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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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Seoulman69
Joined: 14 Dec 2009
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 Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| I don't learn it because IT'S A USELESS LANGUAGE. How's that? There is NOWHERE IN THE WORLD except here where the language will EVER be used. I love random knowledge [I'm reading a book about the global flower industry, for God's sake!] but languages are different. Their ONLY purpose is for communication. Why waste learning time on learning something that will be utterly useless the day you leave, and is hardly necessary even while you're here? There are so many more interesting things to learn, and so many more fruitful, not to mention lovelier, languages. Why not learn Arabic? Mandarin? Russian? Hindi? Anything except Korean. |
I think some people want to learn Korean because they are living in Korea. They want to show respect to Korean society, interact in a deeper way with the locals, talk to their S.O. in his/her native tongue, speak to their S.O.'s family, understand what their kids are saying all the time, make Korean friends, and stimulate their mind.
If you plan on leaving after a year then I would agree with your point. But if you're staying longer common decency would implore you to at least learn some basics.
Koreans often say that foreigners show a lack of respect when living in Korea, and from your post I would have to agree. |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:51 am Post subject: |
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| viciousdinosaur wrote: |
Wait until you have a class of 25 and none of them have English names and you'll change your tune pretty quick. English names are just easier to remember because they are already programmed in our brains from when we were kids. Names aren't just sounds. We connect the word with other ideas and other people which strengthens our ability to remember them.
Korean names have zero meaning to our brains and are very difficult to memorize, especially the ones with the "hyun, jae, ji, won, yung" syallables that are in like every name. When I've taught large classes I tried learning their Korean names, but after a month of only knowing a couple people's names, I just said "F*ck it" you are all choosing an English name now. And I knew all their names after a couple days.
That's why we have English names. If you've never been in that situation, you are in no place to judge. |
Sorry but what a lame excuse this is!
Holy crap man, print some cards and have the kids write their Korean names on it. Have name tags for the first few classes.
As for English names, if the kids want to have one for English class, no big deal. They are also a good learning tool as it creates an English environment in class. This type of thing happens in other language classes as well.
Last edited by PatrickGHBusan on Fri Aug 31, 2012 5:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:59 am Post subject: |
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| viciousdinosaur wrote: |
Korean is frickin hard. I know a lot of people on this board claim to speak Korean. But if you're not Gyopo or spent at least a decade studying it, then you aren't fluent. You might know it at a high-intermediate level, good for most situations, but definitely not fluent.
I learned French and German before coming to Korea. Those languages were a walk in the park. In less than three years you can master those languages. They're almost like dialects of English.
But Korean is just other-worldly. Six years here and I'm still not at the intermediate level. Mind you it is my fourth language, but just everything about it is counter-intuitive. Hat-tip to all those Koreans out there who manage to master English. |
BS
I know a lot of foreigners who are fluent in Korean. I am one of them. You are right that some people do overestimate their language proficiency in Korean however.
It is not an easy language to learn for a westerner when compared to German, Italian, French or Spanish of course. I agree with you there too Dino.
Still, I can assure you that many of the long timers I met are fluent in Korean. Some of us have even passed the K-language proficiency test at the highest level. Conditions do influence this, in my case being married to a Korean woman and interacting with her and her family was a huge boost in terms of immersion and practice. I studied my ass off and practice like a madman. After a few years in Busan, I was fluent: I can have a fluid conversation with any Korean I meet, can read novels and newspapers, watch K-movies and K-TV with no problems. I do have an accent but thats normal. I personally know at least 15 other foreigners who have similar proficiency in Korean. It can certainly be done, but like you and others said, it is not easy! |
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premiummince
Joined: 23 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 6:04 am Post subject: |
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| Just let them call themselves as they want. It's not really an issue. |
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NilesQ
Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 9:47 am Post subject: |
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| I knew a guy who's English name was Primative Savage. He was hilarious, and lived up to his name! |
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viciousdinosaur
Joined: 30 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
| viciousdinosaur wrote: |
Wait until you have a class of 25 and none of them have English names and you'll change your tune pretty quick. English names are just easier to remember because they are already programmed in our brains from when we were kids. Names aren't just sounds. We connect the word with other ideas and other people which strengthens our ability to remember them.
Korean names have zero meaning to our brains and are very difficult to memorize, especially the ones with the "hyun, jae, ji, won, yung" syallables that are in like every name. When I've taught large classes I tried learning their Korean names, but after a month of only knowing a couple people's names, I just said "F*ck it" you are all choosing an English name now. And I knew all their names after a couple days.
That's why we have English names. If you've never been in that situation, you are in no place to judge. |
Sorry but what a lame excuse this is!
Holy crap man, print some cards and have the kids write their Korean names on it. Have name tags for the first few classes.
As for English names, if the kids want to have one for English class, no big deal. They are also a good learning tool as it creates an English environment in class. This type of thing happens in other language classes as well. |
Why do you assume I teach children? Children normally have English names. It's the adults. It's insulting to make them write name cards. Jesus. I see upwards of 110 students a day. And close to 200 in a week. You don't know my situation. I barely know my students. |
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asdfghjkl
Joined: 21 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Giving stupid English names to kids is the best part of this job! I can't believe you mollycoddled nancies are on here downplaying its importance. When the current generation of children comes of age, I am sure that Sonic will be an acceptable name if the old guard from Harvard's Suwon campus stop dropping their monocles and griping about it on eslcafe.
Anyway, the best English names I have assigned my students have been:
Jed
Sinbad
Ned
Herman
Choadette
Zeke
Elmer
Edna
Zelda
Bertha (to a fat girl)
Exlax
When I took Spanish as a schoolboy, I had to pick a Spanish name. I don't think my Spanish teacher knew my real name, but I had no problem with it. She still knew me and who I was. A name is just a small part of a person.[/list] |
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viciousdinosaur
Joined: 30 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah naming can be fun.
Had a kid named Gun-Ha, so I named him Gunther. Such a redneck name. He dug it. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Thanks troll. Actually my students always sit in different seats every time I teach them and I don't have the time to be checking the seating plan every five minutes when I'm supposed to be concentrating on teaching. |
How is his idea trolling? And you don't spend every 5 minutes checking hte seating chart. It's a glance down when you call on someone.
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| Seriously, Steelrails. Get over yourself. Let's take the average Korean, named Ji Eun [I like my 6Gs!] over to, say, Brazil. Or Oman. Or Poland. Or Mozambique. Or even down to Thailand. And let's see how well ANY of them do trying to pronounce her name. This isn't about the 'individuality' of Ji Eun. This is about functioning in a world in which Korean is NOT understood and not going to be understood outside of Korea. Just like as another poster mentioned, Dutch. Or Greek. Or Finnish. There's lots of these kinds of languages. How many of the Dutch do you imagine to be bilingual with English, French or German? I'd bet damn near all of them. AND, the Dutch share an alphabet with others. Korean has all these letters that barely correspond with anything in our alphabet, and sounds that basically cannot be made by any non-native speaker. In that case the English name is nothing more than a concession to the real world, the world outside this little bubble of theirs where everyone except the local waygookin speaks Korean. |
I went to an elementary public school that had students from 80 different countries. I went to a high school that had students from over 150 different nations. I would play pickup soccer games with people from all over the globe.
Guess what? Everyone could figure out everyone's name and while some did get mispronounced, everyone showed the common courtesy of learning the persons name. Because most of the people there were from non-English speaking nations, no one went through the silliness of giving some English name. They understood that they have ears and that they could hear something and do their best.
So in the "real world", people from around the globe have the courtesy to learn someone's name.
I won't disagree about the practicalities of taking an English name. I mentioned that in my post. But someone who willfully forces people to take English names in their classroom, or dismisses someone because they lack an English name, is being disrespectful, rude, and bigoted.
I mean seriously, drunken sports fans can pronounce foreigner names. If they can say Per Mertesaacker/ Djibril Cisse / Park Ji Sung/ Pavel Progbryneyak/ Pajtim Kasami/ Ahmed Elmohamady and remember those names just fine, I think the world as a whole can do it. This whole "It's way too difficult to learn" thing is way overblown. It's all about context and the person being notable.
In that sense Dengar or Thor's Hammer might actually have some merit as being rather unique and you certainly wouldn't forget the person. Heck, might even get the person dragged over to do some shots with people and make some connections.
Morever- How in the world are "Kim, Park, and Lee" so difficult for English speakers? I think a slightly off pronunciation of 김 박 and 이 is a reasonable compromise.
The reason we give them English names is because in Korea there are many people whose names sound similar. Not because of the way things are outside of Korea.
I found Chinese/Korean names to be far easier to remember back home than here and someone whose name was "Dan Lee" far more difficult to remember. Why? Because I also knew a Daniel Lee, Dan Smith, Dan Yi, Don Lee, Danny Lee, Big Dan, Drunken Dan, etc. Or the 80 different girls at church all named Esther.
If you want someone to have a memorable name just name them Dick. "Hi, I'm Dick Kim." People will remember.
Last edited by Steelrails on Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:17 am; edited 3 times in total |
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PatrickGHBusan
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:21 am Post subject: |
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| viciousdinosaur wrote: |
| PatrickGHBusan wrote: |
| viciousdinosaur wrote: |
Wait until you have a class of 25 and none of them have English names and you'll change your tune pretty quick. English names are just easier to remember because they are already programmed in our brains from when we were kids. Names aren't just sounds. We connect the word with other ideas and other people which strengthens our ability to remember them.
Korean names have zero meaning to our brains and are very difficult to memorize, especially the ones with the "hyun, jae, ji, won, yung" syallables that are in like every name. When I've taught large classes I tried learning their Korean names, but after a month of only knowing a couple people's names, I just said "F*ck it" you are all choosing an English name now. And I knew all their names after a couple days.
That's why we have English names. If you've never been in that situation, you are in no place to judge. |
Sorry but what a lame excuse this is!
Holy crap man, print some cards and have the kids write their Korean names on it. Have name tags for the first few classes.
As for English names, if the kids want to have one for English class, no big deal. They are also a good learning tool as it creates an English environment in class. This type of thing happens in other language classes as well. |
Why do you assume I teach children? Children normally have English names. It's the adults. It's insulting to make them write name cards. Jesus. I see upwards of 110 students a day. And close to 200 in a week. You don't know my situation. I barely know my students. |
I worked with adults in a business setting. We used teaching and faciliation techniques (we were team teaching) and we had everyone write their names on a label they put on their desk. That was for the first 2 weeks. Then we moved on, everyone knowing everyone elses names (in Korean for this particular group).
I took several workshops and classes since I moved back to canuckland, in 90% of the cases the trainer/teacher/facilitator had everyone write their names on a flip sign on their desk. That allows everyone to get to know everyone and it relaxes the athmosphere in class.
So in your situation, having your students write their Korean names on a sign on their desk would solve your issue. Heck, since they change their seats often, have them keep the sign with their class materials. There are always ways to help you memorize their names in such a large class environment.
Or, whine about it online and do nothing.
Your call Dino. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:45 am Post subject: |
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I had one student call himself 'Peanut'. I warned him that it wasn't an appropriate name, but he insisted he wanted to use it.
He was 35.
He was an odd duck.
It suited him. |
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Porksta
Joined: 05 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 8:51 am Post subject: |
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| I had students name themselves Past, Present, and Future. Had other kids who were brothers so when I read the names it would go Tom, And, Jerry. My friend has a student named Creeper. I think it is funny, and as long as they enjoy it, who cares? |
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chasmmi
Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Location: Ulsan
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:29 am Post subject: |
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That's it I'm naming my first born Bortak! 
Personally when it has come to Korean names, my only real issue has been when I have taught brothers or sisters in different classes whose parents have decided that its a fun idea to have all their children share every syllable except one.
So I have 6th grade boy named Park Sungchun and a 5th grade almost identical looking brother of his named Park Changchun for example.
Always calling them the other's name, (But then I would do that if they were called Marvin and Winston also).
My preferred course of action though is to just ask the Korean what he wants to be called. If they give an English name I use that and if he gives a Korean name I use that.
A note to people teaching adults, I have known a couple of Koreans in the past who have only ever told me their English name because I was younger that them and as such they did not want to hear me using their Korean name to address them even if we were speaking in English. |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I make an effort to learn Korean names, but I teach upwards of 600 different students per week and it's just impossible for my English brain to get all the JiHyeons, JinHyeons, SeoYeongs, SuJeongs, SuYeons, JiHyes and JuHyes (I teach mostly girls) straight. |
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NohopeSeriously
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea
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| Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2012 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I use a mix of English and Russian names. It's just easier that way. |
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