|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
|
 Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 5:37 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Quote: |
This tragedy involves:
- the captain (bailed on his passengers)
- the crew that bailed (20 out of 26?)
- the students who were told to sit still (a hint of Confucian?)
- Chonghaejin (the ship's owner renovated the ship making it unstable)
- the Korean shipping association (didn't do a good job of overseeing the shipping industry)
- The coast guard (didn't seem like they knew what to do, sorta like how crappy the Korean cops are)
- Safety certification (the crew admitted they didn't know what to do) |
Well, tragedies happen the world over, including those from negligence. They often have a similar chain of events. Do we always blame those on the nation's/ethnicity's culture? No. We may blame it on a culture of corruption or a culture of corporate greed or a culture of lax safety, but not on 'American Culture' or 'New York Culture' or 'Dutch Culture'. Why? Because the people look like us and speak our language and have similar heritages and thus we are more easily able to see them as individuals rather than some indecipherable blob of people.
Also the myth of the obedient students and that being a cause of their death needs to be removed- The rapidity and degree of list severely inhibited their movement. Also, those that were rescued, contrary to initial reports, were based on what areas of the ship were reached and what rooms they were in, not whether they obeyed orders or not.
And I think people are taking a really big leap in blaming the Coast Guard. The sea isn't some district of Seoul where 50 cop cars can all descend on it within minutes. They don't have some sort of massive crane on standby, ready to go at a moments notice. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
|
| Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 7:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Steelrails wrote: |
| Quote: |
This tragedy involves:
- the captain (bailed on his passengers)
- the crew that bailed (20 out of 26?)
- the students who were told to sit still (a hint of Confucian?)
- Chonghaejin (the ship's owner renovated the ship making it unstable)
- the Korean shipping association (didn't do a good job of overseeing the shipping industry)
- The coast guard (didn't seem like they knew what to do, sorta like how crappy the Korean cops are)
- Safety certification (the crew admitted they didn't know what to do) |
Well, tragedies happen the world over, including those from negligence. They often have a similar chain of events. Do we always blame those on the nation's/ethnicity's culture? No. We may blame it on a culture of corruption or a culture of corporate greed or a culture of lax safety, but not on 'American Culture' or 'New York Culture' or 'Dutch Culture'. Why? Because the people look like us and speak our language and have similar heritages and thus we are more easily able to see them as individuals rather than some indecipherable blob of people.
Also the myth of the obedient students and that being a cause of their death needs to be removed- The rapidity and degree of list severely inhibited their movement. Also, those that were rescued, contrary to initial reports, were based on what areas of the ship were reached and what rooms they were in, not whether they obeyed orders or not.
And I think people are taking a really big leap in blaming the Coast Guard. The sea isn't some district of Seoul where 50 cop cars can all descend on it within minutes. They don't have some sort of massive crane on standby, ready to go at a moments notice. |
People aren't blaming. They're looking at what happened and trying to ascertain causes.
The students were obedient. Think of the student whose father told him to go topside but who didn't. So that's not a myth and cannot be completely ignored.
The cranes on the site are for show only since it will be a while before they're ready to bring the ferry up.
Get your facts straight. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mayorgc
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
|
| Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 9:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Well, tragedies happen the world over, including those from negligence. They often have a similar chain of events. Do we always blame those on the nation's/ethnicity's culture? No. We may blame it on a culture of corruption or a culture of corporate greed or a culture of lax safety, but not on 'American Culture' or 'New York Culture' or 'Dutch Culture'. Why? Because the people look like us and speak our language and have similar heritages and thus we are more easily able to see them as individuals rather than some indecipherable blob of people.
Also the myth of the obedient students and that being a cause of their death needs to be removed- The rapidity and degree of list severely inhibited their movement. Also, those that were rescued, contrary to initial reports, were based on what areas of the ship were reached and what rooms they were in, not whether they obeyed orders or not.
And I think people are taking a really big leap in blaming the Coast Guard. The sea isn't some district of Seoul where 50 cop cars can all descend on it within minutes. They don't have some sort of massive crane on standby, ready to go at a moments notice. |
What you don't get is that I am not blaming Korean culture. Get that out of your head. Korean culture does not sink ships and it doesn't kill 200 ppl.
What I am saying is this:
This sewol tragedy occurred due to a combination of different aspects of Korean culture/society.
Respect for elders/authority is a part of Korean society. Respect for elders/authority does not kill you, in fact, I think society is better for it. But, on this day, the respect for elders/authority may have played a role in the deaths of 200 kids.
Seniority is a part of Korean culture/society. People get promoted due to seniority and not always on qualifications. Promoting someone based on seniority is not going to sink a ship. This captain, who some are saying was inept, has sailed this jeju route many times without any incident. This time, his ineptitude may have contributed to 200 deaths.
Koreans and strangers. We have all heard about the bubble. If you haven't been introduced, then you don't exist. There is a disregard for strangers, more so than in other cultures. There is nothing wrong with that. But, 22 out of 29 (the number keeps changing depending on which article you read) crew members bailed on the ship. if the crew had been assisting with evacuations, there might not have been 200 deaths.
Corruption: It exists everywhere, but more so in some countries. Chonghaejin improperly modified the ship and they overloaded the ship. This ship apparently passed the safety certification. On the previous 200 sailings, it was not a problem. This time, it was.
(lack of) authority: The Korean cops suck. President Lee Myung Bak pretty much said so. The majority of them don't really do their job and the ones that do, suck at it. But, Korea is still a functional, peaceful, law abiding (for the most part) society. This is related to the coast gaurds. They aren't to blame for this mess at all. But, their handling of the rescue operations (during the capsizing) was average at best. Watch the footage, read the articles, this isn't just my opinion.
Each aspect by itself would not cause a ship to sink and would not kill 200 kids. But, my point is, this specific tragedy unfolded because it occurred in Korea. This specific tragedy would not have occurred in a different country. It would have played out differently. Perhaps, the captain wouldn't have bailed in japan, perhaps, the crew would have stayed on board in italy, perhaps, the ship wouldn't have been overloaded in canada, perhaps there wouldn't have been repeated announcements to stay put in Taiwan, perhaps the ship wouldn't have passed safety certification in france. Do you get what i'm saying?
Yes, you are right, tragedies occur the world over. I don't think anybody is disputing that.
Take the example of Canadian hockey riots. A Hockey/sport riot most likely would not occur in Korea. I just can't imagine that ever happening. But in Canada, Hockey riots occur due to different aspects of Canadiana. Drinking, passion for sports, drugs, etc. (riots occur in korea, but not due to drugs/sports/fun)
Another example is school shootings. 20+ kids dying by gunshot wouldn't happen in Korea. But, nobody would be surprised if it were to occur in the u.s. You say it can't be blamed on "American culture", but the friggin u.s constitution guarantees the right to bear arms. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
