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| Total Votes : 25 |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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 Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| Good, we got there in the end. |
You have yet to give a valid reason as to why a CELTA is not a related qualification when it can get you jobs.
Whether an eight month MA is higher or not is irrelevant.
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| You would be surprised how many modules revolve around linguistics, grammar, the history of English. These days, there will be modules in TESOL, I think you are behind the times on this one. Ask any recent English graduate about it. I am sure there are some who spend all day reading Shakespeare but they are in the minority. |
A module here and there is of less consequence than actually being observed whilst teaching.
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| They pay a lot for the region as it is, secondly, it won't be the parents, schools or hagwon owners making these demands, it will be the government. You can see now Korean Universities are making the minimum standard a lot higher as they want an MA in a related field and they got rid of a load of teachers who didn't qualify. So, it is happening now. |
It really isn't happening now.
The fact that they are only requesting an MA which at the end of the day is a simple eight month course shows that at this rate it will be decades before they start asking for real teachers.
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| Agreed, it doesn't make them a lesser teacher either. This is about minimum standards, there are good and bad teachers everywhere. Higher qualifying criteria won't weed out crap teachers and I never claimed it would. |
If that was the aim of this exercise then only teachers with a PGCE + QTS would be considered as meeting the minimum requirement. As they are the only ones that have professional qualifications.
The fact is that unless your BA+MA+PhD is in TESOL/Education every non-PGCE teacher is essentially relying on stuff they have picked up via their experience.
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| Experience is not enough, if a teacher has been in the game 10 years and hasn't even bothered to do a DELTA or a related MA then their application would end up in the bin if I was die baas. |
If you are going to get hoity toity about qualifications then you should at least be a licensed teacher. After 10 years in the game I would hope that most people would aim at becoming a proper professional.
Frankly a 'teacher' with only an MA is blagging it as much as a college grad with an online TEFL. Teach
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| There is no proof of that. There is proof that my theory is correct as Korean universities now demand an MA in a related subject and it will trickle down to public schools and hagwons, for a start, there are a lot of former uni 'professors' looking for work this year. |
Where is the evidence that it will 'trickle down'?!?!
I doubt you have the requisite understanding of Korea or Korean to understand what you are talking about.
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No anger at all, I am laughing my head off, I have a well paid job and live in a nice place. Whatever you are doing is no concern to me but I take it you are a poli-sci graduate and no - you do not have the connections to take my 70000 dollar a year job off me.  |
Are you working in the Gulf? I knew this was a personal gripe and had nothing to do with Korea.
There was a poster who used to boast about how many expensive cars he had and his high paying job. If you are going to get into the bragging game make sure that you at least have something to brag about.
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QTS is two years at least, loads of PGCE teachers do not have QTS. So you are tricking up your rationale a bit there, an MA with two years post-grad experience will get you 100000 dollars in the Gulf. What would a CELTA and a Poli-Sci BA get you Akquynus? Seeing as you are better placed to tell us more than most.  |
If you want to work abroad QTS is just as much of a requirement as having a PGCE. They go hand in hand.
I thought that was obvious.
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And despite all that, a PGCE with QTS is still 2/3rd less than an MA - not saying a PGCE is a waste of time, it is not, it is a great qualification but I do not make the rules man regarding its worth.  |
The PGCE + QTS is the professional qualification and as such allows you to build a career. Becoming a licensed teacher means that you can actually have a proper career with opportunities for advancement.
That means the possibility of much high salaries and the bonus of being able to live in the UK or somewhere cool.
There is a reason gulf jobs pay higher.
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| Is that what you are doing now Akquyunus? |
No, but if I was so what? Try not to play up the snobby Brit stereotype too much it is embarassing for the rest of us.
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| Yeah, but we both know Koreans are the biggest education snobs around and you will always lose custom to some yank with an English lit degree from Yale! |
Your visa is a bigger determiner of your wage in Korea than anything else. Although if money was your biggest motivating factor I am not sure why anyone would choose Korea long term. |
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robbie_davies
Joined: 16 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 7:32 am Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
You have yet to give a valid reason as to why a CELTA is not a related qualification when it can get you jobs.
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Because it is the most basic qualification that lasts a month and that most people pass. A good money maker for Cambridge University but to say - as you originally did - that a CELTA is superior to a BA in English from De Montfort is ridiculous.
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| A module here and there is of less consequence than actually being observed whilst teaching. |
I disagree, and what English students learn about the actual language and the history of is more valuable than what some history student can bring to the table.
A CELTA is 6 hours observed teaching which is basically nothing. I would make the bold claim that most graduates of English will have more of a clue than your bog standard history graduate who is coming across grammar rules for the first time on their CELTA course.
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It really isn't happening now.
The fact that they are only requesting an MA which at the end of the day is a simple eight month course shows that at this rate it will be decades before they start asking for real teachers. |
What is a real teacher? Korean Universities have made it plain now that MA holders and higher are real enough teachers and that is the new minimum standard. They're paying and they're saying.
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| If that was the aim of this exercise then only teachers with a PGCE + QTS would be considered as meeting the minimum requirement. As they are the only ones that have professional qualifications. |
That is according to you but unfortunately, you have neither the knowledge nor educational pedigree to make that statement. I don't think a subject teacher wth a PGCE whose speciality is in history has any more knowledge of TESOL than Mr Poli-Science.
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| The fact is that unless your BA+MA+PhD is in TESOL/Education every non-PGCE teacher is essentially relying on stuff they have picked up via their experience. |
Which is true of course but there comes a time when serious employers paying serious money expect the person they are hiring to step up and become a serious teacher, if you have been teaching for 20 years and have not even bothered to upgrade your credentials one iota from a BA in Poli-Science then don't be upset when no-one replies to your emails. Even TtomPatz will tell you this.
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| If you are going to get hoity toity about qualifications then you should at least be a licensed teacher. After 10 years in the game I would hope that most people would aim at becoming a proper professional. |
Disagree, a PE teacher or a Geography teacher with a PGCE is no more qualifed to TESOL than a poli sci graduate so we are going back in circles. Most academics who have written about this very subject would disagree that a PGCE holder is superior than an MA holder in TESOL if they haven't been versed in the various techniques and theories.
I mean - you seem to think some stumblebum with 4 weeks CELTA training is superior to a 4 year English graduate! Now you are contradicting yourself.
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| Frankly a 'teacher' with only an MA is blagging it as much as a college grad with an online TEFL. Teach |
How would you know, you have never done an MA, you have your BA in poli science and experience. You speak of something you know zip about.
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| Where is the evidence that it will 'trickle down'?!?! |
Give it time
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| I doubt you have the requisite understanding of Korea or Korean to understand what you are talking about. |
I know as much as the country as you I bet.
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Are you working in the Gulf? I knew this was a personal gripe and had nothing to do with Korea.
There was a poster who used to boast about how many expensive cars he had and his high paying job. If you are going to get into the bragging game make sure that you at least have something to brag about. |
Basically, I have no gripe with anyone. But you suckers had better marry up and upgrade your qualifications or be flung out on your ear. Don't come crying to me when you are at the departure lounge at Incheon Airport, crying how they have kicked all you 'experienced' teachers out.
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| If you want to work abroad QTS is just as much of a requirement as having a PGCE. They go hand in hand. |
No it is not.
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| I thought that was obvious. |
Well, obviously not. I know loads of PGCE teachers working and making money on the back of their qualification and they don't have QTS.
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| The PGCE + QTS is the professional qualification and as such allows you to build a career. Becoming a licensed teacher means that you can actually have a proper career with opportunities for advancement. |
It is still 2/3rds of an MA - it is not worth as much as an MA - the qualification you like to slag off but don't have yourself.
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| That means the possibility of much high salaries and the bonus of being able to live in the UK or somewhere cool. |
But more work and more stress... you think those international school jobs have you with your brain in neutral whilst scratching your arse.
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| No, but if I was so what? Try not to play up the snobby Brit stereotype too much it is embarassing for the rest of us |
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Don't get upset because you have a BA Poli-Sci and bog all else. It is your responsibility to upgrade your qualifications instead of harping on about 'experience' who no-one gives a shit about, don't come crying to me when they kick your arse out of wherever you are and you are back on the dole in London.
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| Your visa is a bigger determiner of your wage in Korea than anything else. Although if money was your biggest motivating factor I am not sure why anyone would choose Korea long term. |
You are full of shite lad, your BA in Poli-Sci from London Met is just about worth a cup of coffee at Lotteria when it comes to making money from privates in South Korea. If you are also male, you have nothing going for you as regards a top earning prospect concerning privates.
North American female, young, Ivy League education, white with relevant qualifications will always rake in money
British male, Poli-Sci BA from London Met, speaking in an accent no Korean understands - comes in a very poor second. |
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Stu_miller
Joined: 23 Apr 2014
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:59 am Post subject: |
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Quick question: From research, I see that Wall Street English Korea look very favourably on the CELTA certificate. Is that typically regarded as a good company to work for? I definitely know that the British Council massively back CELTA but I'd be interested to find out about other schools' emphasis on it.
Disclaimer: I'm an unashamed CELTA-er. Sure it's no MA, but I think it would make almost any teacher at least think or reflect on their methods, even if you don't buy into their whole modus operandi (I also don't). On a related note, I plan to pursue an MA in applied linguistics next year. |
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robbie_davies
Joined: 16 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| Stu_miller wrote: |
Quick question: From research, I see that Wall Street English Korea look very favourably on the CELTA certificate. Is that typically regarded as a good company to work for? I definitely know that the British Council massively back CELTA but I'd be interested to find out about other schools' emphasis on it.
Disclaimer: I'm an unashamed CELTA-er. Sure it's no MA, but I think it would make almost any teacher at least think or reflect on their methods, even if you don't buy into their whole modus operandi (I also don't). On a related note, I plan to pursue an MA in applied linguistics next year. |
I think with Wall Street being a franchise, there are good ones and bad ones to work for, all a crapshoot but I know in China they pay decent money, is it Wall Street that make teachers work in classrooms that are expoed to the outside so the world at large can watch them at work?
Where do you plan to study for your MA? I would recommend it for sure Stu, I learned loads when I did mine.
NB: I think the CELTA is a good qualification for what it is and for how long it takes, but there is a creepy ass following behind it, very cult like. |
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Stu_miller
Joined: 23 Apr 2014
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 9:30 am Post subject: |
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| robbie_davies wrote: |
| Stu_miller wrote: |
Quick question: From research, I see that Wall Street English Korea look very favourably on the CELTA certificate. Is that typically regarded as a good company to work for? I definitely know that the British Council massively back CELTA but I'd be interested to find out about other schools' emphasis on it.
Disclaimer: I'm an unashamed CELTA-er. Sure it's no MA, but I think it would make almost any teacher at least think or reflect on their methods, even if you don't buy into their whole modus operandi (I also don't). On a related note, I plan to pursue an MA in applied linguistics next year. |
I think with Wall Street being a franchise, there are good ones and bad ones to work for, all a crapshoot but I know in China they pay decent money, is it Wall Street that make teachers work in classrooms that are expoed to the outside so the world at large can watch them at work?
Where do you plan to study for your MA? I would recommend it for sure Stu, I learned loads when I did mine.
NB: I think the CELTA is a good qualification for what it is and for how long it takes, but there is a creepy ass following behind it, very cult like. |
Yes, my understanding is that Wall Street, like any franchise, can be a gamble, but that it is highly regarded by adult students in Korea.
I'm leaning to an MA in Applied Linguistics as opposed to TESOL, although it doesn't seem like there's a great deal of difference between the two. For sure, the discipline of studying whist working will be a big challenge.
It's true that CELTA does promote a very specific model of teaching, but I think if you are any kind of independent, creative human, then you can take the best points from CELTA and make the work for your own teaching style. It's certainly to the be all and end all, but it definitely helped me in my own teaching career. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:11 am Post subject: |
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I mean - you seem to think some stumblebum with 4 weeks CELTA training is superior to a 4 year English graduate! Now you are contradicting yourself.
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A BA in English is a generalist degree like any other humanities degree. A CELTA actually prepares you for the classroom.
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| How would you know, you have never done an MA, you have your BA in poli science and experience. You speak of something you know zip about. |
You are not a professional, I know that much at least. I also have an MA.
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| I know as much as the country as you I bet. |
You don't. Even without meeting you I know that you are not even close.
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| Basically, I have no gripe with anyone. But you suckers had better marry up and upgrade your qualifications or be flung out on your ear. Don't come crying to me when you are at the departure lounge at Incheon Airport, crying how they have kicked all you 'experienced' teachers out. |
I knew this entire thread was just an attempt for you to talk about how awesome you are and how everyone in Korea is a 'sucker'.
Why do you think I am against upgrading my qualifications?
Although if I do decide to make a career of teaching I will do so as a professional.
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| It is still 2/3rds of an MA - it is not worth as much as an MA - the qualification you like to slag off but don't have yourself. |
...that anyone could get with a bank transfer. Stop pretending like your eight month MA was some sort of rigorous course.
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| But more work and more stress... you think those international school jobs have you with your brain in neutral whilst scratching your arse. |
You go on about how little you have to work and then claim that I'll be the one with my brain in neutral.
It seems like you are the one scratching their arse at work.
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| Don't get upset because you have a BA Poli-Sci and bog all else. It is your responsibility to upgrade your qualifications instead of harping on about 'experience' who no-one gives a shit about, don't come crying to me when they kick your arse out of wherever you are and you are back on the dole in London. |
Worse comes to the worse I can always get MA TESOL, it would hardly be a challenge.
That what makes your bragging so strange, an eight month MA at Aston University and you think you are god's gift to education.
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You are full of shite lad, your BA in Poli-Sci from London Met is just about worth a cup of coffee at Lotteria when it comes to making money from privates in South Korea. If you are also male, you have nothing going for you as regards a top earning prospect concerning privates.
North American female, young, Ivy League education, white with relevant qualifications will always rake in money
British male, Poli-Sci BA from London Met, speaking in an accent no Korean understands - comes in a very poor second. |
My degree from a Russell Group university along with other aspects of my background put me in a good position. Not anything to write home about, but enough that I dont have to run off to some hole in the desert just to make 40k.
You are also completely wrong about privates and pretty much everything else. You are clueless. |
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robbie_davies
Joined: 16 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
A BA in English is a generalist degree like any other humanities degree. A CELTA actually prepares you for the classroom. |
Here is Lancaster University's BA in English, now are you telling me that the modules in that 3 year degree are a) not useful for English teaching and b) Stuff not covered in a CELTA?
http://www.lancaster.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/courses/english-language-ba-hons-q304/
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| You are not a professional, I know that much at least. I also have an MA. |
Poli-Sci! And it didn't get you to the House of Commons so you have failed in your quest!
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| You don't. Even without meeting you I know that you are not even close. |
Because you is an idiot. You were the chap who tried to argue that logistcs and supply routes were immaterial to the Americans losing in Vietnam. You aint much of a clue on anything.
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| I knew this entire thread was just an attempt for you to talk about how awesome you are and how everyone in Korea is a 'sucker'. |
I am pretty awesome, it has to be said.
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| Why do you think I am against upgrading my qualifications? |
You have your MA in Poli-Sci - haven't you already upgraded your qualifications or are you now saying your MA is useless!! Hahaha!
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| Although if I do decide to make a career of teaching I will do so as a professional. |
Go and get an MA from Ehwa, that will do the job man, remember, a PGCE is worth 2/3'rds of an MA.
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| ...that anyone could get with a bank transfer. Stop pretending like your eight month MA was some sort of rigorous course. |
It has done the job and got me the payrise. That is being smart and has kept me recession proof.
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You go on about how little you have to work and then claim that I'll be the one with my brain in neutral.
It seems like you are the one scratching their arse at work. |
So you have to work hard to work smart? No need man. You work smart and not hard but you aint that bright therefore you won't have heard of that.
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| Worse comes to the worse I can always get MA TESOL, it would hardly be a challenge. |
It would be far more useful that your MA in Poli-Science where you can waffle on about battles and wars you never fought in. You have an unrelated MA and you are teaching in Korea - do you not think you messed up?
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| That what makes your bragging so strange, an eight month MA at Aston University and you think you are god's gift to education. |
An Msc at Aston University would have been alright actually - you are pretty close though regarding where I did it and I bet it is more use than your MA in Poli-Sci at London Met - how has that done for your job prospects in Korea or anywhere else?
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| My degree from a Russell Group university along with other aspects of my background put me in a good position. Not anything to write home about, but enough that I dont have to run off to some hole in the desert just to make 40k. |
So you run off to a hole in the Far East working at Ding Dong English for 2.0 million won a month, And an MA in Poli Sci from Southampton is no better than one from London Met as far as your future prospects are concerned.
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| You are also completely wrong about privates and pretty much everything else. You are clueless. |
You are earning jack with what you bring to the table, Koreans - if you knew anything about Korea - are not seeking your services regarding privates. You are near to the bottom of the list in regards what they will throw money at regards privates. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah pretty much.
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| Poli-Sci! And it didn't get you to the House of Commons so you have failed in your quest! |
I am much younger than you, so who knows where i'll end up. Although I am not sure why you think I want to work at the HoC.
No worries though, if I fail in life and I can always join you in the desert and settle for second best. I have the bank transfer waiting to go!
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| Because you is an idiot. You were the chap who tried to argue that logistcs and supply routes were immaterial to the Americans losing in Vietnam. You aint much of a clue on anything. |
Didn't you drop out of school at 16?
I tried to argue that supply issues were a result of yank divisions requiring a far higher volume of supplies. The Americans didn't lose because they lacked shells.
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| You have your MA in Poli-Sci - haven't you already upgraded your qualifications or are you now saying your MA is useless!! Hahaha! |
No I am saying your MA is an intermediate qualification that is not a professional license.
I didn't say that a masters is uselss...
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| Go and get an MA from Ehwa, that will do the job man, remember, a PGCE is worth 2/3'rds of an MA. |
Remember a PGCE + QTS is what qualifies you as a professional teacher.
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| It has done the job and got me the payrise. That is being smart and has kept me recession proof. |
Believe me your 40k job in the desert is not making anyone envious.
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| So you have to work hard to work smart? No need man. You work smart and not hard but you aint that bright therefore you won't have heard of that. |
If you truly love the job you are doing then you wouldn't be thinking in terms of how little you work.
Working hard isn't about long hours, but it is about putting your heart into something and being proud of doing a good job.
But hey congratulations you have a job where you can work so little that you forget what you do for a living....I guess that is a life....
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| It would be far more useful that your MA in Poli-Science where you can waffle on about battles and wars you never fought in. You have an unrelated MA and you are teaching in Korea - do you not think you messed up? |
You waffled right their with me buddy, remember? You have an MA TESOL not an MBA from Harvard it is amazing what 8 months at Aston Uni can do to a persons sense of self worth.
I have an MA that is exactly related to where I am and what I am doing. You know nothing about me except what your ego needs to be true.
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| An Msc at Aston University would have been alright actually - you are pretty close though regarding where I did it and I bet it is more use than your MA in Poli-Sci at London Met - how has that done for your job prospects in Korea or anywhere else? |
You would bet wrong...again.
Also I said Russell Group, look it up.
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| So you run off to a hole in the Far East working at Ding Dong English for 2.0 million won a month, And an MA in Poli Sci from Southampton is no better than one from London Met as far as your future prospects are concerned. |
I am curious what uni did you attend and from where did you get your TESOL?
Cos I obviously need some career advice.
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| You are earning jack with what you bring to the table, Koreans - if you knew anything about Korea - are not seeking your services regarding privates. You are near to the bottom of the list in regards what they will throw money at regards privates. |
You know nothing about Korea and I doubt you even bothered to learn anything more substantial than 'hello' and where to out your recycling. |
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robbie_davies
Joined: 16 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
Yeah pretty much. |
Sums up your complete and utter ignorance on the subject.
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| I am much younger than you, so who knows where i'll end up. Although I am not sure why you think I want to work at the HoC. |
The arrogance of youth, I don't think I have stated my age anywhere on here so that is a bit of a presumption to make.
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| No worries though, if I fail in life and I can always join you in the desert and settle for second best. I have the bank transfer waiting to go! |
Yup, better get prepared, you already have one useless MA - you know success in life is about making good choices which you haven't done in taking a BA and MA in Poli-Sci. Do you know the amount of Poli-Sci graduates working alongside me in the desert who tell me they can do a better job than Obama.
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| Didn't you drop out of school at 16? |
I got expelled, lol!
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| I tried to argue that supply issues were a result of yank divisions requiring a far higher volume of supplies. The Americans didn't lose because they lacked shells. |
Your arguments were shite, awful and backed by no in depth study of the subject - typical witterings of an armchair general and you was badly exposed.
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| No I am saying your MA is an intermediate qualification that is not a professional license. |
It isn't and if it is, what does that make the PGCE which is worth a third less than an MA.
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| I didn't say that a masters is uselss... |
Just as well as most of your Poli Sci lecturers at London Met won't have the glorious PGCE that you so admire.
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Remember a PGCE + QTS is what qualifies you as a professional teacher. |
Still worth 2/3rds of an MA, what is an MA without a dissertation - that's right - a PG/DIP.
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| Believe me your 40k job in the desert is not making anyone envious. |
And your 2.0 millon won job at Toss English is the bees knees? As long as we don't have to swap paypackets.
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If you truly love the job you are doing then you wouldn't be thinking in terms of how little you work.
Working hard isn't about long hours, but it is about putting your heart into something and being proud of doing a good job.
But hey congratulations you have a job where you can work so little that you forget what you do for a living....I guess that is a life.... |
You are a child, from your postings it is obvious you are young and clueless, you seem to think you will break into money along the way with your poli-sci BA and MA - you'll be joining me in the desert in another 10 years from now lad, you will see.
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You waffled right their with me buddy, remember? You have an MA TESOL not an MBA from Harvard it is amazing what 8 months at Aston Uni can do to a persons sense of self worth.
I have an MA that is exactly related to where I am and what I am doing. You know nothing about me except what your ego needs to be true. |
You are working at Ding Dong English making 2.0 million a month which is OK I suppose, but are you in Korea, working on what you have learned on your degree or MA? Or are you in Korea because your BA and MA are goddamn useless and you need to go back to school to do a PGCE to make you halfway employable.
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You would bet wrong...again.
Also I said Russell Group, look it up. |
You are teaching kindy at Ding Dong English, you won't admit BA and MA Poli Sci at London Met but if you had anything worth more than bog roll, you wouldn't be hagwon jockeying.
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I am curious what uni did you attend and from where did you get your TESOL?
Cos I obviously need some career advice. |
It was at a university in the Midlands, here is some career advice, get an MA TESOL from Ehwa. If you want to make Korea long term and are not bothered about working in the ME then a Korean MA in Linguistics or TESOL is as good. Now, if you want to work in the ME then go home and do an in class MA or a PGCE.
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| You know nothing about Korea and I doubt you even bothered to learn anything more substantial than 'hello' and where to out your recycling. |
I seem to know more about Korea and how to get ahead han you so it seems, the ignorance of youth. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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| The arrogance of youth, I don't think I have stated my age anywhere on here so that is a bit of a presumption to make. |
I just get this bitter old git vibe from pretty much all your posts.
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| Yup, better get prepared, you already have one useless MA - you know success in life is about making good choices which you haven't done in taking a BA and MA in Poli-Sci. Do you know the amount of Poli-Sci graduates working alongside me in the desert who tell me they can do a better job than Obama. |
Success in life isnt a 40k job in the desert Branson,lol!
If you can get the same working back in the UK then congrats you have finally reached the middle class...what an achievement.
Seriously though, you should stop equating your pay packet with your sense of self worth.
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| I got expelled, lol! |
Not that surprising.
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| Your arguments were shite, awful and backed by no in depth study of the subject - typical witterings of an armchair general and you was badly exposed. |
You did a quick a google search that found a source that pretty much validated what I was saying about why the Americans had supply problems.
Maybe if you had done a poli sci degree you would have understood how to properly research a subject. At the very least it would have done wonders for your reading comprehension.
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| It isn't and if it is, what does that make the PGCE which is worth a third less than an MA. |
A PGCE allows you to train to be a professionally trained teacher. An MA is great, but it isn't a PhD and it isn't a professional qualification.
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| Just as well as most of your Poli Sci lecturers at London Met won't have the glorious PGCE that you so admire. |
Russell Group...seriously look it up.
Also what uni did you go too?
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| And your 2.0 millon won job at Toss English is the bees knees? As long as we don't have to swap paypackets. |
Your worship of money has led you to some desert job that pays a nice middle class wage.
If you knew anything about Korea you would realise that you can earn quite a bit more than 2 mil. You would also understand that there are some things in life worth valuing beyond an extra 5 grand on your pay packet.
At your age you should really understand this simple truth.
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| You are a child, from your postings it is obvious you are young and clueless, you seem to think you will break into money along the way with your poli-sci BA and MA - you'll be joining me in the desert in another 10 years from now lad, you will see. |
So working hard and being proud of doing a good job in a career that you love is childish to you?
Even if I reached rock bottom and only had the desert left open to me, I would still try and do my best, it is a character thing. You wouldn't understand.
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| You are working at Ding Dong English making 2.0 million a month which is OK I suppose, but are you in Korea, working on what you have learned on your degree or MA? Or are you in Korea because your BA and MA are goddamn useless and you need to go back to school to do a PGCE to make you halfway employable. |
I am in Korea because that is where I want to be and I am enjoying my life there for the moment.
As I said before, this thread is about you trying to denigrate anyone in Korea as a loser. That is the only reason why you started posting.
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| You are teaching kindy at Ding Dong English, you won't admit BA and MA Poli Sci at London Met but if you had anything worth more than bog roll, you wouldn't be hagwon jockeying. |
To do what you do doesn't require an Oxbridge education. In fact a London Met qualification would be more than satisfactory.
I did go to uni in London though, but not London Met.
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| It was at a university in the Midlands |
I knew it! Aston University.
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| here is some career advice, get an MA TESOL from Ehwa. If you want to make Korea long term and are not bothered about working in the ME then a Korean MA in Linguistics or TESOL is as good. Now, if you want to work in the ME then go home and do an in class MA or a PGCE. |
Good advice.
See when you are not being vile you can offer some very obvious advice.
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| I seem to know more about Korea and how to get ahead han you so it seems, the ignorance of youth. |
You reduce everything about Korea to 'Ding Dong' hagwon jobs and making 2mil. So yeah, you don't know anything about Korea. |
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robbie_davies
Joined: 16 Jun 2013
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
I just get this bitter old git vibe from pretty much all your posts. |
And I get the clueless little boy vibe from all your posts.
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Success in life isnt a 40k job in the desert Branson,lol!
If you can get the same working back in the UK then congrats you have finally reached the middle class...what an achievement.
Seriously though, you should stop equating your pay packet with your sense of self worth. |
It is allright, I don't claim to be anything, I have a job for life which is more than most can say these days, not everyone can hack the desert though.
I should go and get an MA in Poli-Sci from London Me ahem a Russell Group University and maybe I can have a higher sense of self worth.
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You did a quick a google search that found a source that pretty much validated what I was saying about why the Americans had supply problems.
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Erm, no, it didn't validate anything you said or wrote that day. You were badly exposed.
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| Maybe if you had done a poli sci degree you would have understood how to properly research a subject. At the very least it would have done wonders for your reading comprehension. |
This is a LOL moment - trying to validate your piece of shit degree, haha - you know you are heading to the desert in ten years from now - don't call me Mystic Meg but I can see your future.
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| A PGCE allows you to train to be a professionally trained teacher. An MA is great, but it isn't a PhD and it isn't a professional qualification. |
A PGCE is 2/3rds of an MA and is not as prestigeous as an academic qualification, but then you think a CELTA is worth more than a BA in English so what do you know?
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Russell Group...seriously look it up.
Also what uni did you go too? |
You went to London Met pal.
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Your worship of money has led you to some desert job that pays a nice middle class wage.
If you knew anything about Korea you would realise that you can earn quite a bit more than 2 mil. You would also understand that there are some things in life worth valuing beyond an extra 5 grand on your pay packet.
At your age you should really understand this simple truth. |
When you grow up, you will realise that your Poli Science degree is worth ilch and you will rue the day you slept through your science classes as you sit with me and the other middle aged losers teaching thick Arabs the rudiments of English in a sand castle type building in the middle of Riyadh.
There are so many of your type there, poli-sci graduates who know it all. You will fit in nicely.
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So working hard and being proud of doing a good job in a career that you love is childish to you?
Even if I reached rock bottom and only had the desert left open to me, I would still try and do my best, it is a character thing. You wouldn't understand. |
I do understand, I understand you are working in a hagwon with unrelated qualifications.
You seem to take it as a personal slight that 'political science' is seen as a useless subject for slackers with money, and despite having an MA in the subject - you still have the need to upgrade, do you not think you have messed up?
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| I am in Korea because that is where I want to be and I am enjoying my life there for the moment. |
My cousin who graduated from Imperial College with an Msc in Chemistry is not in Korea teaching at Ding Dong English, see what i am getting at?
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| As I said before, this thread is about you trying to denigrate anyone in Korea as a loser. That is the only reason why you started posting. |
No, actually, I am denigrating fools who sit on a BA in poli-sci whilst teaching in Korea who refuse to upgrade to something a bit more substansial so their little party can last longer. You can see the dogs barking so don't come crying to me when they kick your arse out of there because your slacker poli-sci degrees are deemed useless.
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| To do what you do doesn't require an Oxbridge education. In fact a London Met qualification would be more than satisfactory. |
That is because you have only taught basic conversational English, there is a lot more than 'conversational English' in regards TESOL.
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I did go to uni in London though, but not London Met.
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Greenwich University more than likely.
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| I knew it! Aston University. |
No, not that I would have minded going there, I nearly did plump to do my MA there lol!
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Good advice.
See when you are not being vile you can offer some very obvious advice. |
See, you are not the sum of your poli-science degree no more than I am the sum of a MA TESOL degree, we are both trying to make it out in this big wide world. If you have a poli-science degree and MA and I have my MA TESOL then neither of us are going to be raking it in anytime in the future.
My original point is not to rip into Poli-Sci graduates because a lot of my pals in the desert have this very qualification, though the smart ones do get an upgrade, depends if you want to carry on teaching. Just don't be at the departure lounge at Incheon airport crying because anyone with a glass eye can see what's coming.
And I am not being vile, we are on Dave's it is like complaining about your opponent being violent after you touched gloves by stepping into a boxing ring.
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| You reduce everything about Korea to 'Ding Dong' hagwon jobs and making 2mil. So yeah, you don't know anything about Korea. |
Shite man, I have seen offers as low as 1.8 million - that was bad money even back in 2006!! |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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| And I get the clueless little boy vibe from all your posts. |
Coming from some chav who got expelled that really means a lot.
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It is allright, I don't claim to be anything, I have a job for life which is more than most can say these days, not everyone can hack the desert though.
I should go and get an MA in Poli-Sci from London Me ahem a Russell Group University and maybe I can have a higher sense of self worth. |
You are not a dentist, so drop this 'job for life' rubbish.
Also when it comes to self worth you dont need to look at pay packets or where you went to uni.
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| Erm, no, it didn't validate anything you said or wrote that day. You were badly exposed. |
So your retort is 'I was right and you were wrong!!!'.
Ok, great discussion.
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| This is a LOL moment - trying to validate your piece of shit degree, haha - you know you are heading to the desert in ten years from now - don't call me Mystic Meg but I can see your future. |
For someone who went to Aston Uni you are really snobby about other people's degrees.
Glad to see you are finally acknowledging that a life in the desert is for those with no other option.
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| A PGCE is 2/3rds of an MA and is not as prestigeous as an academic qualification, but then you think a CELTA is worth more than a BA in English so what do you know? |
A professional qualification is more prestigeous than your Aston Uni cert.
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| You went to London Met pal. |
I really didn't. Where did you go to do your undergrad? I bet you didn't major in education.
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When you grow up, you will realise that your Poli Science degree is worth ilch and you will rue the day you slept through your science classes as you sit with me and the other middle aged losers teaching thick Arabs the rudiments of English in a sand castle type building in the middle of Riyadh.
There are so many of your type there, poli-sci graduates who know it all. You will fit in nicely. |
So much self loathing.
No wonder you have to come on these forums and try and bring others down to your level.
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I do understand, I understand you are working in a hagwon with unrelated qualifications.
You seem to take it as a personal slight that 'political science' is seen as a useless subject for slackers with money, and despite having an MA in the subject - you still have the need to upgrade, do you not think you have messed up? |
How many times do I have to say that I am not against upgrading qualifications.
I have hardly messed up if I am doing what I enjoy in the field I was educated and making a tidy sum on the side.
Obviously you are incapable of registering this because to you Korea is just 2 mil hagwons and no opportunities.
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| My cousin who graduated from Imperial College with an Msc in Chemistry is not in Korea teaching at Ding Dong English, see what i am getting at? |
Not really.
Although I think you are trying to suggest that because your cousin didn't go to Korea to teach in a hagwon your weird assertions about my life are true.
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| No, actually, I am denigrating fools who sit on a BA in poli-sci whilst teaching in Korea who refuse to upgrade to something a bit more substansial so their little party can last longer. You can see the dogs barking so don't come crying to me when they kick your arse out of there because your slacker poli-sci degrees are deemed useless. |
You are denigrating them and you obviously have a major gripe with people who went to better universities.
Once again there is no evidence that they are going to make the rules stricter and once again I am not against upgrading qualifications.
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| That is because you have only taught basic conversational English, there is a lot more than 'conversational English' in regards TESOL. |
Unsurprisingly you missed the point.
I meant that to do what you do all that is required is an English degree and MA TESOL from De Montfort University.
Not exactly challenging.
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| Greenwich University more than likely. |
Wrong. Where did you go to Uni?
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| No, not that I would have minded going there, I nearly did plump to do my MA there lol! |
As a chav I am sure you would have felt right at home.
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| See, you are not the sum of your poli-science degree no more than I am the sum of a MA TESOL degree, we are both trying to make it out in this big wide world. If you have a poli-science degree and MA and I have my MA TESOL then neither of us are going to be raking it in anytime in the future. |
Then why have you spent the last few pages writing invective???
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| My original point is not to rip into Poli-Sci graduates because a lot of my pals in the desert have this very qualification, though the smart ones do get an upgrade, depends if you want to carry on teaching. Just don't be at the departure lounge at Incheon airport crying because anyone with a glass eye can see what's coming. |
You have laid every possible insult at people with Poli-Sci degrees and now you are meekly trying to make out that you have nothing against them??
Your words betray your intentions.
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| And I am not being vile, we are on Dave's it is like complaining about your opponent being violent after you touched gloves by stepping into a boxing ring. |
You use vile language and thuggish insults. Your behaviour has been vile and chavvy.
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| Shite man, I have seen offers as low as 1.8 million - that was bad money even back in 2006!! |
It would not be difficult finding a crappy job posting for the ME either. |
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happiness
Joined: 04 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| robbie_davies wrote: |
| happiness wrote: |
They will never kick out the Americans as long as there is a business/support relationship, they couldnt, but who knows.
I came here after school from Japan in the mid-90s, going and coming. I was always open to the food, and growing up with Asians, I wasnt too "Murican.
Now 14 years on, I speak Korean rather well. For me, thats it.
Honestly, I get my jobs because I speak Korean, and I can wear a clean shirt. I can fit in (that doesnt mean anything for Korea, it works everywhere). Ive been lucky as I have had good jobs and such here.
My boss has someone one with a masters, and another with a celta, both kinda haughty persons. But he always says Im his number one, even in front of the others (not my fault), its because of this.
Korea has a ton of "properly" credentialed people, but we have seen now they dont always "fit in." Before we blame Korea, American/Western companies can have the same problem, and do.
Just saying. For me, if I dont need it, I wouldnt get credentials, and I havent it, but thats just me. |
I don't think this is about nationality than the type of degree the teacher has. I agree that American teachers are at a premium here but instead of being happy that a glut of American teachers came on over during the recession, the Korean government increased their basic requirements for an E-2 visa.
But it sounds you have language skills and that you have branched away from teaching. Do you have permanent residence? Married to a Korean? Is your place in Korea secured? |
The e-2 requirements are from that pervy guy a few years ago. I dont have any of those. Im just an E-2. Ive found Im good at selling myself to the jobs I want (decent pay/hours).. I read these posts (too much) and I think there may be a lack of adaptability in some younger peeps (older too, tbf) and that may make a lot of problems. Ive thought about applying for the f visa, but honestly, I cant be bothered (as a single guy), we will see. |
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drydell
Joined: 01 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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OP
I'm a Politics graduate (actually calling politics 'science' was looked down upon in the UK as a crass Americanism when I did it) 
How did I beat all the MA TESOL holders competing to get my great uni 'gig'?
I did a well organized, engaging teaching demostration with a decent lesson plan and clear learning objectives, pitched to the correct level for the students I'd be teaching.
It's EFL mate - it isn't rocket science... |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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| It's EFL mate - it isn't rocket science |
Much as I get sick of hearing that phrase, I tend to agree. You don't need an MA in TESOL to teach EFL, and that's coming from someone who has one. The CELTA comes in for a lot of flack - nearly always from people who don't have one - but it's a much cheaper way of preparing you pretty well to do something that isn't that difficult. |
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