Korean Job Discussion Forums

[T-J]

[nautilus]

[Fox]

Regarding Koreans not understanding foreigners attempts at Korean, I have had plenty of experiences where a Korean said something to me in English (especially when it was just one or two words) when I simply could not figure out what they were saying. In particular, one of the administrators at work will sometimes try a phrase out of their phrase book on me and I am just left with no idea what she said, because her pronunciation is simply beyond awful. These experiences helped me accept that, when I was not understood, it was because my pronunciation was awful, which in turn helped me improve. I am understood much more frequently now.

If you are not being understood, your pronunciation is probably bad. You can either take responsibility and improve, or blame the listener and not improve, but let's get real: if a Korean who tried speaking English to one of us was not understood and then tried to blame our listening skills for it, we would not take them seriously.

[ghostrider]

Most waygooks that come here to teach English here are in it for the money and take little interest in anything Korean. Go to other Asian countries such as Japan or China. Those countries typically don't offer enough financial incentives to attract the mercenary types so you'll find a different kind of waygook. You'll find many more waygooks who take an interest in their host country and its language.

[Privateer]

[littlelisa]

[littlelisa]

Also I find it weird that I am so accepting of all sorts of accents in English, and generally even like most accents, but cringe at bad pronunciation of Korean or Chinese.

[Mr. BlackCat]

I think Westerners tend to learn other Asian languages basically because Chinese and Japanese are much more important internationally. I'm not saying that to insult Korea, but in business and in culture, knowing Japanese or Chinese (either Mandarin or even Cantonese) is much more beneficial outside the home country. Fact of life. I'm sure high schools and colleges across North America (and probably Europe and other places) have many more Japanese and Chinese classes than Korean. Add to that there are many more Japanese and Chinese in the world, it's like wondering why more people choose to learn French or German instead of Flemish even if they live in Belgium.

As for learning Korean here, I know enough to get by but have very little motivation to go further. I went back home for a year and the only opportunity I had to speak Korean was in a couple of restaurants and stores in K-town where I was laughed at for my effort. Even in class here, saying a student's proper name elicits rabid laughter from students and co-teachers alike.

I've known lots of foreigners here who have put great effort into learning Korean extensively and the only ones who thought it paid off were the ones who eventually married a Korean. More than a couple have told me it was the biggest waste of time, money and effort they'd ever spent. On the flip side I've known a few friends who came from Japan or China (one even from Thailand) who take pride in their language knowledge and still use it here. I agree if you stay here a couple of years you should probably know how to read/write and basic phrases, but I can understand from experience how the locals can discourage your use.

If you want to learn the Korean language more power to you. But many people here don't have the same desire or goals. Learning a language is never a waste of time, but some people use their time to develop other skills, that's all.

[figshdg]

[PatrickGHBusan]

Reading a lot of excuses about what is preventing a person from learning Korean.

Seriously, a lot of learners over estimate the clarity of their pronounciation and get angry when they are not understood. That is normal in the early stages. Also, the only way to get clean and understandable pronounciation is to practice a lot.

Then you add the fact that in large part Koreans do not expect a foreigner to speak their language because, frankly, Korean is not a world famous language and you can get confusion.

The only way to improve is to keep at it.

[fustiancorduroy]

To answer the OPs question: not too many, but some. In the six years I've been here, I've known about 6 Westerners, not including the ones I've met in my Korean classes, who spoke "decent" (I assume you mean at a high beginner or low intermediate level and above) Korean. All of them benefited from their Korean ability both personally and professionally.

As for me, I speak reasonably good Korean. In the past few days I've used my Korean to open and compare different savings accounts at my bank, call the gas company to discontinue my service, confirm my 관리비 payments for my place, call used furniture and appliance shops, describing to them the items I want to sell, and more. I can't carry on a deep conversation. I can't follow the news or even most TV shows. But I can carry on light conversations and do what I need to do each day without having to rely on Korean friends.

When I first came to Korea, I'd use my Lonely Planet Korean Phrasebook and just go out and practice continuously. I'd ask 아줌마s at Lotte Mart where the eggs are. I'd ask the cute 아가씨s displaying products in the same Lotte Mart if they had a boyfriend, just for fun. I'd talk to my taxi drivers, asking them about different places to go, if they had children, how old they were, etc. I'd practice the same phrases over and over until I'd memorized them and was able to pronounce them reasonably well. I practiced like that for about a year and a half. Since taking a Korean course for one semester at Sogang last year, I hadn't really studied Korean too much. I'd like to speak better Korean -- it would only benefit me as far as I can tell -- but for now I'm happy with my current Korean speaking level.

As for being understood, well... I'd say people understand me around 85 to 90 percent of the time. When people don't understand me, it's either because: A) I'm making a fairly difficult sentence and my grammar and/or word choice is awkward or B) the listener is not very educated or intelligent. Most of the time, if I repeat myself once more or simply rephrase my statement, I am understood.

[mike in brasil]

Context is importantly.

If they are trying to collect $$ from you or you want to spend $$, they are gonna bed over backwards to communicate with you in Korean.

I've also found that the best people to practice on are those who speak(or don't want to speak) no English at all.

Can a foreigner get along without learning the language? Yes, they can, but the more Korean you know, the better your life will be in 조선.

I've learned many languages in my short lifetime, but I've found Spanish and Portuguese the most useful, as a N. Americano.

Puta que pariu~

[coralreefer_1]

Ive met quite a few foreigners who I would consider to speak well (can form complete sentences on various topics) With that said and in reference to another posters comments about their friend saying it seems more foreigners speak Korean these day, I believe that is more of a result of foreign students coming here to study in the universities, thereby most of whom are going through several semesters of Korean Language training prior to beginning their BA/Graduate studies.


I sat through thesis presentations just this past Friday, and watched two Chinese students give full 20 minute presentations in Korean..and they did quite well. As someone else mentioned, many in the ESL crowd see little to no benefit of putting in much effort to learn the language (and there is nothing wrong with that)

Up in Seoul, I think there are alot more "westerners" who seem to be becoming more and more proficient in Korean..which is a great thing to see. I say that not because I think westerns should learn Korean if they are here, but because the more westerners there are that can speak at a decent level, the more we westerners can communicate, build relations with, and hopefully end the stigma that all Westerners here are military or ESL teachers (and all the gruff that comes from Korean with those labels)

Just a simple observation of mine concerning accent. Back in 2007 when I was studying in a full time Korean program, people would ask or otherwise assume I was a teacher. For example, I would get in a taxi and say quite well " xxx 가주십시오" and the owner would remain quiet until he got settled into traffic..then ask "English teacher?"...to which I would reply in Korean..."no, foreign student at x university"..etc. I noticed quickly that typically their attitude changed when they learned I wasnt a teacher.

That was back when my Korean ability in general, and in particular pronunciation was at a level that many teachers who were putting in actual effort would be.


These days however, in the same situation, I very rarely get asked by Koreans if I am a teacher...and I honestly think that is a direct result of my Korean ability and accent being at a point they they pretty much guess that I must be doing something else in Korea.

The point of this story is not to trump my Korean ability, but rather to expose the sad reality that many Koreans equate lack of Korean ability with teaching English, military, or otherwise a tourist, which I think says something not so flattering about the perception of ESL teachers. Do many ESL people care or are otherwise concerned about that? Probably not...but this has been my observation.

[aq8knyus]

[coralreefer_1]