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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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 Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Zyzyfer wrote: |
| cj1976 wrote: |
A lot of the arguments on this board inevitably descend into 'hater vs apologist' disputes with neither side willing to give way. For me, it seems like a lot of the people who constantly attack Korea are displaying real 'White Person Problems', because this is the first time they have been in the ethnic minority and been marginalized. As a mixed race child growing up in 1980s UK, I have experienced real racism, which does not really exist here.
On the other hand, the 'apologists' seem to be more 'deniers' to me, because they try to subvert legitimate complaints by using the 'it happens everywhere' line, or they go quiet in threads where it is clear there is no way to get around the truth.
The truth is somewhere in the middle. Korea is what it is. It is quite xenophobic, but we are all here simply because we speak English. Some Koreans are great (my wife and her family for example), and some are odious lowlife scumbags.
You can work hard here and get great rewards, but injustice can and does happen to people. |
The worst part is, when you look at the course these arguments take, the real issue up for debate is more often than not the use by the "hater" of blanket statements. I'm - as I always am about everything haha - on the fence here.
On the one hand, it sucks to see someone disparage an entire country of people for the actions of a few. Like guys touching your thigh here, therefore you extrapolate from that and make a blanket statement about all or the majority of Korean dudes.
But it gets ridiculous at times, the sensitivity to language. Like if I'm grumbling about traffic here in Korea, I don't feel like I need the "apologist" police hovering over me as I try to stumble around a dreaded blanket statement. Woe be done to me should I dare to say, "Koreans suck at driving"! |
The thing with the blanket statements is that many of the (I almost said all!) posters making them are the same posters who are up in arms when MBC et al use the druggie/pedo angle and make blanket statements about foreigners. How is it that one can complain about this, and yet minutes later go on to denounce ajosshis as drunken, backwards and uncouth? |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Julius"]
| big_fella1 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It's difficult, I have a case before the National Human Rights Commission, its been 9 months and still no case date. |
Thats part of their game. They make it as expensive, stressful and drawn-out a process as possible so that the foreigner will either drop it out of frustration or will have left the country by the time the court date comes around. |
Nonsense. 9 months is nothing. This is from Ontario Canada Human Rights Commission
| Quote: |
Based on statistics available from the Commission�s Annual Reports, in the years just prior to
the 2008 reform, it took approximately 27 months before the Commission made a decision to
dismiss a case or refer it to the Tribunal.
I also
analysed
29 cases that were fully decided on their merits by the Tribunal in the 2006 to
2008 time period, but which were begun
via complaints filed at the Commission many years ago
My analysis, presented in Appendix B to the Report, reveals that, under the previous
human rights system, the average timeline measured from the filing of a complaint was as
follows: It took just over 2-1/2 years for the Commission to refer a case to the Tribunal. It took
around 4 years to get to a hearing at the Tribunal; and it took 4.7 years to get to a Tribunal
decision on the merits of the case |
http://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/about/pubs/human_rights/Pinto_human_rights_report_2012-ENG.pdf
Until 2008 it could take nearly 5 YEARS to get to a Tribunal decision. It has gotten better since then but it still is a long drawn out process.
And this is Canada which has a more comprehensive program and procedures in place.
Why in the world would you expect Korea to be any shorter? |
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big_fella1
Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| tiger fancini wrote: |
| The thing with the blanket statements is that many of the (I almost said all!) posters making them are the same posters who are up in arms when MBC et al use the druggie/pedo angle and make blanket statements about foreigners. How is it that one can complain about this, and yet minutes later go on to denounce ajosshis as drunken, backwards and uncouth? |
Good point tiger fancini, it took me a long time to accept that even though some Koreans speak of themselves in the collective, it isn't acceptable for me to. I'm better educated than that.
@Bondrock sorry I don't have a link to the case, my understanding is a friend of a friend's acquaintance was dismissed from his private university after a long time. He got a lawyer fought it and won. Google the Korean Private Schools Act, but these cases aren't handled by the Labour Board, the ministry of education controls the appeals process. Note that you only have like 1 month to act after you get notice.
@Steelrails Thank you for your concern. It's been 3 weeks now and I apologise for my demand for a "hasty" investigation. I just thought after the Boston Bombers were caught in less than a week, that the Korean police would have solved it by now.
I have calmed down because I know that the police don't want to catch the people. They would be looking at the death penalty for these 2 guys and quite frankly they would be executing them for gross stupidity and incompetence as their crime was so poorly executed.
In Korea treating different people differently is okay, which is more honest than my country's view that its wrong but it happens anyway.
Now I've accepted that I can move on as I do believe in an ideal called equality.
I don't believe it makes me racist when I say fingerprinting foreigners is xenophobic and I don't believe calling on the police to do their job in a timely fashion makes me racist.
Justice delayed is justice denied but as The Urban Myth pointed out this is or could be an issue in our own countries. Maybe I will take up the fight for those subject to unequal treatment in my own country when I return home. I've never said my own country is perfect, and nor is Korea despite what the apologists say.
Last edited by big_fella1 on Tue May 07, 2013 5:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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cj1976
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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I understand why the bashers make blanket statements sometimes, but I I really don't get what is in it for the hardcore deniers.
Bashers come on here to vent at something that maybe they don't fully understand, or because of sheer frustration. Korea is not an easy place to be, and it gets to people. Generalizations are easy to make in the heat of the moment, and they are also human nature. We form our opinion of all nations and cultures based on the actions of a minority of their population.
Maybe a lot of the bashers are a bit whiney and exaggerate. Not naming names, but some people here seem to live for opportunities to hate on Korea and see negatives in every situation. A lot of this comes down to lack of experience and downright immaturity. Man up and handle the situation like an adult, FFS.
Apologists on the other hand, seem to live in a deluded world where Korea isn't steeped in xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, and nepotist corruption. I can understand the guys who have Korean heritage, but the non-Korean apologists I just don't get. Just because you married a Korean woman and/or you learned the language, wear hanbok and sit on the floor for dinner doesn't make you one of them. Never will.
This seems like 'us and them' because it is. Korean culture and the notion of 'Korean-ness' basically instills this in the people. They can't help but view themselves as different to other people, so all of your efforts to assimilate are ultimately in vain. So, why go to lengths to shout people down when they voice sometimes legitimate complaints about Korea? |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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| cj1976 wrote: |
Apologists on the other hand, seem to live in a deluded world where Korea isn't steeped in xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, and nepotist corruption.
So, why go to lengths to shout people down when they voice sometimes legitimate complaints about Korea? |
Just to address two of your points.
Sure Korea has problems with "xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia and nepotist corruption" (I wouldn't say "steeped" though). But then again so does most every other country. Singling out Korea in this regard comes across more or less as rank hypocrisy. And as an aside I don't know of a single apologist on Dave's who has said that Korea doesn't have problems or issues. That's basher propaganda.
It is actually not that common for an apologist to shout down people when they voice an legitimate complaint about Korea. I've noticed other apologists and even myself joining in when there is a legitimate complaint.
But an actual legitimate well-thought-out complaint on these boards is just as rare. 99 times out of a hundred it's more or less an angry rant.
Which in itself would be okay but it is the overwhelming tendency to tar all Koreans with the same brush when someone has a negative experience with some Koreans that gets apologists riled up.
Yes some of us are married to Koreans and have children by them. And when people's wives and children are being directly or indirectly attacked with vile slurs...it's asking a bit much to ask for restraint. |
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diver
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| cj1976 wrote: |
Apologists on the other hand, seem to live in a deluded world where Korea isn't steeped in xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, and nepotist corruption.
So, why go to lengths to shout people down when they voice sometimes legitimate complaints about Korea? |
Just to address two of your points.
Sure Korea has problems with "xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia and nepotist corruption" (I wouldn't say "steeped" though). But then again so does most every other country. Singling out Korea in this regard comes across more or less as rank hypocrisy. And as an aside I don't know of a single apologist on Dave's who has said that Korea doesn't have problems or issues. That's basher propaganda.
It is actually not that common for an apologist to shout down people when they voice an legitimate complaint about Korea. I've noticed other apologists and even myself joining in when there is a legitimate complaint.
But an actual legitimate well-thought-out complaint on these boards is just as rare. 99 times out of a hundred it's more or less an angry rant.
Which in itself would be okay but it is the overwhelming tendency to tar all Koreans with the same brush when someone has a negative experience with some Koreans that gets apologists riled up.
Yes some of us are married to Koreans and have children by them. And when people's wives and children are being directly or indirectly attacked with vile slurs...it's asking a bit much to ask for restraint. |
I'm sorry, did you just complain about people making sweeping generalizations at the same time as declaring that 99% of the complaints on this board are without merit?
Last edited by diver on Tue May 07, 2013 7:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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cj1976
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| cj1976 wrote: |
Apologists on the other hand, seem to live in a deluded world where Korea isn't steeped in xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, and nepotist corruption.
So, why go to lengths to shout people down when they voice sometimes legitimate complaints about Korea? |
Just to address two of your points.
Sure Korea has problems with "xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia and nepotist corruption" (I wouldn't say "steeped" though). But then again so does most every other country. Singling out Korea in this regard comes across more or less as rank hypocrisy. And as an aside I don't know of a single apologist on Dave's who has said that Korea doesn't have problems or issues. That's basher propaganda.
It is actually not that common for an apologist to shout down people when they voice an legitimate complaint about Korea. I've noticed other apologists and even myself joining in when there is a legitimate complaint.
But an actual legitimate well-thought-out complaint on these boards is just as rare. 99 times out of a hundred it's more or less an angry rant.
Which in itself would be okay but it is the overwhelming tendency to tar all Koreans with the same brush when someone has a negative experience with some Koreans that gets apologists riled up.
Yes some of us are married to Koreans and have children by them. And when people's wives and children are being directly or indirectly attacked with vile slurs...it's asking a bit much to ask for restraint. |
The 'it happens everywhere' argument seems to me like a cop-out, or a way to skirt around the issue. It is also totally unrelated to the frustrations of life in Korea. However, like I said there is a difference between legitimate complaint and outright bitching.
However, if someone attacks Korea I don't care just because my wife is Korean. If someone attacked her though, I'd open up a big can of whoop-ass on them. Much like I don't care if people criticize the UK. |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| cj1976 wrote: |
Apologists on the other hand, seem to live in a deluded world where Korea isn't steeped in xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, and nepotist corruption. I can understand the guys who have Korean heritage, but the non-Korean apologists I just don't get. Just because you married a Korean woman and/or you learned the language, wear hanbok and sit on the floor for dinner doesn't make you one of them. Never will.
This seems like 'us and them' because it is. Korean culture and the notion of 'Korean-ness' basically instills this in the people. They can't help but view themselves as different to other people, so all of your efforts to assimilate are ultimately in vain. So, why go to lengths to shout people down when they voice sometimes legitimate complaints about Korea? |
My personal opinion is that a foreigner will never be fully accepted in Korean society, instead they will either be treated as a guest or a semi ambassador. I think it is hard for someone that has been here for over 5 years and has developed a full life here to accept that reality. It is also hard to believe that maybe the people that came here for one year and ducked out because they caught onto the vibe really quick were right all along. I don't know if they are trying to convince the bashers as much as they are trying to convince themselves that there is a permanent place here for them in the future.
I understand their are some lifers that understand this and still stay for the good of their family or financial reasons. They have weighed the pros and cons and figured out how to make their life here work. That's a different situation altogether.
Other apologists appear to get a feeling of moral superiority or something, like they understand what is going on around them and no one else does. Sometimes this is true, but other times the person complaining knows why but they don't care, they are just upset.
I feel like Korea will open up to foreign influence for the benefit of Korea and that's it. The approach I have seen towards welcoming foreigners is not so much a matter of morals or ethics as it is a method of self preservation. I say Korean is xenophobic, but I'm not saying that's a bad thing. Right now it is working out well for the country, their standard of living has risen and they have managed to gain a significant international voice. There is no reason for them to open their doors, so I don't expect them to anytime soon, and I don't fault them for it. Korea has Korea's best interest in mind at all times, I think that's a good approach.
I do fine here as long as I accept the fact that I am only a guest, and my stay is temporary. I'm not interested in changing Korean culture, I think that undertaking might lead me to insanity. At the same time I don't want to stay here and just roll with the punches. I'm not going to end up like some of the people on this forum who seem incapable of siding or sympathizing with someone that has a negative opinion of Korea. I've met a lot of people that have had an awful time here, and their poor treatment was unjustified.
Then again, maybe I'm wrong. |
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MiXX
Joined: 30 Aug 2012
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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Just take a visit to South East Asia or Latin America. The people / society are like night and day in comparison to Korea.
Outside of the food & drinking culture, I cant wait to get the hell out of Korea. |
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Bondrock
Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Location: ^_^
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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| big_fella1 wrote: |
@Bondrock sorry I don't have a link to the case, my understanding is a friend of a friend's acquaintance was dismissed from his private university after a long time. He got a lawyer fought it and won. Google the Korean Private Schools Act, but these cases aren't handled by the Labour Board, the ministry of education controls the appeals process. Note that you only have like 1 month to act after you get notice.
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a friend of a friend's acquaintance....?
this reminds me of the time I had coffee with a truck driver who had picked up a hitch-hiker who told him that his mother's great uncle once knew a guy who said he had dated a girl who had a brother that went to school with an amnesiac who had previously claimed to have seen Elvis in concert... |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:41 pm Post subject: |
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It's been 3 weeks now and I apologise for my demand for a "hasty" investigation. I just thought after the Boston Bombers were caught in less than a week, that the Korean police would have solved it by now.
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Some investigations take time, others catch lucky breaks. That's like saying because one murderer was caught in 48 hours, all should be. Each investigation is different.
As I said, there may be reasons for "playing dumb" on this issue, especially if NK is involved. You don't necessarily want to reveal sources and jeopardize ongoing infiltration operations.
| Quote: |
| I don't believe it makes me racist when I say fingerprinting foreigners is xenophobic and I don't believe calling on the police to do their job in a timely fashion makes me racist. |
No it doesn't, it's just that both had reasonable explanations. In the case of fingerprinting, Koreans get fingerprinted as well. Granted its a little easier for them to do have it done, but I wouldn't say that when we have to do it, it's an undue burden. There could be improvements in the bureaucracy, but that's because of resources, not racism.
As for the police, I don't want fast. I want right. And if arresting the people hastily ruins a chance to infiltrate the group or jeopardizes undercover operations, then take it slow.
| Quote: |
| This seems like 'us and them' because it is. Korean culture and the notion of 'Korean-ness' basically instills this in the people. |
Well, I think part of that is that we are expecting to be accepted on our terms, rather than theirs. There's a subtle but persistent view that we are the "dominant" ones and that they should conform to us.
I also think that it's two ways. How often in these cultural argument do we talk about "them" being outside the norm and they should conform to us?
| Quote: |
| The 'it happens everywhere' argument seems to me like a cop-out, or a way to skirt around the issue. |
Frequently the bashers apparently believe it doesn't happen back home or use their favorite line "Yes, but in our case we..." which sounds an awful lot like the non-Korean version of "Our culture is special, please try to understand."
| Quote: |
| My personal opinion is that a foreigner will never be fully accepted in Korean society, instead they will either be treated as a guest or a semi ambassador. |
My personal opinion is that many NETs will never get over the western-centric bias and view of foreigners. THIS is what we're talking about when we say the prejudiced attitude runs deeper than just blatant basherism.
The vast majority of foreigners are 1)SE Asian Brides and then 2) Chinese immigrants, workers and students. I believe 3D workers come in at number 3.
But when it comes to "foreign" issues, its all about "This isn't in English" "We'll never be accepted" and while foreigners on E-2s teaching kids are required to do certain checks which other foreigners are not, apparently ALL foreigners are considered potential AIDs infected pedophiles who are discriminated against.
Actually MANY foreigners are accepted as family and loved ones because the overwhelming majority are foreign brides. People claim "Nothing is being done for foreigners" but what they really mean is that nothing is being done for English speaking speaking foreigners. There are programs left and right for foreign brides. There are also major programs in the schools to ensure a nurturing environment for multiculti children. Those of us who are familiar at such things get weary when people scream about "rampant xenophobia". There is a perceptible double-standard soft bigotry ethnocentrism involved in those complaints. "Well those are just Filipinos and Viets, I'm talking about REAL foreigners."
Even among foreigners, there is a noticeable lack of outrage over discriminatory practices towards black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs, but the second there is a vaguely offensive portrayal of a Caucasian, the boards fill up and people scream and howl. This combined with the "This never happens back home" talk which causes many of those black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs to roll their eyes, doesn't exactly put the kindest face on basherism. |
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big_fella1
Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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| Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
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It's been 3 weeks now and I apologise for my demand for a "hasty" investigation. I just thought after the Boston Bombers were caught in less than a week, that the Korean police would have solved it by now.
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Some investigations take time, others catch lucky breaks. That's like saying because one murderer was caught in 48 hours, all should be. Each investigation is different.
As I said, there may be reasons for "playing dumb" on this issue, especially if NK is involved. You don't necessarily want to reveal sources and jeopardize ongoing infiltration operations. |
North Korean angle. 
I thought drugs were impossible to get in this country but I'd like some of whatever you've been smoking if you think North Korea was involved in the Daegu Bombing.
Seriously, you don't really believe that, do you?
At least Koreans on another forum I read, blamed Asian foreigners that were trying to make Koreans look bad. Those claims have more credibility than North Korea did it and I don't believe their claims either. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 12:16 am Post subject: |
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| big_fella1 wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
It's been 3 weeks now and I apologise for my demand for a "hasty" investigation. I just thought after the Boston Bombers were caught in less than a week, that the Korean police would have solved it by now.
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Some investigations take time, others catch lucky breaks. That's like saying because one murderer was caught in 48 hours, all should be. Each investigation is different.
As I said, there may be reasons for "playing dumb" on this issue, especially if NK is involved. You don't necessarily want to reveal sources and jeopardize ongoing infiltration operations. |
North Korean angle.
I thought drugs were impossible to get in this country but I'd like some of whatever you've been smoking if you think North Korea was involved in the Daegu Bombing.
Seriously, you don't really believe that, do you?
At least Koreans on another forum I read, blamed Asian foreigners that were trying to make Koreans look bad. Those claims have more credibility than North Korea did it and I don't believe their claims either. |
Fair enough. If that was North Korea, it was their "D" team.
You can never be sure. With any kind of bombing, you want to really make sure you have your ducks in order. |
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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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| Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 12:45 am Post subject: |
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| MiXX wrote: |
| Just take a visit to South East Asia or Latin America. The people / society are like night and day in comparison to Korea. |
Visiting a place and living there are pretty different. There are countless horror stories of people who've moved to Thailand to set up a business and been shafted left, right and centre. In Korea it's waygukin, in Thailand it's farang. I'm very skeptical that Thais are more accepting of long-term expats than Korea is. I can't comment on other places as I don't have much experience there. However vacationing in Thailand can be extremely pleasant, but then most people I know who visited Korea for a week or 2 have basically loved it.
| Steelrails wrote: |
There is a perceptible double-standard soft bigotry ethnocentrism involved in those complaints. "Well those are just Filipinos and Viets, I'm talking about REAL foreigners."
Even among foreigners, there is a noticeable lack of outrage over discriminatory practices towards black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs, but the second there is a vaguely offensive portrayal of a Caucasian, the boards fill up and people scream and howl. This combined with the "This never happens back home" talk which causes many of those black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs to roll their eyes, doesn't exactly put the kindest face on basherism. |
It's also perfectly acceptable here on Dave's to bash white women in Korea, and I've noticed a lot of snarky comments about gyopos too that basically go unchecked. But as you've pointed out, the shrillness begins as soon as Caucasian males are faced with any kind of criticism. Nobody expects them not to get upset, but a wee bit of consistency would certainly help their cause. |
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hiamnotcool
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 2:57 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
| My personal opinion is that a foreigner will never be fully accepted in Korean society, instead they will either be treated as a guest or a semi ambassador. |
My personal opinion is that many NETs will never get over the western-centric bias and view of foreigners. THIS is what we're talking about when we say the prejudiced attitude runs deeper than just blatant basherism.
The vast majority of foreigners are 1)SE Asian Brides and then 2) Chinese immigrants, workers and students. I believe 3D workers come in at number 3.
But when it comes to "foreign" issues, its all about "This isn't in English" "We'll never be accepted" and while foreigners on E-2s teaching kids are required to do certain checks which other foreigners are not, apparently ALL foreigners are considered potential AIDs infected pedophiles who are discriminated against.
Actually MANY foreigners are accepted as family and loved ones because the overwhelming majority are foreign brides. People claim "Nothing is being done for foreigners" but what they really mean is that nothing is being done for English speaking speaking foreigners. There are programs left and right for foreign brides. There are also major programs in the schools to ensure a nurturing environment for multiculti children. Those of us who are familiar at such things get weary when people scream about "rampant xenophobia". There is a perceptible double-standard soft bigotry ethnocentrism involved in those complaints. "Well those are just Filipinos and Viets, I'm talking about REAL foreigners."
Even among foreigners, there is a noticeable lack of outrage over discriminatory practices towards black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs, but the second there is a vaguely offensive portrayal of a Caucasian, the boards fill up and people scream and howl. This combined with the "This never happens back home" talk which causes many of those black, Asian, and Middle-Eastern NETs to roll their eyes, doesn't exactly put the kindest face on basherism. |
I'm not going to address whether I keep up with the status of Non-white immigrants here. I don't appreciate the way you automatically lump me in with the other NET's that you have met here who don't care or keep up with them. I don't think that I should keep my mouth shut about discrimination in Korea because I'm white either, that is ridiculous.
I will say the effort the Korean government is putting into accommodating international marriages is largely the result of outside pressure placed on them by the Vietnamese and Cambodian government. These two governments threatened to ban marriage with Korean men because there were too many tragic endings to the international marriages. Not only that, but the effort to accommodate international marriages here is not a step towards creating a multi-cultural or multi-racial country, they are steps to assimilate the bride or groom to being Korean and living with a Korean family within a Korean society. It's not about teaching Koreans to accommodate foreigners, it's about teaching foreigners to assimilate to the Korean lifestyle. Again, this is not a moral or ethical imperative in Korean society that I see, it is a matter of self preservation. There is a declining birth rate here so foreign brides are needed, but they will be taken only to the point that they do not disrupt the homogenous nature of Korea.
As for NET's, like I said most of them see the situation for what it is and duck out within one or two years. They complain about the situation, they don't like it, and then they leave because they realize that is just the way it is here. Most of the improvements in the NET lifestyle are not due to the good reputation of long term foreigners, they are the result of schools wanting to prevent their NET's from pulling a runner or the need to create a good image of the NET profession in Korea for hiring purposes. We aren't wanted here on a permanent basis. |
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