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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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 Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| 12ax7 wrote: |
| No known gangsters? Just branches of US gangs? |
Yes. Obviously. Nobody has heard of or cares about any Canadian gangsters. Hardly a surprise, since there aren't any that are powerful enough to matter. Not that it's anything for Canadians to be ashamed of (pretty hilarious seeing you try to "defend" against this claim as if it were a point of pride).
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| And biker gangs in the US are tame in comparison to the ones we have in Canada. |
Now that is funny! Really, thanks for the laugh! |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
But that argument can be said about Canada in almost every aspect - America-lite.
Drugs
Gangs
Wars
Rich ppl
Poor ppl
Part of this can be explained away because of population and density differences... but there's obviously more than that. They are very similar in their structures, yet there are differences. Differences in how they handle health and mental health care, drugs, wars... ect... we all know it.
Personally, I think it all started as the US was forming... quite a different tale than the slow, belaboured nationhood that Canada grew into.
To simply say it's a market size thing, or a population thing, maybe misses out on so much more. |
Well, was is it really a slow and boring ride to Confederation?
Don't forget the Rebellion/Revolution of 1837, the Red River Rebellion and the North-West Rebellion. |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:42 am Post subject: |
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Chicago:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-chicago-2012-homicide-toll-20121228,0,5456581.story
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| Jackson was standing outside a store in the Austin neighborhood around 9 p.m. Thursday when someone walked up and shot him in the head, police said. His death was the 500th homicide in Chicago this year, marking a grim milestone. The city last reached that toll in 2008. |
500. Wow.
Steve Sailer:
http://takimag.com/article/monsters_of_egotism_steve_sailer/print#ixzz2FWAizpxa
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What happened to the crime rate as the number of guns in private possession grew over the last twenty years? It plummeted. Perhaps the Korean shopkeepers in South-Central had the smarter idea?
Guns for self-defense make sense out in the country, where police response times are slow and the chances of accidentally plugging a neighbor are low. Yet just as stringent gun control would leave rural dwellers as vulnerable to home invasions as they are in disarmed England, it�s by no means absurd for urban white liberals to look to gun-control laws to help them take back their cities.
Chicago has tried gun control as a sincere tactic:
Since the early 1970s, Chicago and its suburban municipalities have taken a national lead in enacting firearms control legislation.
So far, that hasn�t worked.
New York City, in contrast, has used gun control as part of a comprehensive strategy to persecute blacks and Puerto Ricans while pretending that they need gun control to protect themselves from white rural conservatives.
In reality, the city has done a remarkable job of reducing its African American male population by having cops stop and frisk young black men, sending them up the river if they are packing without one of the city�s few thousand concealed-carry permits that are allowed to the rich and famous. In 2011, for example, the NYPD stopped 684,000 pedestrians, 87 percent of them black or Latino. You can read about how successful Mayor Bloomberg�s program has been in Bloomberg News.
If you are wondering why New York City is allowed to follow such a flagrantly discriminatory course of action, the answer is because it�s New York City and important people live there�people such as crime-fighting billionaire Michael Bloomberg. |
http://isteve.blogspot.com/2012/12/bloomberg-gun-control-and-stop-and-frisk.html
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In other words, Bloomberg has a comprehensive strategy to maximize real estate values in New York City by pushing out as many "young men" = youths = ... and otherwise neutralize their ability to cause homicidal problems as much as possible. Chicago under Mayor Emanuel is trying much the same thing, but is so far botching the execution, with the remaining Chicago youths shooting each other in numbers large enough to put some second thoughts into gentrifiers.
As Mayor Rahm might say, never let a crisis go to waste. It would be nice to not let the crisis of an uptick in the number of spectacular suicide terrorist shootings go to waste in the long term game of undoing the Great Migration and gentrifying the supercities. Obviously, these media frenzy shootings constitute a tiny percentage of all gun deaths, but white on white mass shootings are too mediagenic to allow to go to waste. |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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| visitorq wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| No known gangsters? Just branches of US gangs? |
Yes. Obviously. Nobody has heard of or cares about any Canadian gangsters. Hardly a surprise, since there aren't any that are powerful enough to matter. Not that it's anything for Canadians to be ashamed of (pretty hilarious seeing you try to "defend" against this claim as if it were a point of pride).
| Quote: |
| And biker gangs in the US are tame in comparison to the ones we have in Canada. |
Now that is funny! Really, thanks for the laugh! |
No, you don't know about these guys because they aren't American. Don't forget, the American media sensationalises what takes place in it's own backyard because that's what sells. Read the links I provided again.
And yes, a few bikers shooting at each other in a casino is tame in comparision to setting off car bombs, which is what they did in Quebec. |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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| 12ax7 wrote: |
No, you don't know about these guys because they aren't American. Don't forget, the American media sensationalises what takes place in it's own backyard because that's what sells. Read the links I provided again.
And yes, a few bikers shooting at each other in a casino is tame in comparision to setting off car bombs, which is what they did in Quebec. |
Your portrayal of Canadian gangs as the ultimate bad-asses is truly comedic gold. Nobody has heard of Canadian gangsters because you could probably count the number of them on your fingers  assuming you even had the inclination to waste your time doing so. They're simply not important enough for anyone to care. Canadian gangsters are so tame that when they're foolish enough to go down to Mexico to try and deal with real gangsters they get eaten for breakfast (I posted a link earlier).
Mexican gangsters are off the charts dangerous (over 50 thousand dead since 2006 fighting amongst them and the government). US gangsters are not quite as off the charts, but still deadly serious (think Bloods and Crips or the Chicago mob). "Canadian gangsters" actually sounds pretty funny - almost like a contradiction in terms. |
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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If its okay for the NYPD to arbitrarily stop Black and Latino males because of a stat. Even if they are obviously college kids in many cases who've been stopped multiple times. And lets be honest here, the run of the mill
Black street thug and a Black econ major at NYU aren't dressing and acting the same and be worried about the cop who can't spot the differences.
I would also guess, although gentrifried to an extent that the Irish Americans in Hell's Kitchen and Five Points where the particuarly vicious Westies and other gangs are located and whose members are in large numbers in NY prisons are also packing a high percentage of illegal firearms as well. Don't see the cops there.
Anyway, if that is okay then isnt it just as reasonable for the NYPD (and the FBI) to arbitrarily investigate Italian Americans in NYC for ties to organized crime, even where no evidence exists, as well as the financial crimes/white collar division of the NYPD (and the SEC) to arbitrarily investigate Jewish wall street execs since statiscally Jews have committed the lions share of insider trading and other white collar crimes? Why not arbitrarily investigate the databases of males who watch porn and key in certain key words like 'teen' or 'young' in case they are pedos.
Basically, any group that dominates the statistic of a certain crime, arbitrarily investigate them in a similar manner?
Hugely successful and at what cost (constitutionally)?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/13/nypd-stop-and-frisks-15-shocking-facts_n_1513362.html
The NYPD and politicians have repeatedly justified the racial disparity in stop and frisks saying that they cops essentially go where the guns are, i.e. minority neighborhoods. Yet, only 1.9 percent of frisks in 2011 turned up weapons and interestingly, according to the NYCLU, "a weapon was found in only 1.8 percent of blacks and Latinos frisked, as compared to a weapon being found in 3.8 percent of whites frisked."
also
With Huge Increase In Stop And Frisks, Only Minor Increase In Guns Found
and
In Brownsville, Brooklyn In 2009, 93 Out Of Every 100 Residents Were Stopped By The NYPD
as well as
Nine out of 10 of those stopped in 2011 were neither arrested nor given summonses.
Finally, in lawsuit happy America, it may end up to be costly. there is so much room for abuse as well.
In the month of January alone, more than three dozen lawsuits alleging improper stop-and-frisks were filed, based on a Voice reading of the complaints. Extrapolated, that means that the city could be sued more than 400 times this year alone just on improper stops.
If each case settles for a minimum of $10,000, that's at least $4 million in cost to taxpayers, not including the cost to the police department in work hours assembling the documents and removing cops from the street to be deposed, and the cost to the corporation counsel in paying lawyers to defend those cases. |
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Spartacist
Joined: 18 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| How about stopping and frisking white males, as they're responsible for most mass shootings? |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Spartacist wrote: |
| How about stopping and frisking white males, as they're responsible for most mass shootings? |
Cho seung hui, Jiverly Wong, John Allen Muhammad/Lee Malvo, Omar Thornton, Nidal Malik Hasan (off the top of my head).
One would expect most to be white, given the demographics of the USA. As a tool for profiling, it isn't useful. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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| How about we just accept that "New York City" is not how humans should live? |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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| sirius black wrote: |
| If its okay for the NYPD to arbitrarily stop Black and Latino males because of a stat. Even if they are obviously college kids in many cases who've been stopped multiple times. And lets be honest here, the run of the mill Black street thug and a Black econ major at NYU aren't dressing and acting the same and be worried about the cop who can't spot the differences. |
Stop and frisk works. Hostility to it reminds me of how liberal people think of de-colonialism.
http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2008/04/open-letter-to-open-minded-progressives.html
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Here, for example, is a Times story on the fight against malaria. Often, as with politicians, journalists speak the truth in a fit of absent-mindedness, when their real concern is something else.
If you read the story, you might notice the same astounding graf that I did:
And the world changed. Before the 1960s, colonial governments and companies fought malaria because their officials often lived in remote outposts like Nigeria�s hill stations and Vietnam�s Marble Mountains. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
Let�s focus on that last sentence. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
I often find it useful to imagine that I�m an alien from the planet Jupiter. If I read this sentence, I would ask: what is this word freedom? What, exactly, does this writer mean by freedom? Especially in the context of civil war, poverty, and corrupt government?
What we see here is that independence movements � which the writer clearly believes are a good thing � led to some very concrete and very, very awful results, in addition to this curious abstraction � freedom. Clearly, whatever freedom means in this particular context, it�s such a great positive that even when you add it to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care, the result still exceeds zero.
Isn�t that strange? Might we not be tempted to revisit this particular piece of arithmetic? But we can�t � because if we postulate that colonial governments and companies (whatever these were), with their absence of freedom, were somehow preferable to independence movements, which created this same freedom (the words freedom and independence appear to be synonyms in this context), we are off the progressive reservation.
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| You can "fix" pretty much anything once you remove your constitutional rights. |
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Koharski
Mod Team
Joined: 20 Jul 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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One more post about Canadian bikers, or Mexican gangsters and who is badder, this thread is nuked. Please discuss this topic as adults, or it is gone.
Koharski |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Titus wrote: |
| sirius black wrote: |
| If its okay for the NYPD to arbitrarily stop Black and Latino males because of a stat. Even if they are obviously college kids in many cases who've been stopped multiple times. And lets be honest here, the run of the mill Black street thug and a Black econ major at NYU aren't dressing and acting the same and be worried about the cop who can't spot the differences. |
Stop and frisk works. Hostility to it reminds me of how liberal people think of de-colonialism.
http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2008/04/open-letter-to-open-minded-progressives.html
| Quote: |
Here, for example, is a Times story on the fight against malaria. Often, as with politicians, journalists speak the truth in a fit of absent-mindedness, when their real concern is something else.
If you read the story, you might notice the same astounding graf that I did:
And the world changed. Before the 1960s, colonial governments and companies fought malaria because their officials often lived in remote outposts like Nigeria�s hill stations and Vietnam�s Marble Mountains. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
Let�s focus on that last sentence. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
I often find it useful to imagine that I�m an alien from the planet Jupiter. If I read this sentence, I would ask: what is this word freedom? What, exactly, does this writer mean by freedom? Especially in the context of civil war, poverty, and corrupt government?
What we see here is that independence movements � which the writer clearly believes are a good thing � led to some very concrete and very, very awful results, in addition to this curious abstraction � freedom. Clearly, whatever freedom means in this particular context, it�s such a great positive that even when you add it to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care, the result still exceeds zero.
Isn�t that strange? Might we not be tempted to revisit this particular piece of arithmetic? But we can�t � because if we postulate that colonial governments and companies (whatever these were), with their absence of freedom, were somehow preferable to independence movements, which created this same freedom (the words freedom and independence appear to be synonyms in this context), we are off the progressive reservation.
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Ah, good old White Man's Burden. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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| catman wrote: |
| Titus wrote: |
| sirius black wrote: |
| If its okay for the NYPD to arbitrarily stop Black and Latino males because of a stat. Even if they are obviously college kids in many cases who've been stopped multiple times. And lets be honest here, the run of the mill Black street thug and a Black econ major at NYU aren't dressing and acting the same and be worried about the cop who can't spot the differences. |
Stop and frisk works. Hostility to it reminds me of how liberal people think of de-colonialism.
http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2008/04/open-letter-to-open-minded-progressives.html
| Quote: |
Here, for example, is a Times story on the fight against malaria. Often, as with politicians, journalists speak the truth in a fit of absent-mindedness, when their real concern is something else.
If you read the story, you might notice the same astounding graf that I did:
And the world changed. Before the 1960s, colonial governments and companies fought malaria because their officials often lived in remote outposts like Nigeria�s hill stations and Vietnam�s Marble Mountains. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
Let�s focus on that last sentence. Independence movements led to freedom, but also often to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care.
I often find it useful to imagine that I�m an alien from the planet Jupiter. If I read this sentence, I would ask: what is this word freedom? What, exactly, does this writer mean by freedom? Especially in the context of civil war, poverty, and corrupt government?
What we see here is that independence movements � which the writer clearly believes are a good thing � led to some very concrete and very, very awful results, in addition to this curious abstraction � freedom. Clearly, whatever freedom means in this particular context, it�s such a great positive that even when you add it to civil war, poverty, corrupt government and the collapse of medical care, the result still exceeds zero.
Isn�t that strange? Might we not be tempted to revisit this particular piece of arithmetic? But we can�t � because if we postulate that colonial governments and companies (whatever these were), with their absence of freedom, were somehow preferable to independence movements, which created this same freedom (the words freedom and independence appear to be synonyms in this context), we are off the progressive reservation.
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Ah, good old White Man's Burden. |
No mention of how the arbitrary borders that put competing tribes and ethnic groups effected the outcome, or how the international system demands that colonial borders become the defacto borders regardless of realities on the ground. The only thing keeping the sham countries together where strongman colonial governments, so the eventual outcomes are easy to predict. Not to mention that international corporations are still using former colonies like they did before the independence movement, or that former colonial powers often picked winners and losers in regard to which group would replace them. Yes, thank god for the Europeans.
In a more related topic, it turns out that the guy who shot the firefighters was sold the guns by a neighbors daughter. I hope that the legal consequences are sever. If people are going to have the rights to purchase fire arms, then they need to have the corresponding responsibilities, and making an example might help stop other people from casually arming felons and the like. |
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