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warmachinenkorea
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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 Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| schwa wrote: |
| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| They don't dominate in anything else except some winter olympic sports. |
How about archery, fencing, & shooting? They cleaned up at the last olympics. |
My mistake. They train like crazy in all sports and win a few non-athletic (besides fencing and the winter olympic) sports
In sports many Korean coaches still hold to the quantity over quality like they do in the classroom. My first school was an all boys school with a Rugby team. The players ate breakfast at 9 lifted weight after, they didn't even have a squat rack or deadlift bar, ate lunch, took a nap and then practiced from about 1-5 almost everyday. The practices were a bunch of kids standing around while a few were getting reps. I've seen this in baseball, basketball, and track too. There are plenty of coaches in the US who do similar stuff also. But I think there is more to it than practice. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| schwa wrote: |
| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| They don't dominate in anything else except some winter olympic sports. |
How about archery, fencing, & shooting? They cleaned up at the last olympics. |
My mistake. They train like crazy in all sports and win a few non-athletic (besides fencing and the winter olympic) sports
In sports many Korean coaches still hold to the quantity over quality like they do in the classroom. My first school was an all boys school with a Rugby team. The players ate breakfast at 9 lifted weight after, they didn't even have a squat rack or deadlift bar, ate lunch, took a nap and then practiced from about 1-5 almost everyday. The practices were a bunch of kids standing around while a few were getting reps. I've seen this in baseball, basketball, and track too. There are plenty of coaches in the US who do similar stuff also. But I think there is more to it than practice. |
Koreans have done well in baseball, their U-23 soccer team got bronze, swimming, weightlifting, judo, taekwondo, boxing, gymnastics, a Korean was one of the last non-Jamaican/African people to win the (oof) Boston Marathon, and some others.
I dunno about you, but weightlifting, boxing, gymnastics, marathon, and judo seem pretty athletic to me. |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| schwa wrote: |
| everything-is-everything wrote: |
Why do Korean women dominate the LPGA?
Ethiopians dominate long distance running and Americans dominate basketball.
But I'm curious, what factors have lead to the dominance of Korean golfers in the LPGA? |
Interesting question. Deftness with chopsticks?
I'd put my money on hard training young. A tiny rural elementary school I worked in last year was golf-centered, had its own driving range, a dedicated coach, & streamed promising students into secondary schools with serious golf programs. Focused development. Anything like that going on in your home country? |
Korea does this kind of training in all sports. They don't dominate in anything else except some winter olympic sports. |
Actually, Korea doesn't do this kind of training in all sports.
They don't have the facilities for most sports.
As others have correctly pointed out, golf is big business in Korea.
The golf courses in Korea are beyond what the average person can afford to play on.
This is one area where these girls have a huge advantage...playing on pro level courses from the time they are old enough to swing a club. |
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warmachinenkorea
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| schwa wrote: |
| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
| They don't dominate in anything else except some winter olympic sports. |
How about archery, fencing, & shooting? They cleaned up at the last olympics. |
My mistake. They train like crazy in all sports and win a few non-athletic (besides fencing and the winter olympic) sports
In sports many Korean coaches still hold to the quantity over quality like they do in the classroom. My first school was an all boys school with a Rugby team. The players ate breakfast at 9 lifted weight after, they didn't even have a squat rack or deadlift bar, ate lunch, took a nap and then practiced from about 1-5 almost everyday. The practices were a bunch of kids standing around while a few were getting reps. I've seen this in baseball, basketball, and track too. There are plenty of coaches in the US who do similar stuff also. But I think there is more to it than practice. |
Koreans have done well in baseball, their U-23 soccer team got bronze, swimming, weightlifting, judo, taekwondo, boxing, gymnastics, a Korean was one of the last non-Jamaican/African people to win the (oof) Boston Marathon, and some others.
I dunno about you, but weightlifting, boxing, gymnastics, marathon, and judo seem pretty athletic to me. |
A random medal here and there is not domination like people are talking about with women's golf. 40 players in the LPGA is a big number and they probably represents the largest ethnic group on the tour.
Korea has done well in baseball not because they're good but because the best players in hte world don't paly for their countries. They practice baseball all the time in specialized schools from MS through college.
Olympic weight lifting is started in elementary school here.
Gymnastics are the same. We do this in the States too.
Soccer is done the same as golf, baseball, basketball etc. They have specialized schools, many times public, where the players don't have to attend class and practice all day.
Judo is the same.
Archery the same.
I can't speak for the winter olympic sports as I have no experience with those.
My wife and I taught an English Camp at the Physical Education MS/HS for Gyeongbuk. The kids don't go to any classes after lunch and train in the morning before school and the rest of the day after lunch. Their sports were track and field, boxing, judo, archery (I personally know the MS and HS coaches) swimming, and volleyball I'm sure I missed a some. Korean schools have the facilites to do what they want. If a facility isn't available to the school either by the school or by the community then they don't offer that sport.
A few Korean colleges offer football.
There's more to it than just practice. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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There's a lot to go over in your post...
First, the baseball
| Quote: |
| Korea has done well in baseball not because they're good but because the best players in hte world don't paly for their countries. |
Several points
1)Not all of the best players for Korea and Japan played as well. Every one of the top teams had some guys who didn't play.
2)The Dominican, Venezuelan, and Cuban teams always have very good participation rates.
3)"The best countries in the world" is not the U.S. It is a Big Four of U.S., Japan, Venezuela, and the D.R. Right behind that is Cuba. Then you have Taiwan, S. Korea, and Puerto Rico. The last 3 teams are more "dark horses" but them winning is no big surprise. Think Portugal or Russia or Poland winning the Euros.
4)The way international baseball is structured, it gives a greater chance for upsets as often you use single elimination.
5)Baseball, of all the sports, is probably the easiest one to score an upset in single elimination. This is a sport where a good hitter gets a hit 30% of the time and a bad one gets one 23% of the time. A good fielder gets the ball 98% of the time, a bad one 96%. And of course, the batter v. pitcher dynamic heavily favors the pitcher in first time contests.
6)Kids from all over the world play baseball in specialized schools. There are schools all over Venezuela and the DR trying to scoop up teenagers there and get them playing for the majors.
Anyone who truly knows baseball knows that there is nothing "shocking" about the results.
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| Soccer is done the same as golf, baseball, basketball etc. They have specialized schools, many times public, where the players don't have to attend class and practice all day. |
They still attend some classes. The people coming out of there aren't illiterate dunces.
And what's wrong with specialized schools? Better that the athletes go to a special school so the athletics budget doesn't drain other programs, unlike back home where millions are spent on the football and basketball teams while kids learn out of textbooks talking about our president, Bill Clinton. And putting questions marks after statements like "Next, Online shopping?" or "Our future: Video phones?"
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Please, spare us the tired 1980s bull about our humble student athletes competing against the state-built monsters. How the US and the developed world can somehow claim to be at a disadvantage is preposterous.
Yes, the East Germans were churning out roided monsters. Guess what, turns out we were too.
Sports factory schools? What are all these kids from the ghetto doing at $40,000/yr. suburban private schools? Academics? Please. No government backing? Look at public universities and the sports cash cow.
And please spare me the bull of "At least they study". We all know about grade fixing, not to mention you have teachers that are flat out afraid to fail anyone thanks to "everyone must win" bureaucratic policies. |
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warmachinenkorea
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
There's a lot to go over in your post...
First, the baseball
| Quote: |
| Korea has done well in baseball not because they're good but because the best players in hte world don't paly for their countries. |
Several points
1)Not all of the best players for Korea and Japan played as well. Every one of the top teams had some guys who didn't play.
2)The Dominican, Venezuelan, and Cuban teams always have very good participation rates.
3)"The best countries in the world" is not the U.S. It is a Big Four of U.S., Japan, Venezuela, and the D.R. Right behind that is Cuba. Then you have Taiwan, S. Korea, and Puerto Rico. The last 3 teams are more "dark horses" but them winning is no big surprise. Think Portugal or Russia or Poland winning the Euros.
4)The way international baseball is structured, it gives a greater chance for upsets as often you use single elimination.
5)Baseball, of all the sports, is probably the easiest one to score an upset in single elimination. This is a sport where a good hitter gets a hit 30% of the time and a bad one gets one 23% of the time. A good fielder gets the ball 98% of the time, a bad one 96%. And of course, the batter v. pitcher dynamic heavily favors the pitcher in first time contests.
6)Kids from all over the world play baseball in specialized schools. There are schools all over Venezuela and the DR trying to scoop up teenagers there and get them playing for the majors.
Anyone who truly knows baseball knows that there is nothing "shocking" about the results.
==================================
| Quote: |
| Soccer is done the same as golf, baseball, basketball etc. They have specialized schools, many times public, where the players don't have to attend class and practice all day. |
They still attend some classes. The people coming out of there aren't illiterate dunces.
And what's wrong with specialized schools? Better that the athletes go to a special school so the athletics budget doesn't drain other programs, unlike back home where millions are spent on the football and basketball teams while kids learn out of textbooks talking about our president, Bill Clinton. And putting questions marks after statements like "Next, Online shopping?" or "Our future: Video phones?"
===========================================
Please, spare us the tired 1980s bull about our humble student athletes competing against the state-built monsters. How the US and the developed world can somehow claim to be at a disadvantage is preposterous.
Yes, the East Germans were churning out roided monsters. Guess what, turns out we were too.
Sports factory schools? What are all these kids from the ghetto doing at $40,000/yr. suburban private schools? Academics? Please. No government backing? Look at public universities and the sports cash cow.
And please spare me the bull of "At least they study". We all know about grade fixing, not to mention you have teachers that are flat out afraid to fail anyone thanks to "everyone must win" bureaucratic policies. |
Please show me where I said anything about any of the stuff you've mentioned above.
I said Korea has specialized schools for many if not all sports. I mentioned what I've seen first hand and talked to Korean adults about. There is more to Korean females than just practice, practice, practice, dominating the LPGA. I know you feel the need to defend Korea when you think someone is picking on them but I've not done that.
Last edited by warmachinenkorea on Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:22 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| warmachinenkorea wrote: |
Judo is the same.
Archery the same.
Korean schools have the facilites to do what they want. If a facility isn't available to the school either by the school or by the community then they don't offer that sport.
There's more to it than just practice. |
Yes, there is a lot more to it than just practice.
It takes a lot of money.
Sending a child to a sports school doesn't come close to what parents are doing for some of these golf prodigies.
Daily training yes...with pro golfers...private lessons all day.
Specialized training facilities with dorms...not schools.
Just golf...all day...and all pro level equipment and courses.
The amount of money being invested in training these golfers is truly staggering.
Most sports can't offer the kind of atmosphere it takes to replicate very real conditions all day to train the mind for real play.
With enough money...golf can. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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Basically the parents are enabling the kids to fulfill their dreams and providing them with the best equipment and training out there.
I think it has to do with practice, time, investment, and culture.
Golf is "up there" on the list of sports (or hobbies for the haters), relative to other sports, similar to badminton or ping-pong or baseball or taekwondo. Back home tennis is bigger, so is basketball, and other sports. I think that has quite a bit to do with it as well. |
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warmachinenkorea
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| There's got to be more. Kids in the Caribbean use old warped bats card board make shift gloves on rocky fields to play baseball. Damien Lillard said he learned how to shoot a basketball on a tree limb(no goal just the limb) in his grandparent's front yard. Michael Jordan probably shot more shots in his backyard than he did in a gym. Spending money and time doesn't mean a particular ethnic group will dominate a sport. |
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