fact that you can't see this makes me think you have a serious problem. If everything is dangerous, would you let your young inexperienced child swim unattended? As per the above example, we can see that the chemical is indeed more enticing. I witnessed the chemicals being played with, yet not a single chair or desk thrown. And there are much more of the latter available.
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| No, they get both a paper cutting device AND a pencil sharpener in one. It's a multi-use tool. |
Convenience for the sake of safety. Check.
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| Yes, but as I said, if you start getting uber-slow and cautious buses then you start getting buses showing up at haphazard times and one pulling up right after the other and increased costs and all of that. |
You haven't shown there will be 'uber-slow' busses as a result of the bus driver following traffic laws. It is a complete fabrication, and intellectually dishonest to say there will be "uber-slow' cautious busses, resulting in increased costs, just because the bus driver follows the law and pulls over to the outside lane to pick up passengers. Each post you make goes deeper and deeper into the absurd. Theory? Prove it. Don't submit it's common sense, because that can be debated endlessly.
There are traffic laws for a reason. So, if that law isn't followed, how about the speed limit, and red lights? We aren't talking -uber-slow-, we are talking legal speed limit, red light minding buses, that pull to the side when picking up kids. There are proven studies which indicate following the legal speed limit actually result in negligible time differences. Go ahead and prove me wrong on that. I take busses every day, and I observe how these drivers ramp up the gas, and screech to a halt at every stop, only to sit idling at almost every single intersection. Last I checked, there's no shortage of intersections here. The only thing they succeed in doing is waiting longer at a red light.
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| The point is that these decisions and regulations don't work in practice like they do in theory. Believing that its as simple as having drivers drive better is ignoring the question of why they drive that way. I assume most bus drivers would rather drive slow and easy, but they aren't for a reason. What is that reason? Culture? |
The why and the culture bit is a bunch of sociolo-garbage. The 'why' is separate from the 'is'. It 'is' unsafe to pick up schoolchildren from the inside lane of morning rush hour traffic and it 'is' unsafe to drop them off the same way in evening rush hour traffic. It 'is' unsafe and negligent not to buckle your kids up in the car. Culture will explain the 'why', but the 'why' doesn't make things more safe. It just means the value system of that culture puts safety lower in a given equation.
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| Yes, and I was quick to recognize the limitations and the potential for unintended consequences, so I offered another solution, one that will have its own limitations and unintended consequences. But nowhere did I d the standard "If people just did this, then X would happen." Rarely does X happen, and often Y and Z happen as well. |
The point is you offered a political solution and then belittled the rest of Dave's users for doing the same thing. You do it when it serves, and criticize it when it goes against your argument. |
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Dodge7
Joined: 21 Oct 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:49 am Post subject: |
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| you guys arguing on this thread for the past 4 pages really have no lives. Bickering like a bunch of old women. I feel bad for your wives. |
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WadRUG'naDoo
Joined: 15 Jun 2010
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:29 am Post subject: |
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| Dodge7 wrote: |
| you guys arguing on this thread for the past 4 pages really have no lives. Bickering like a bunch of old women. I feel bad for your wives. |
No doubt. It's a "special" hobby. |
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Gorf
Joined: 25 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| The thing that annoys me most is the general ignorance about seat belts. I have students tell me straight up that they never wear one because it's annoying. My coteacher told me a student died last year because she went through the windshield in a crash, she would have probably been fine if she had worn a seatbelt. She was in the middle of the back seat. |
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LuckyNomad
Joined: 28 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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[/quote]
I think there should be a law mandating that car manufacturers install a device such that the car won't even start if the passenger doesn't have his/her seatbelt on, and locks the seatbelt in the fastened position while the car is in motion. If you hit the gas pedal while your seatbelt is unfastened, your car turns itself off.
Same thing with drunk driving. ALL cars should have ignition interlock.[/quote]
I bought a car this year. If I don't put on my seatbelt or if I take it off while the car is on, it starts beeping at me. The beep is loud and ANNOYING. |
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IamBabo
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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Not having the car start without a seatbelt on or doing a Breathalyzer is moronic. What if you are carrying a wounded mathematician in your Wrangler and a T-Rex barges through and your Big Game Hunter guy had a snifter of brandy before he headed out?
Seriously though, it makes sense in normal times, but there would either be an emergency situation or something like where you're trying to push start it or whatever where that would just be a hindrance. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 3:56 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Not having the car start without a seatbelt on or doing a Breathalyzer is moronic. What if you are carrying a wounded mathematician in your Wrangler and a T-Rex barges through and your Big Game Hunter guy had a snifter of brandy before he headed out?
Seriously though, it makes sense in normal times, but there would either be an emergency situation or something like where you're trying to push start it or whatever where that would just be a hindrance. |
Or you're just trying to move your car in the driveway. Having a party at your house and someone needs to get out? Well, someone else will have to move your car. |
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crescent
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: yes.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:30 am Post subject: |
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| Dodge7 wrote: |
| you guys arguing on this thread for the past 4 pages really have no lives. Bickering like a bunch of old women. I feel bad for your wives. |
Says the guy who can't go a day without making at least one inane post. You're definitely a winner. |
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fermentation
Joined: 22 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Not having the car start without a seatbelt on or doing a Breathalyzer is moronic. |
Lol. We should just lock everybody up in padded rooms if we're so concerned about safety. |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| ...and locks the seatbelt in the fastened position while the car is in motion... |
And the first time that safety feature fails to shut off when your car is slowly sinking in a lake or stuck on the rail road tracks will be its last as its inventor is sued into oblivion. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| Quote: |
| ...and locks the seatbelt in the fastened position while the car is in motion... |
And the first time that safety feature fails to shut off when your car is slowly sinking in a lake or stuck on the rail road tracks will be its last as its inventor is sued into oblivion. |
You gotta love the Dave's "Everything works exactly the way it is planned" crowd. Just make a law or mandate a device. Nothing will go wrong. Everything works out in real life the way it does in theory and conception.
That and a complete forgetfulness regarding lawsuits and "real" politics and media. |
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yodanole
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: La Florida
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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You may one day regret having given them this idea.
| fermentation wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| Not having the car start without a seatbelt on or doing a Breathalyzer is moronic. |
Lol. We should just lock everybody up in padded rooms if we're so concerned about safety. |
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murmanjake
Joined: 21 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:38 am Post subject: |
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The seatbelts get me. I see fewer kids wearing seatbelts than not. Sometimes it'll be a toddler standing in the passenger seat, hands on the open passenger window. That stuff infuriates me. All it takes is a little fender bender. Doesn't matter how good of a driver you are.
Don't parents get how dangerous it is?
Maybe Korea needs one of those uber-graphic seatbelt campaigns, with a slow-motion shot of a toddler crashing around the driver's compartment, broken and bloody. That might shock some sense into people. |
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