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Already with the heat blaring on the buses.
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Newbie



Joined: 07 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

laynamarya wrote:
I wonder how many of you know this...

When Korean babies are born, they are kept inside for 100 days. The room is kept at 37 degrees Celsius that whole time, the argument being that babies can't withstand the shock of a temperature so much lower than its mama's body. And then, they spend their entire childhoods with their mothers, grandmothers, and random ajummas and halmonis telling them that they "must be cold" and adding layers of clothing, no matter what season it is. (Trust me. I speak from experience.)


While this is still fairly common, it's not the absolute rule that you make it out to be.

Old habits die hard, but they do eventually die!
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PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Newbie wrote:
laynamarya wrote:
I wonder how many of you know this...

When Korean babies are born, they are kept inside for 100 days. The room is kept at 37 degrees Celsius that whole time, the argument being that babies can't withstand the shock of a temperature so much lower than its mama's body. And then, they spend their entire childhoods with their mothers, grandmothers, and random ajummas and halmonis telling them that they "must be cold" and adding layers of clothing, no matter what season it is. (Trust me. I speak from experience.)


While this is still fairly common, it's not the absolute rule that you make it out to be.

Old habits die hard, but they do eventually die!


Indeed.
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laynamarya



Joined: 01 Jan 2010
Location: Gwangjin-gu

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True, I suspect it's much better than it used to be, though somebody always admonishes me when I bring our two-month old outside. And many of the young Korean moms I meet wistfully comment on how much they wanted to go outside when their baby was less than three months old.

But anyway, twenty or thirty years ago, I believe the rule WAS much stricter, and the folks complaining about the cold now are the ones born back then.
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PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="laynamarya"]True, I suspect it's much better than it used to be, though somebody always admonishes me when I bring our two-month old outside. And many of the young Korean moms I meet wistfully comment on how much they wanted to go outside when their baby was less than three months old.

But anyway, twenty or thirty years ago, I believe the rule WAS much stricter, and the folks complaining about the cold now are the ones born back then.[/quote]

I agree.

We got those comments with our babies when we took them out for a stroll in Korea. Mostly it is the general well-meaning, well being comment that Koreans make when they see babies.
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sublunari



Joined: 11 Jun 2009

PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It began yesterday. Chuckling, an old ajoshi came out of nowhere and told me, in Korean, that my toddler was cold---and the very instant he did, I replied in polite but firm Korean that he was not.

The boy won't wear hats, but he was in a stroller under a goddamn blanket with wool socks. I suspect that if I went inside an active volcano with my son and met an old Korean there, we would be informed, immediately, of the boy's intense coldness---even if he were dripping with sweat or actually on fire with flames leaping out of his eyeballs.

It's a knee-jerk reaction for me, now. If a Korean tells me my son is cold, I don't just take it and grumble about it for the rest of the day: I fight back! I had wanted to reply by saying "Your heart is cold", but my Korean wife advised against it as we live in a relatively small city and could run into the same people again.

My wife also spends a lot of time reading Korean forums for moms and international couples and says that other young Koreans are complaining about the same or similar issues. It's always the older generations who feel pressed to inform complete strangers that they are bad parents.
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Gorf



Joined: 25 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, you see, it's only because Koreans care more about children in their community than your country, it is Korean culture, please understand.

Also my apartment is tiny and old, and the entire floor's ondol is controlled by one button out in the hallway. Some jerk keeps cranking up the heat every night to 90 degrees F. My place is sweltering and I have to use the aircon in the winter. I wish I could curbstomp whoever thought it would be a good idea to make the entire floor controlled by one machine.
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PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gorf wrote:
No, you see, it's only because Koreans care more about children in their community than your country, it is Korean culture, please understand.

Also my apartment is tiny and old, and the entire floor's ondol is controlled by one button out in the hallway. Some jerk keeps cranking up the heat every night to 90 degrees F. My place is sweltering and I have to use the aircon in the winter. I wish I could curbstomp whoever thought it would be a good idea to make the entire floor controlled by one machine.


That sucks!

Reminds me of my old apt in Toronto when I was an undergrad. Laughing

The landlord controled the heat for all the apts. He turned it on full blast from October to April. Christ we spent most of the fall, winter and spring with open windows to try and cool down the sauna our apt became. Man I hated those places.

My first apt in Busan had a similar set up and the heat was cranked up all winter long. We keps the balcony windows open and the front room window open to try and create a sort of draft...epic failure! Laughing

As for the comment on Koreans and kids. I do not think they care more, or less about kids than western parents do. They do however express things differently, especially the older folks...such is life my friend.
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Mr. BlackCat



Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gorf wrote:
No, you see, it's only because Koreans care more about children in their community than your country, it is Korean culture, please understand.

Also my apartment is tiny and old, and the entire floor's ondol is controlled by one button out in the hallway. Some jerk keeps cranking up the heat every night to 90 degrees F. My place is sweltering and I have to use the aircon in the winter. I wish I could curbstomp whoever thought it would be a good idea to make the entire floor controlled by one machine.


This reminds me of going on trips with Koreans. Fine, we're going to sleep on the floor. Does the ondol have to be cranked up the whole time? Often times, I'll just sleep on the ondol-less balcony if it's available. I have literally woken up red and sore from the burning heat. How can anyone find that comfortable? We have a school trip coming up and I can look forward to being roasted during the night. It wouldn't be so bad if we weren't forced to sleep on the floor, 10 to a room, like livestock. But I digress.
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rchristo10



Joined: 14 Jul 2009

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sublunari wrote:
It began yesterday. Chuckling, an old ajoshi came out of nowhere and told me, in Korean, that my toddler was cold---and the very instant he did, I replied in polite but firm Korean that he was not.

The boy won't wear hats, but he was in a stroller under a goddamn blanket with wool socks. I suspect that if I went inside an active volcano with my son and met an old Korean there, we would be informed, immediately, of the boy's intense coldness---even if he were dripping with sweat or actually on fire with flames leaping out of his eyeballs.

It's a knee-jerk reaction for me, now. If a Korean tells me my son is cold, I don't just take it and grumble about it for the rest of the day: I fight back! I had wanted to reply by saying "Your heart is cold", but my Korean wife advised against it as we live in a relatively small city and could run into the same people again.

My wife also spends a lot of time reading Korean forums for moms and international couples and says that other young Koreans are complaining about the same or similar issues. It's always the older generations who feel pressed to inform complete strangers that they are bad parents.


Well, I see where you're coming from. But on the flip side, showing concern, positive and negative, can also be a warm sign of endearment in Korean. Often the elderly (but not always) speaker is opening a door through which they can feel useful. Lord knows the elderly don't often feel useful here (powerful, sometimes, but seldom useful). And to be useful to a foreigner!? Well, that's a one-in-a-lifetime gift.

People here just want to be noticed, feel useful, and be acknowledged (regardless of age--could be a homogenous factor, who know?), sometimes to an excessive, extremely unhealthy level.

"Yes, he's likely cold. But well, we're not rich."
"Yes, he's likely cold and I didn't want to take him outside, but well...that's life."
Or "Yeah, he's likely cold so what do you think I should do?" Whether true or not, they all work well in terms of really communicating with said speaker.

I wouldn't take it so literally; a slight change in perspective helps me at least. It took me nearly 10 or so years before I started to realize that the words people (especially elder people) say here in Korea often have nothing to do with what they're thinking. And no, I'm not an apologist.

I know we don't think like this and we shouldn't have to every time someone opens his or her mouth. But honestly, I've been shocked when my friends have the most wonderfully friendly conversations that started off with what I perceived as an attack. It also makes me realize that learning a language can be a bad thing for intercultural relations, especially if you don't understand culture. No wonder Koreans go to places like Detroit (thinking they are) speaking English fluently and leave with a black eye and racial prejudice. Language (or attempts at communicating) is a helluva lot more than words, grammar, cadence, pronunciation, and enunciation.
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