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Non-native English speaker - need realistic advice!
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A. K. Tern



Joined: 05 Sep 2012

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 2:39 pm    Post subject: Non-native English speaker - need realistic advice! Reply with quote

Hello,
I'd recently found out about teaching English abroad and fell in love with the idea. After doing some research, I was disappointed to learn that most employers are looking for people with passports issued by the English speaking countries. I am a citizen of the EU, but not the UK. At home, I'm a self-employed English teacher. I'm 24, white (I've been reading the forum and I'm getting the idea that matters), I have a BA and an MA from a one of the major local universities, although not in linguistics. I speak English fluently and without any noticeable accent and have good real-life experience in teaching English (including teaching kids), although not in a classroom.
I currently don't have any certificates in proficiency, but I am confident I could easily obtain any certificate if knew that'd help me.

So I'm asking you for a realistic estimation of my chances to be employed in the ESL industry today, provided I get TESL certified online or otherwise, and perhaps also get a TOEFL or something of the sort with a very high score. Getting certified entails considerable expenses for me, so I'd hate to waste all that money just to be blocked by the color of my passport. Korea would be my primary place of interest, but I'm also looking at in Germany/Austria or Russia (St. Petersburg), perhaps also Taiwan or China. If you have any info on what my chances are on that front, please let me know.

Please ask for any additional details! I really appreciate the help, I'm so lost.

PS: I tried searching the forum for info on the matter, but got pretty much nothing. Sorry if I'm asking something that's been covered before!
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newb



Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know about any other countries, but you must carry a golden passport from the listed English speaking countries to teach in Korea.
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wings



Joined: 09 Nov 2006

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I met and worked with several ESL teachers in Mexico who were not native speakers.

If you have a high level of English, which you seem to, and you get certification you should be able to find work in Latin America. It would most likely be under the table, but that is not to uncommon even for native speakers.
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Non-native English speaker - need realistic advice! Reply with quote

A. K. Tern wrote:
Hello,
I'd recently found out about teaching English abroad and fell in love with the idea. After doing some research, I was disappointed to learn that most employers are looking for people with passports issued by the English speaking countries. I am a citizen of the EU, but not the UK. At home, I'm a self-employed English teacher. I'm 24, white (I've been reading the forum and I'm getting the idea that matters), I have a BA and an MA from a one of the major local universities, although not in linguistics. I speak English fluently and without any noticeable accent and have good real-life experience in teaching English (including teaching kids), although not in a classroom.
I currently don't have any certificates in proficiency, but I am confident I could easily obtain any certificate if knew that'd help me.

So I'm asking you for a realistic estimation of my chances to be employed in the ESL industry today, provided I get TESL certified online or otherwise, and perhaps also get a TOEFL or something of the sort with a very high score. Getting certified entails considerable expenses for me, so I'd hate to waste all that money just to be blocked by the color of my passport. Korea would be my primary place of interest, but I'm also looking at in Germany/Austria or Russia (St. Petersburg), perhaps also Taiwan or China. If you have any info on what my chances are on that front, please let me know.

Please ask for any additional details! I really appreciate the help, I'm so lost.

PS: I tried searching the forum for info on the matter, but got pretty much nothing. Sorry if I'm asking something that's been covered before!


You have NO chance of legal employment as an English Teacher in Korea without a passport from one of the 7 "approved" countries (immigration requirement for the visa).

You CAN work as an English teacher in most of the rest of East Asia.
You will need an IELTS / TOEIC score (5.5 or 600+). It is or will soon be an immigration /visa requirement in all ASEAN countries because you are not a native speaker.

IF you are home country certified as a teacher you can certainly find work in China, Thailand, Vietnam, etc. In your first year you won't make much money (1000 Euros/month to start) but as your "reputation" builds so will your opportunities for upward mobility in the industry and remuneration.

.

.
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edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know of lots of non native speaker teachers working in the EU. The British council, which is one of the best employers, will take non native speakers on but they generally need the DELTA to stand a a chance against native speakers with the CELTA. I'd suggest doing the CELTA first (don't waste any money on an online cert) getting a job in a less fashionable country and doing the DELTA after a couple of years. This will give you a much better chance of finding a good job where you want. Of course your best chance would be to get employed in your country of origin, wherever that may be. if it's a country where the BC have a big presence, for example, they'd be looking for people with the local language to move up into management positions and the like. you could then move to another country at a later stage
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A. K. Tern



Joined: 05 Sep 2012

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for replies everybody!
wings wrote:
I met and worked with several ESL teachers in Mexico who were not native speakers.

If you have a high level of English, which you seem to, and you get certification you should be able to find work in Latin America. It would most likely be under the table, but that is not to uncommon even for native speakers.

I think I'd be very scared of working illegally. Especially in a place like Latin America. Even if it's a norm there, I don't suppose I'd be comfortable.
wings wrote:
You have NO chance of legal employment as an English Teacher in Korea without a passport from one of the 7 "approved" countries (immigration requirement for the visa).

You CAN work as an English teacher in most of the rest of East Asia.
You will need an IELTS / TOEIC score (5.5 or 600+). It is or will soon be an immigration /visa requirement in all ASEAN countries because you are not a native speaker.

So Korea is not an option for me, then. Well that sucks! I'd gathered as much from the visa requirements, but thought I'd still check in with people before giving up hope.

wings wrote:
You CAN work as an English teacher in most of the rest of East Asia.
You will need an IELTS / TOEIC score (5.5 or 600+). It is or will soon be an immigration /visa requirement in all ASEAN countries because you are not a native speaker.

IF you are home country certified as a teacher you can certainly find work in China, Thailand, Vietnam, etc. In your first year you won't make much money (1000 Euros/month to start) but as your "reputation" builds so will your opportunities for upward mobility in the industry and remuneration.

I see. Well, I don't mind going to China or Vietnam, in fact, I've looked into the courses that prep you for going to China and the problem seems to be that airfare is not covered, unlike Korea, which seemed to have paid your ticket. That's something that seems like a pretty big problem. Flying from Europe to China... I don't exactly have a thousand bucks lying around. Maybe I was looking in the wrong places? Is that normal practice for Chinese ESL? What about other countries?
Also, you reckon 1000� and no rent covered, right? Is living normally covered?
wings wrote:
I know of lots of non native speaker teachers working in the EU. The British council, which is one of the best employers, will take non native speakers on but they generally need the DELTA to stand a a chance against native speakers with the CELTA. I'd suggest doing the CELTA first (don't waste any money on an online cert) getting a job in a less fashionable country and doing the DELTA after a couple of years. This will give you a much better chance of finding a good job where you want. Of course your best chance would be to get employed in your country of origin, wherever that may be. if it's a country where the BC have a big presence, for example, they'd be looking for people with the local language to move up into management positions and the like. you could then move to another country at a later stage

Thanks for the BC tip! I'll contact them for further information!
I see a lot of sites offer online TESLs, those'd be much more convenient for me. What's the general feeling for online versus real-life TESL courses, will employers discriminate prefer one of the other? Are online ones a waste of time?
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edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In most countries employers will want teachers to have a qualification which includes assessed practical teaching observations. The two most recognised starter level qualifications that give you this are the CELTA and Trinity. If you want to work in Europe at some stage this is a minimum requirement in most countries. In Korea, China and probably other Asian countries this type of qualification is not a requirement yet but seems to be becoming more and more desirable to employers. If you want to stay in TEFL for more than a couple of years and graduate from entry level type jobs, or work in Europe, I'd strongly recommend the CELTA or Trinity and not an online course. Lots of people do online courses on the cheap to start with and then find themslves in positions where they have to get the CELTA/Trinity at a later stage.
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I once met a gentleman from Nigeria that was teaching at a hagwon under an E-2 visa. So I think it is possible to get a job in one of the many hagwons that dot the Korean landscape.
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adzee1



Joined: 22 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A. K. Tern wrote:
Thank you for replies everybody!
wings wrote:
I met and worked with several ESL teachers in Mexico who were not native speakers.

If you have a high level of English, which you seem to, and you get certification you should be able to find work in Latin America. It would most likely be under the table, but that is not to uncommon even for native speakers.

I think I'd be very scared of working illegally. Especially in a place like Latin America. Even if it's a norm there, I don't suppose I'd be comfortable.



When I worked in Mexico there were people at my school from Holland, Czech Republic and Slovakia all working LEGALLY. As long as you have a TEFL certificate or similar you can apply for and get a FM3 working visa.
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blm



Joined: 11 Nov 2010

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jvalmer wrote:
I once met a gentleman from Nigeria that was teaching at a hagwon under an E-2 visa. So I think it is possible to get a job in one of the many hagwons that dot the Korean landscape.


I know a Nigerian teacher. I'm not a full book on his background but he qualified with a South African citizenship.
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alwaysbeclosing100



Joined: 07 Feb 2009

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:34 am    Post subject: Re: Non-native English speaker - need realistic advice! Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:


You CAN work as an English teacher in most of the rest of East Asia.
You will need an IELTS / TOEIC score (5.5 or 600+). It is or will soon be an immigration /visa requirement in all ASEAN countries because you are not a native speaker.



Do you have a source for this? Thanks for your assistance.....
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 2:30 am    Post subject: Re: Non-native English speaker - need realistic advice! Reply with quote

alwaysbeclosing100 wrote:
ttompatz wrote:


You CAN work as an English teacher in most of the rest of East Asia.
You will need an IELTS / TOEIC score (5.5 or 600+). It is or will soon be an immigration /visa requirement in all ASEAN countries because you are not a native speaker.



Do you have a source for this? Thanks for your assistance.....


China - SAFEA requirements.
Thailand - TCT / MOE (I have 30 non-native speakers on staff at our school and they all had to jump through the hoop for a visa.

http://www.ksp.or.th/Khurusapha/en/khurusapha_NewsPopup.php?newid=35
Requirements:
Verification of a passing score on the Test of TOEIC (except those who come from 5 countries: The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, The United States of America, Commonwealth of Australia, New Zealand and Canada) or passing score on the other foreign language proficiency test.

Indonesia - Kementerian Pendidikan dan Kebudayaan

It will be a requirement for all ASEAN countries after 2015 (discussed with with Dr. Surin Pitsuwan during the 4th Asia Education Leaders Forum last October and confirmed again at a SEAMEO conference last month).

.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

blm wrote:
jvalmer wrote:
I once met a gentleman from Nigeria that was teaching at a hagwon under an E-2 visa. So I think it is possible to get a job in one of the many hagwons that dot the Korean landscape.


I know a Nigerian teacher. I'm not a full book on his background but he qualified with a South African citizenship.


Funny. The Nigerian I met that was teaching also had a number of passports... But they were with different names.
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Keeper



Joined: 11 Jun 2012

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's news to me about the British Council taking anyone not from the UK. I was told by my British CELTA tutor that they only hired people from the UK. He has worked for them for decades.

I do know that if you want a DELTA you must first get the CELTA. That will cost you about 3k (including airfare/accomodations and course). Once you have the CELTA then you will need to teach adults for at least two years before they will accept you into a DELTA course.

I don't want to burst your bubble but I don't want you to get your hopes up either. There are much easier ways for you to get into teaching that going that route.
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edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
That's news to me about the British Council taking anyone not from the UK. I was told by my British CELTA tutor that they only hired people from the UK. He has worked for them for decades.


To be frank, he was talking rubbish. I know of several Australians, Canadians and Americans who work for them here in Seoul for starters.
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