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War Eagle
Joined: 15 Feb 2009
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 Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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Wow. I wonder how some of you muster the courage to walk outside everyday. When you watch CSI and someone kills themselves, do you get angry at Dlck Wolf?
EDIT: This was bothering me all day  Dlck Wolf is Law & Order, Jerry Bruckheimer does CSI.
Last edited by War Eagle on Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| crescent wrote: |
Now you are comparing distasteful jokes to a global advertisement that makes light of suicide? You can't understand the difference?
I suppose not, since you also seem to be saying that someone close has committed suicide, yet you are not bothered by the ad?
Of course the ad isn't comedic. That doesn't mean it doesn't trivialize a very serious issue that affects many. |
Jokes/Scenes in Movies/Scenes in Ads/PSAs/Magazine Ads/Newspaper Headlines/Music Videos/TV Shows- Anything I left out?
Anything in the media. You would basically have to not deal with any form of media if you didn't want to be "hurt" by coming across a scene that reminded you of tragic death and/or suicide.
I'm not bothered by the ad for the same reason that I can still watch a movie with violence or a police drama or anything else that deals with the ways in which I have lost loved ones- suicide, murder, war, accident, disease.
May I ask why this ad bothers you so much and not say, a movie or a TV show that depicts such things? Are you offended by Family Guy or South Park and when they joke about death?
And speaking of trivializing an issue- Is the issue of climate change a trivial one? Is the human race self-inflicting serious harm and potential catastrophic loss of life on itself by its actions regarding vehicle emissions? If so, then an ad depicting the theme of an individual human self-inflicting catastrophic harm on onesself and an alternative preventing that is very appropriate.
If you don't believe in climate change and the dangers of vehicle omission, fine. On the other hand if you do believe that those are serious issues, and the logic extension is the enormous potential for damage those dangers pose, then you must agree that this is not a trivial matter.
Would it be wrong if Phillip-Morris did such an ad for say, a carcinogen-free cigarette it developed, and using the theme of cancer and death? Why is it okay to put shocking photos of smokers lungs warning people of dangers but its wrong for Hyundai to do a shocking ad driving home the point of the danger of emissions?
Sure its a company trying to pitch a car, but its driving home a serious point. |
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everything-is-everything
Joined: 06 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:34 am Post subject: |
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I like comedy and film as much as the next guy and can appreciate an artist pushing the limits.
I can also somewhat respect and advertiser for doing the same thing.
But this add is morbid and does not fit the corporate image of Hyundai at all. |
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everything-is-everything
Joined: 06 Jun 2011
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:39 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Actually, when I defend this place I use facts, not just my biased feelings.
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Your own bias and inability to separate you own insecurity based emotions come before these "fact" at times.
Therefor you simply cannot be taken seriously.
You've become the same poster you rally against. And you're weak defense on this thread only further buries you. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:48 am Post subject: |
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| everything-is-everything wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
Actually, when I defend this place I use facts, not just my biased feelings.
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Your own bias and inability to separate you own insecurity based emotions come before these "fact" at times.
Therefor you simply cannot be taken seriously.
You've become the same poster you rally against. And you're weak defense on this thread only further buries you. |
Again, attack the poster and not the issue. No mention of vehicle emission data. No comments on the direction and film work in the advertisement. Nope, just talk about Ol Steelie and his "issues'. Here's an issue- Stick to the issues.
Care to address Scorpion's claim about Korean cars emitting more noxious fumes and emissions? What facts does he have to back it up? I've already stated how there are far greater numbers of cleaner running LPG vehicles here than back home. But apparently those statistics mean nothing.
If the ad wasn't about emissions, but just a normal car ad, I'd agree that it was insensitive and idiotic.
However, again, I believe that climate change is a serious enough issue to warrant such a shocking ad. Do you? Or do you believe climate change is a trivial matter? Do you believe that the effects of climate change will be trivial? |
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crescent
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: yes.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:50 am Post subject: |
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Ah now I see where you're coming from. I find shows like Family Guy and South Park not offensive, but overly dull and mindless. TV for the most part is like that, but dimwitted shows like those are extremely boring and annoying to me.
But, taste is beside the point. It's clear that you insist on lumping a variety of things in together despite the fact that they are extremely different.
This is mirrored by the ludicrous parallels you just drew between this ad and other possible ones. You seem to need this explained, but I know from experience that doing so just spirals into more and more of the same preposterousness. Much like Family Guy, it's not something I'm interested in.
But yes, the ad does make a serious point. You can't kill yourself with fumes from a clean emissions car. Genius. Almost as genius as the guy in the ad forgetting that he just bought a car like that, and still tried to kill himself with it. I want to buy that car now! |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| crescent wrote: |
| kill yourself with fumes from a clean emissions car. Almost as genius as the guy in the ad forgetting that he just bought a car like that, and still tried to kill himself with it. I want to buy that car now! |
Maybe he didn't buy the car. Maybe it was his brother's or parents' house. Or maybe he bought the car without even considering its emission levels like the vast majority of car buyers. Or maybe in his depressed,suicidal state he wasn't thinking clearly and forgot that the car he bought was eco-freindly. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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but dimwitted shows like those are extremely boring and annoying to me.
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Rumpole of the Bailey or Homicide:Life on the Street they are not.
And I wasn't coming strictly from those two shows, but media in general. If an ad played on Romeo & Juliet's suicide, should I be offended and hysterical?
| Quote: |
| This is mirrored by the ludicrous parallels you just drew between this ad and other possible ones. |
They are not ludicrous- Would loved ones who have lost someone because of murder or drunk driving consider such an incident as traumatic as suicide? Yes or no? Is there a great difference between stumbling upon such a scene in a TV ad vs. seeing such an incident in a TV show? A movie? On stage? Yes or no?
I believe that those situations are quite comparable. You may claim they are radically different, but I believe you would be over-analyzing the situation in that case. |
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repeatpete
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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Steelrails, do you really watch Rumpole of the Bailey?
You have climbed in my esteem significantly.
I think you're nuts for defending this advert though.
Using suicide to advertise is not edgy and exciting. Furthermore, it would not be something viewers could ward against as by it's nature it would just suddenly appear. Most TV shows/films you have a good idea what will be included (many are rated accordingly) and if you are just too fragile or sensitive, you give them a miss.
As I do with Top Gear, My Sweet Sixteen, Glee and Hudson Hawk.
To be fair, the article I read did highlight that the advert was not Hyundai directly but given to an outside agency. They probably should have checked but slips happen. Also the apology was swift and unequivocal.
I wish this discussion does not turn into another example of 'my country right or wrong' because I don't think this is what this is about.
I would focus instead on the hubris of an industry (advertising) which rates itself so highly and sees nothing wrong using tragedy to sell yet another product. Doug Stanhope made this point regarding a dishsoap whose ad directly exploited the image of wildfowl covered in oil from the BP Deepwater Horizon oil disaster to hawk its product.
He felt this was vulgar and obscene and then added to use a tragedy in this way would be like using a rape victim to advertise a personal hygiene product. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails, do you really watch Rumpole of the Bailey? |
Yes, with a glass of Chateau River Han after dealing with She Who Must be Obeyed (aka my co-teacher) and a bunch of 9 year-old Timsons. And of course Korean male colleagues as unfaithful as Erskine-Brown, minus the taste in wine and opera of course. And even better the episodes have an introduction from John Mortimer with them.
| Quote: |
Doug Stanhope made this point regarding a dishsoap whose ad directly exploited the image of wildfowl covered in oil from the BP Deepwater Horizon oil disaster to hawk its product.
He felt this was vulgar and obscene and then added to use a tragedy in this way would be like using a rape victim to advertise a personal hygiene product |
Well that is a fine argument to make. And certainly I'd agree when it comes to dish soap.
However, as I said, if there is any issue that warrants comparison to suicide, it is the situation now existing with humanity and fossil fuel emissions. It's certainly a grave issue.
Now, it might have benefited from a clearer message and drawing that distinct parallel. It would be a great way to draw a blunt point- Look, one method is toxic, the other is not. |
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crescent
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: yes.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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| repeatpete wrote: |
Doug Stanhope made this point regarding a dishsoap whose ad directly exploited the image of wildfowl covered in oil from the BP Deepwater Horizon oil disaster to hawk its product.
He felt this was vulgar and obscene and then added to use a tragedy in this way would be like using a rape victim to advertise a personal hygiene product. |
Parallels 101. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| crescent wrote: |
| repeatpete wrote: |
Doug Stanhope made this point regarding a dishsoap whose ad directly exploited the image of wildfowl covered in oil from the BP Deepwater Horizon oil disaster to hawk its product.
He felt this was vulgar and obscene and then added to use a tragedy in this way would be like using a rape victim to advertise a personal hygiene product. |
Parallels 101. |
So wait, my comparing ads or media depicting drunk driving death/murder/drug overdose are ridiculous, but one comparing animals caught in an oil spill are great examples?
Arbitrary 101. |
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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003
Location: Sonic Space
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| It's certainly a grave issue. |
Shakespeare would be proud. |
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crescent
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: yes.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
So wait, my comparing ads or media depicting drunk driving death/murder/drug overdose are ridiculous, but one comparing animals caught in an oil spill are great examples?
Arbitrary 101. |
Oh, did you refer to ads making light of, or trivializing of any of those things as a selling point for a consumer good?
If you did, you'd be a graduate of Parallels 101. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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| crescent wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
So wait, my comparing ads or media depicting drunk driving death/murder/drug overdose are ridiculous, but one comparing animals caught in an oil spill are great examples?
Arbitrary 101. |
Oh, did you refer to ads making light of, or trivializing of any of those things as a selling point for a consumer good?
If you did, you'd be a graduate of Parallels 101. |
I'll trade you "ad vs. media" if you trade me "oiled birds vs. murder".
Neither yours nor mine is direct. Oiled birds are not as grievous as murder/drunk driving/disease leading to human death. And straight commercials are not the same as the TV shows that are on 30 seconds before or after them. |
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