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3DR
Joined: 24 May 2009
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 Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:25 am Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
| Stain wrote: |
| I think there needs to be a knock down drag out battle between the apologists and the haters. Greasers vs. Socs style. The winner is right about everything. |
See, that's the thing. It's this false equivalency. I don't hate Korea. I've said multiple times on this thread that Korea does great at the Olympics, better than my home country even (at least in summer). But SR frames everything as an attack on Korea and defends it to the limit. Go look at the Sewol thread. I didn't really post there, but SR was defending the captain. Are the people condemning him 'haters' and 'bashers'? It's not bi-polar like that. There are haters, but not every interaction is one or the other.
It's like the people who say FOX news is right-winged and everything else is Left-winged. No, FOX is extremely right, MSNBC is pretty Left, and most everything else is somewhere in the middle. It's like how Bill Maher said, Anderson Cooper isn't like Bill O'Reiley. People tend to see things as opposites, but just because one side is extremist doesn't mean the people who disagree with them are, too. In fact, extremists have more in common than moderates. I'm a moderate. Korea has good things and bad things. But SR and his minions here blow up everything I (and some others) say about Korea to make it seem like we're these huge haters and complainers. Look at the nightlife thread. I said NY was more of a 24 hour city than Seoul. I was called racist, delusional, a hater, a complainer and mentally ill. Just like here. All for saying Korea is good at the Olympics, but not so great on the smaller scale. Even if you disagree with both those positions, neither of them are extreme or 'hating'. |
Yet you do the same thing. You claim to say I "follow you" in all threads you post in, yet you seem to have missed countless threads where yes I do criticize things I hate here. Yet somehow I'm the apologist. I'm also a "moderate" as you would call it.
You constantly exaggerate and berate anyone who may offer some opinions or evidence that counters your opinion. If they do not agree with you, you get upset.
You constantly bring up that nightlife thread like it's your rallying cry. You've got to let it go man. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
| Stain wrote: |
| I think there needs to be a knock down drag out battle between the apologists and the haters. Greasers vs. Socs style. The winner is right about everything. |
See, that's the thing. It's this false equivalency. Go look at the Sewol thread. I didn't really post there, but SR was defending the captain. Are the people condemning him 'haters' and 'bashers'? It's not bi-polar like that. There are haters, but not every interaction is one or the other.
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BlackCat, you can't even remember things accurately or understand what someone is trying to say. I never defended the captain. Go and look at that thread. I said he was guilty of cowardice and negligence and the death penalty should seriously be considered. However, ordering everyone on deck on a listing ship where containers are falling down the deck might not be the correct move and the timeline showed that things deteriorated rapidly and instead of having like, hours to move everyone, they had 5 minutes with which to analyze, stabilize, form a plan of action, and execute before movement became untenable. That's not defending the captain. That's looking at the facts of the case. If you did pay attention to that thread you'd notice people say repeatedly "YOU'RE DEFENDING THE CAPTAIN AND KOREA" and all this, but no one really argued the circumstances of the case and whether 5 minutes was enough time to do those things or putting people on deck with falling containers is ALWAYS the safest course of action and the fact that if the ship hadn't sank but someone was crushed by a container that the captain would have been blamed for 'hastily ordering people on deck'. That's not defending the captain. That's basic elements of decision making science.
And BC, I don't have any minions. We don't have secret meetings.
As for bigotry and sports- Yes, when you attach different values to Olympic golds based on the ethnicity of the athlete, with no knowledge of each individual athlete's background, and imply that certain nation's medals are more pure and representative than other nation's, then yes, that is bigoted. A gold medal is a gold medal and hats off to whoever wins it from whatever country. That's what I think. But apparently gold medals from Korean or Chinese or Eastern European are not quite as pure or special because they go to sports academies (like we don't), or that they "specialize" (which they don't). Why does there always have to be this qualifier with their accomplishments? A Kenyan who wins gold is as good as an Argentinian is as good as a Serbia is as good as an American is as good as a Saudi is as good as a Thai is as good as a Chinese is as good as a Korean. Whenever one of them wins, I don't start thinking about how their medals are less significant than one of our pure, noble, humble, local Joes winning it. |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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Again, this is what I mean. SR totally puts words in other people's mouths and completely misrepresents what they say. I said Koreans will lots of medals in select sports. He's the one saying people don't value those sports. I certainly never did. But it's the only way he can 'win'.
And yes you did defend the captain's actions. Anyone who read that thread knows it. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
And yes you did defend the captain's actions. Anyone who read that thread knows it.
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And you defend Stalin if you think he was okay for fighting Hitler. That's your logic. Because you aren't condemning every single thing the person ever did or every part of a situation, you must be defending them.
Anyone who thinks like that is a peawit. |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Ah, more personal attacks. You and your minions 3DR and UM are really good at that. I guess when you have no actual evidence or argument... |
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3DR
Joined: 24 May 2009
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
| Ah, more personal attacks. You and your minions 3DR and UM are really good at that. I guess when you have no actual evidence or argument... |
Something is really wrong with you.  |
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Savant
Joined: 25 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
BlackCat, you can't even remember things accurately or understand what someone is trying to say. I never defended the captain. Go and look at that thread. I said he was guilty of cowardice and negligence and the death penalty should seriously be considered. However, ordering everyone on deck on a listing ship where containers are falling down the deck might not be the correct move and the timeline showed that things deteriorated rapidly and instead of having like, hours to move everyone, they had 5 minutes with which to analyze, stabilize, form a plan of action, and execute before movement became untenable. That's not defending the captain. That's looking at the facts of the case. |
The fact of the case is that the Captain abandoned ship when he had enough time to make a general sounding of "abandon ship". They are still recovering bodies from the Sewol and yet you still defend the Captain's action. Form a plan of action? The Captain's and senior crew's plan of action were to get the f*** out of there when the sh** hit the fan. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2014 6:40 am Post subject: |
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| FDNY wrote: |
| cmxc, you prattle on like some delusional meth head with a grade ten education. Obviously the US has a few more companies. It is 6-7 times bigger than Korea with 200 years or relative peace and prosperity behind it. Korea has gone from nothing to having global powerhouses in 40 years. As for the PISA test, maybe you should call out the OECD on that one. As for robotics, I'm not talking about armed drones that kill innocent children or armed droids to gun down Mexicans. |
meth-heads usually don't have much of an appetite, yet cmcx ate your lunch.
His criticisms of your post were on the mark. He could have added that Samsung's newest innovation is lower profits--two quarters in a row. |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2014 7:03 am Post subject: |
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I see Herr Goebbels, (sr to those not in the know) is up to his old tricks, spinning and distorting the posts of others rather than supplying pertinent facts to support his opinion, which he states as fact.
So many words in his posts and yet they remain devoid of reason and fact. Can't those who are always giving the Korean medical system mad props find the dude a doctor who can cure his logorrhea?
For anyone who wants to engage in a "debate" with herr goebbels, I suggest the following: http://lifehacker.com/5872379/how-do-i-get-out-of-an-argument-with-an-irrational-person
And why didn't he ever get to fly the plane? Maybe his parents know something we don't. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2014 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| meth-heads usually don't have much of an appetite, yet cmcx ate your lunch. |
We don't normally agree, but that...that was pretty good there. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="misher"]
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UrbanMyth: do you think you could actually observe for once what goes around you? You know. Make Korean friends, learn Korean to a proficient level? Maybe gather some data? All you seem to do is point out that the observations/data that people use for informed opinions is moot because they haven't interviewed every Korean alive. |
Make Korean friends? I'm sure I have as many Korean friends as you have had, probably more...because I've been here far longer. And when I say "friends" I mean the type of friends who invite you over to their family's house for Chusok (six in total over the years I've been here). As for learning Korean I've pointed out in previous posts that I'm TOPIK level 3 and I've also pointed out my reasons for not advancing any further.
And no I've never said or implied observations or data is moot because they haven't interviewed every Korean alive.
But if people are going to make (and claim) statements as fact about the "MAJORITY" of this or that...then shouldn't they be expected to have more then a passing experience with said majority?
Black Cat claimed that the majority of schools do not have more than one sports team. Yet he provided no data for his claim. Yet I do not see you asking him to source his claims. As for me I made no claims, I merely asked Black Cat to provide the data for HIS. So far he has failed to so other than personal observations at the scbools he's been at...3,4,5...?
Personal observations are all fine and good but all they can relate to are one's personal experiences. I'm sure if I made the claim that the majority of schools (based on my observations) have more than one sports team that I'd be asked for data. Why does BC get a pass while I who MADE NO CLAIMS get asked for it? |
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postfundie
Joined: 28 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 8:29 am Post subject: |
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| As for bigotry and sports- Yes, when you attach different values to Olympic golds based on the ethnicity of the athlete, with no knowledge of each individual athlete's background, and imply that certain nation's medals are more pure and representative than other nation's, then yes, that is bigoted |
you mean like every gold medal that Korea has ever won and that the media here worships? you mean like the people who say ' 우리나라' and think of their land as having a pure race and think that their country is more racially pure than the African countries? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| postfundie wrote: |
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| As for bigotry and sports- Yes, when you attach different values to Olympic golds based on the ethnicity of the athlete, with no knowledge of each individual athlete's background, and imply that certain nation's medals are more pure and representative than other nation's, then yes, that is bigoted |
you mean like every gold medal that Korea has ever won and that the media here worships? you mean like the people who say "우리나라' and think of their land as having a pure race and think that their country is more racially pure than the African countries? |
Yes, SOME Korean fans have that attitude. I'm not talking to them right now am I? I'm addressing the more slickly packaged, but still the same sentiment, of the "they're just academy athletes who only win because they are state sponsored and they have no soul and specialize in rinky dinky sports. Completely different from our athletes. Where a college scholarship to a public uni with state of the art facilities and medical is NOT state sponsorship. Where shelling out 40k a year at private acadamies is more noble thsn public athletics schools and where our victories in equestrian or rowing. that are 75% of our medal count represent 'athletic diversity' rather than specialization. |
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byrddogs
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Yes, SOME Korean fans have that attitude. I'm not talking to them right now am I? I'm addressing the more slickly packaged, but still the same sentiment, of the "they're just academy athletes who only win because they are state sponsored and they have no soul and specialize in rinky dinky sports. Completely different from our athletes. Where a college scholarship to a public uni with state of the art facilities and medical is NOT state sponsorship. Where shelling out 40k a year at private acadamies is more noble thsn public athletics schools and where our victories in equestrian or rowing. that are 75% of our medal count represent 'athletic diversity' rather than specialization. |
I was following along in the red part. You lost me in the blue. What were you trying to say? Who is "our"? |
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postfundie
Joined: 28 May 2004
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 2:53 am Post subject: |
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| 'athletic diversity' |
you mean where you have people with different skin color on your team? where you value athletes because of who they are? and not because of their 'pure blood' ?? |
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