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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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 Posted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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| rollo wrote: |
| Norway has an ocean of oil. all of those social benefits are paid from petro dollars, not taxes not industry, oil. |
Texas is oil rich as well, yet awash in poverty. Let's not be willfully obtuse here: the United States has plenty of natural resources. It simply chooses not to administer them for the common good. Okay, let a large percentage of Texans do without health insurance so a tiny economic elite can enjoy an obscene amount of unearned wealth if you like, but do not pretend it was not a choice, nor when that choice is contrasted against the more humane choice the Norwegians made.
| rollo wrote: |
| The U.s. is by far the richest big country. A population of 318 million people, so compare it with other countries of similar populations. |
No, that's silly. Large populations might introduce certain elementary logistical challenges, but America's poverty problem is not a direct function of its size. |
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Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| bmaw01 wrote: |
| Zackback wrote: |
They are generally overweight and obese because they can't afford good healthy food. It is too expensive. So what do they do? $1 happy meals, etc.
1.Government handouts to corporations is far more disgusting. |
2. Actually a study was done a few years ago that found that eating healthy was less expensive then eating unhealthy foods. How much does it cost to buy fruits, vegetables, milk, eggs, and poultry? It's not that expensive.
3. People eat unhealthy because it's the easiest thing to do. It's much easier to gorge on chips, soda, and pizza. Eating healthy takes discipline, and people who eat healthier are more likely to exercise. Today, poor people have awful willpower and discipline. |
1. Agree. The USDA�s budget authority for 2012 was $145 billion, up from $93 billion in 2008. (not sure how that breaks down, nor whether that is the full extent of gov support for agribiz)
2. Do you have a link to that study? This talk by Marion Nestle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRLA7THDlDw (long, but very informative) says that you get more calories per dollar if you buy processed or junk food.
3. People also have less time for cooking because working hours are way up and both parents in a family are normally at work. Plus we're constantly bombarded with ads for unhealthy foods (even in ESL textbooks the message is propagated that 'pizza' = 'fun'). No matter how smart and educated we think we are, there's a reason companies spend huge sums on advertising and that's because it works.
Edit: turns out the Marion Nestle video doesn't have the bit I was thinking of. It may be in Food Inc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eKYyD14d_0) or in some Michael Pollan video...
Last edited by Privateer on Sun Jun 09, 2013 1:09 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Privateer wrote: |
3. People also have less time for cooking because working hours are way up and both parents in a family are normally at work. |
Right, this is an important point. I am generally proponent of personal responsibility, but if I were working two low wage, thirty hour a week, no benefits jobs to provide for my kids, I suspect I would be too exhausted to make the effort every day as well. And that does not take into account the considerable effect the stress of economic insecurity can induce. In the face of real exhaustion -- not, "I work 60 hour weeks in my comfortable chair reviewing legal documents," but, "I work 60 hour weeks lifting and carrying things sufficiently heavy that my body will probably fail me before retirement, and I have no idea what I'll do when it happens" -- you can only expect so much. |
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Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Location: Easy Street.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 1:15 am Post subject: |
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| Nolos wrote: |
| Absolutely they should work for their FREE money. Let them clean the sewers, wash windows, cut lawns, clear trash along the freeways -- ANYTHING -- than being able to just sit around and "act" like they are "looking" for work. |
How about a government run public works program to create jobs? The end result of putting idle hands to work would be the same, but there might be more dignity in it. |
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andrewchon
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Location: Back in Oz. Living in ISIS Aust.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 3:41 am Post subject: |
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| The problem isn't welfare. The problem is: real estate. More correctly put: bank estate. Banks own far too much of the housing and charge far too much in rates. That's why people can't get out of poverty. Back in 2008 sub-prime meltdown, US gov saved the banks and freddie mac but not the tenants. Those foreclosed people are the poor. The poor gets attacked as lazy, etc because that re-directs the attack away from the real thieves: Wall St. So, get off the back of the unfortunates while you can, Wall St. is coming after you, too. |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:09 am Post subject: |
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| As is stands today, the US govt. is ten times the size in budget as it was in 1969. TEN TIMES. In 1969 the US was fighting Vietnam and putting a man on the moon. Today the US has no possible means to even get a man into space. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| radcon wrote: |
| The young gentlemen in those videos are just misunderstood youths without ample education and employment opportunities. |
Actually, maybe that could help them and I would be in favor of that. But overall, I don't think dysfunctional people should be reproducing in such large numbers. That is the reason there is so much poverty in America. Compared to most other places on earth, poor people in America get the red carpet treatment. |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:18 am Post subject: |
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| I think what it boils down to in the US is that the elites have found successful strategies in monetizing (and hence transferring wealth) from the poor and middle classes to their immense benefit. Make it extremely easy to borrow huge sums of money for college, which in turn raises tuition costs, and keeps an indebted working class. War on drugs? Let's privatize the prisons and profit from keeping people behind bars undeservedly. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:23 am Post subject: |
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Your response sounds straight out of infowars.com.
The U.S. is a good place. Most people are successful and happy there.
And most people are making good money.
http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/countries/united-states/
(I know, I know, the bottom 20% earns a lot less than the top 20%.
...But the bottom 20% is comprised largely of people like in those videos...and the top 20% is smart and industrious and hard working. Of course they deserve more money. They are actually working and producing and contributing to society. BTW, with the United States' big underground economy, it's hard to even know what the bottom 20% is making anyway. There is so much unclaimed off the books income.)
Lastly, college is a good investment. Economists say it is the single best investment a person can make in his lifetime. College grads average almost double the earnings of a high school grad during the course of their career and have roughly half the unemployment rate. |
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radcon
Joined: 23 May 2011
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| Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
Your response sounds straight out of infowars.com.
The U.S. is a good place. Most people are successful and happy there.
And most people are making good money.
http://www.oecdbetterlif | | | |
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