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The Cosmic Hum
Joined: 09 May 2003 Location: Sonic Space
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Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:05 am Post subject: |
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W.T.Carl wrote: |
If Zimmerman was interested in a fight he would have had his pistol drawn and in his hand instead of being holstered. Who wanted the confrontation, Zimmerman or Martin? |
Give it a rest.
You know nothing about the real events of their altercation...none of us do. |
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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Captain Corea wrote: |
Why is it so hard to believe that each of these men brought baggage with them that day? |
Martin was minding his own business and he had no more baggage than pretty much anyone. He was NOT a thug despite some people trying to paint him as such. I knew guys on my HS football team who had far more altercations than either of them.
Martin's death resulted from Zimmerman taking an interest in him, an interest that was confrontational and accusatory.
He was on his way home to see a father who was a known disciplinarian. The last thing on Martin's mind was to get into a fight at his father's house whom he was with because of suspension (over BS by the way).
Logic dictates that something is not right if he ends up dead and his shooter is found innocent. We weren't there. But logic and reason says something is amiss. For some to believe without any doubt whatsoever that Zimmerman is innocent is based on other stuff to any reasonable person and lets name the elephant in that room. Race. I'll get the usual posts not to harp on race by the very same who used it to judge Martin a thug and Zimmerman some kind of working man hero for whites. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired
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Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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sirius black wrote: |
Captain Corea wrote: |
Why is it so hard to believe that each of these men brought baggage with them that day? |
Martin was minding his own business and he had no more baggage than pretty much anyone. He was NOT a thug despite some people trying to paint him as such. I knew guys on my HS football team who had far more altercations than either of them.
Martin's death resulted from Zimmerman taking an interest in him, an interest that was confrontational and accusatory.
He was on his way home to see a father who was a known disciplinarian. The last thing on Martin's mind was to get into a fight at his father's house whom he was with because of suspension (over BS by the way).
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Only Martin DIDN'T go to his father's house. He doubled back AFTER Zimmerman had returned to his truck and attacked Zimmerman there.
Then knocked him to the ground and began to alternately rain MMA-style blows on Zimmerman and repeatedly smash his head into the concrete.
So the facts don't really support your claim that this was "The last thing on Martin's mind". Seems more like it was the dominant overriding idea in Martin's mind.
Sounds thuggish to me.
And he wasn't going to his father's house.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3035576/posts
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Trayvon Martin had been staying with his father’s girlfriend, Brandy Green, who rented one of the units. |
Here is the transcript of the call.
We can see that Zimmerman stopped chasing Martin and was going back. We can also see that he lost Martin. (see bolded portions)
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Zimmerman could see the direction Martin took but could no longer “maintain a visual” from the truck. Ambient wind sounds suggest he started walking swiftly, likely in the same direction Martin was running
GZ: The back entrance. It’s f***ing cold (garbled, much disputed).
The dispatcher obviously heard the wind sounds.
SPD: Are you following him? [2:24]
GZ: Yeah.
SPD: Okay. We don’t need you to do that. [2:26]
GZ: Okay.
SPD: All right, sir, what is your name? [2:34]
GZ: George. He ran.
At this point, Zimmerman’s breathing relaxed, and the sound of wind abated.
SPD: All right, George, what’s your last name?
GZ: Zimmerman.
SPD: And George, what’s the phone number you’re calling from?
GZ: 407-435-2400.
SPD: All right, George, we do have them on the way. Do you want to meet with the officer when they get out there?
GZ: Yeah.
SPD: All right, where are you going to meet with them at?
GZ: Um, if they come in through the gate, tell them to go straight past the clubhouse and, uh, straight past the clubhouse and make a left and then they go past the mailboxes they’ll see my truck. [3:10]
SPD: All right, what address are you parked in front of? [3:21]
GZ: Um, I don’t know. It’s a cut-through so I don’t know the address. [3:25]
SPD: Okay, do you live in the area?
GZ: Yeah, yeah, I live here.
SPD: Okay, what’s your apartment number?
GZ: It’s a home. It’s 1950 — oh, crap, I don’t want to give it out — I don’t know where this kid is (inaudible) |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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W.T.Carl wrote: |
If Zimmerman was interested in a fight he would have had his pistol drawn and in his hand instead of being holstered. Who wanted the confrontation, Zimmerman or Martin? |
If Zimmerman was interested in a fight, he would have had his fists up. If he was interested in defending himself from a lethal threat or shooting someone, he would have had his gun out.
I don't think he did, and I don't think Trayvon would have started a fight if he knew George Z. was packing. Clearly this started as a fistfight. It was a fistfight. George Z. brought a gun to a fistfight.
Trayvon Martin did not bring fists to a gunfight. If it was a gun fight, George Z would have his gun out and would have fired before it got to point-blank range. That and you need two people with guns to have a gunfight. Duh.
Just drop it. You clearly just spouted a bunch of nonsense. Man up and admit it.
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Sounds thuggish to me.
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It's quasi-thug. It's the Diet Coke of thug. |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010 Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2013 5:08 am Post subject: |
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Steelrails wrote: |
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Sounds thuggish to me.
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It's quasi-thug. It's the Diet Coke of thug. |
Not if you're afraid of black people. |
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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:35 am Post subject: |
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As much as I hate to bring this topic back to life.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/05/showbiz/zimmerman-dmx-boxing-match/
"Seems like the former neighborhood watchman has found yet another way to remain in the public limelight.
This time, he'll be stepping into a boxing ring to fight rapper DMX.
Photos: Celebrity mugshots Photos: Celebrity mugshots
Zimmerman said the celebrity boxing match was his idea. Boxing was his hobby, he told Radar Online last month, even prior to the "incident."
The incident, of course, is the February 2012 encounter in which he shot dead an unarmed Trayvon Martin, 17. He stood trial for murder, but was acquitted.
"Prior to the incident, I was actually going to the gym for weight loss and doing boxing-type training for weight loss," he told Radar.
"A mutual friend put me in contact with Damon and provided me with an opportunity and motivation to get back in shape and continue with my weight loss goals and also be able to help a charity out." |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010 Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:59 am Post subject: |
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Someone's going to waste that guy if he doesn't quit playing attention-ho. |
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Rteacher
Joined: 23 May 2005 Location: Western MA, USA
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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I also recall something this year, maybe in the last 2 or 3 months where he was in some altercation and bragged/threatened 'you know what happened to the last guy who hit me?' or some thing to that effect.
The Zimmerman view of what happened gets seen as BS more and more with each incident. I still think he instigated the fight and was losing it and out of loss of pride shot Martin. Its a HUGE stretch to assume Martin was trying to kill the guy. Nothing in his past suggests random murder and he was on his way home. But that horse has been beaten half to death.
The real sad thing is deep down Zimmerman supporters could care less if it was murder or self defense. Getting away with killing Martin, no matter what the reason or provocation was what a scary percentage of his supporters really wanted and they were willing to hang on to the flimsiest of theories or over amplify facts such as bruises to lie to themselves and to others. |
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Fallacy
Joined: 29 Jun 2015 Location: ex-ROK
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Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:37 am Post subject: |
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When Z inevitably shoots himself by accident, do you think he will claim self-defense?
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"I had to do it. Everyone knows my intimidating reputation. I saw me pull the gun and my instincts just took over. The training, you know? Bam! I felt a sting and knew I had laid myself down. Only then did I feel safe enough to call the cops." |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 5:14 am Post subject: |
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Its an interesting time re-reading the thread. About half of it occurs over two months, and the first two months of this thread are really good; people are trying to understand the facts and the law.
And then about halfway through someone kind of derails it with ideology . . .
. . . nonetheless, its an impressive thread even so. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired
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Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:04 am Post subject: |
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sirius black wrote: |
I also recall something this year, maybe in the last 2 or 3 months where he was in some altercation and bragged/threatened 'you know what happened to the last guy who hit me?' or some thing to that effect.
The Zimmerman view of what happened gets seen as BS more and more with each incident. I still think he instigated the fight and was losing it and out of loss of pride shot Martin. Its a HUGE stretch to assume Martin was trying to kill the guy. Nothing in his past suggests random murder and he was on his way home. But that horse has been beaten half to death.
The real sad thing is deep down Zimmerman supporters could care less if it was murder or self defense. Getting away with killing Martin, no matter what the reason or provocation was what a scary percentage of his supporters really wanted and they were willing to hang on to the flimsiest of theories or over amplify facts such as bruises to lie to themselves and to others. |
Except for the fact that all the forensic evidence gathered supported Zimmerman's story as shown ad nauseam above. Martin may not have been ACTIVELY trying to kill Zimmerman but he surely intended laying a serious beating on him...see the head wounds on the back of Zimmerman's head where his head was smashed repeatedly into the concrete. Zimmerman claimed he thought his life was in danger (and so did the jury apparently).
As for being seen more and more as BS...no. The facts are in, the case has been laid to rest and the conclusion is that Zimmerman acted in self-defense and in fear of his life. Other actions have no bearing on how this case is viewed.
As for your specious allegations about Zimmerman supporters perhaps you should re-read the TOS. There are some Zimmerman supporters on this site and your comments could be seen as a personal attack on them. Just saying. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired
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Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 6:50 am Post subject: |
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sirius black wrote: |
I actually think there is more than enough evidence for a honest person on the jury to find Zimmerman innocent. |
On this post (page fifty-eight) you seem to think that a honest person on the jury would find Zimmerman innocent based on the evidence. (which contradicts earlier remarks of yours...but we'll get back to that in a minute)
But now you say "I still think he instigated the fight and was losing it and out of loss of pride shot Martin."
But what about the evidence you alluded to in your earlier post? Obviously it supports Zimmerman's story since you thought a jury would acquit him based on it...yet you suddenly change your tune and without a shred of evidence reiterate your original claims made in the opening pages of this thread. And this despite the evidence you (at one point) thought good enough to acquit Zimmerman. |
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