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optik404
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
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 Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Chaparrastique wrote: |
| optik404 wrote: |
| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
Sadly, I think this is a big part of Korean society. By showing that you're having fun, Koreans think you're showing off. It's the same reason why when you ask a Korean how they're doing you'll likely hear 'terrible', 'bad', 'busy', etc. This has been confirmed by countless adult students and friends I've had here. That's why getting hammered is so common here, because it's the only time Koreans allow themselves to project positive emotions. I laugh at the idea that Koreans don't show emotion. They totally do, but usually just the negative ones. How many times have we seen Koreans throw a tizzy fit with crying, screaming and whining? But laughing, smiles and joking are only reserved for 5 bottles of soju after work. That's actually the stated reason, so a Korean can get to know 'the real you'.
Unfortunately, I think that's why us foreigners are expected to play the clown in class. We're outside this rigid structure, and then it's taken to the other extreme. We're not here to discipline or be taken seriously. We're here to be the clowns in class. Again, how many of have been told to be 'fun' and 'funny' in the classroom. It's because that's not allowed in Korean society. And then our co-teachers get jealous seeing the kids have fun with us and it creates resentment. Vicious circle, all of it. |
Uh, I see people smiling, laughing, and joking all the time. Have you never been to a cafe? |
really? They don't exactly smile and joke all the time. Even at a hof they are often aggressive or obnoxious drunks as opposed to simply merry.
But what we're talking about specifically is how some of them react to the sight and sound of foreigners a) enjoying themselves or b) being successful. |
I said I see it all the time, not that they smile and laugh all the time. If they smiled 24/7 they would be crazy. Go in to a Starbucks, watch groups of people, some of them will be laughing and smiling, some won't. You know like normal god damn people.
Do you and some other posters really think that when Koreans gather, they just sit there straight faced, never laughing, never smiling, never joking?
I do find it interesting that when Koreans say they are doing bad, busy, terrible, etc. this is a bad thing. But when Westerners are asked how are you doing, we almost always answer, good. Like that's somehow better than saying you're doing bad. |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| I think Koreans just understand better than westerners that whatever happens on any level of reality (physical, emotional, or mental) also happens on every other level. The adults can definitely can control their emotions when they want to. |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:03 am Post subject: |
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| optik404 wrote: |
| Chaparrastique wrote: |
| optik404 wrote: |
| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
Sadly, I think this is a big part of Korean society. By showing that you're having fun, Koreans think you're showing off. It's the same reason why when you ask a Korean how they're doing you'll likely hear 'terrible', 'bad', 'busy', etc. This has been confirmed by countless adult students and friends I've had here. That's why getting hammered is so common here, because it's the only time Koreans allow themselves to project positive emotions. I laugh at the idea that Koreans don't show emotion. They totally do, but usually just the negative ones. How many times have we seen Koreans throw a tizzy fit with crying, screaming and whining? But laughing, smiles and joking are only reserved for 5 bottles of soju after work. That's actually the stated reason, so a Korean can get to know 'the real you'.
Unfortunately, I think that's why us foreigners are expected to play the clown in class. We're outside this rigid structure, and then it's taken to the other extreme. We're not here to discipline or be taken seriously. We're here to be the clowns in class. Again, how many of have been told to be 'fun' and 'funny' in the classroom. It's because that's not allowed in Korean society. And then our co-teachers get jealous seeing the kids have fun with us and it creates resentment. Vicious circle, all of it. |
Uh, I see people smiling, laughing, and joking all the time. Have you never been to a cafe? |
really? They don't exactly smile and joke all the time. Even at a hof they are often aggressive or obnoxious drunks as opposed to simply merry.
But what we're talking about specifically is how some of them react to the sight and sound of foreigners a) enjoying themselves or b) being successful. |
I said I see it all the time, not that they smile and laugh all the time. If they smiled 24/7 they would be crazy. Go in to a Starbucks, watch groups of people, some of them will be laughing and smiling, some won't. You know like normal god damn people.
Do you and some other posters really think that when Koreans gather, they just sit there straight faced, never laughing, never smiling, never joking?
I do find it interesting that when Koreans say they are doing bad, busy, terrible, etc. this is a bad thing. But when Westerners are asked how are you doing, we almost always answer, good. Like that's somehow better than saying you're doing bad. |
I re-read my original post several times and never did I see where I said no Korean ever has fun, laughs or jokes around. I said that in general they don't show positive emotions as much as other cultures, unless they are getting drunk. In my hogwan days, foreign teachers had one staff room and the Koreans another. When going into the foreign room there'd be a good chance that at least a few of them were laughing, telling a funny story, making a joke or goofing around on some level. I rarely ever saw the same sort of behaviour in the Korean staff room. And I'd say that has stayed true throughout my time here. Most Korean work environments are like funerals. It's not a language barrier issue, most of the time the Korean room was completely silent. I'd have to do work in there some nights and you could hear a pin drop unless one of them was scream-talking on their phone (which rarely sounded like a fun conversation, it was mostly whining if not crying and yelling). I'm not saying Koreans don't have fun or enjoy laughing or whatever, I'm saying they're generally much more reserved and hide that sort of thing.
Like I said, this isn't just coming from me, countless adult students have told me the same thing. In Korea, if you look like you're enjoying yourself then others will think you're shoving your good time in their face while they are 'suffering'. That's why it often goes to the other extreme of people having (mostly fake) breakdowns and panic attacks, running all over the places waving their arms screaming about how busy they are.
As for saying "terrible" and the like every time someone asks how you're doing, I do think it's rude because I'm not here to solve you're problems. I'm not your best friend or your mother. "How are you today" is just a greeting, not an invitation to dump all your problems on me. It's like how Koreans ask, "Have you eaten rice?". I don't go into a long detailed story about how I'm so hungry and it must be nice for them to have so much rice, because I have to work for every damn grain I can get because my life is so terrible. It's just a figure of speech, a greeting. Besides, often there is nothing actually terrible in the person's life here in Korea, it just fits back into that contest to see who can act the most victimized I mentioned above.
"How are you today?"
"Terrible!"
"Oh no, what's wrong?"
"I'm a bit tired."
"Oh my god! What a travesty! Thank you for sharing it with me. Your life must be a rollercoaster of hardships, you poor hard working martyr!" |
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trueblue
Joined: 15 Jun 2014
Location: In between the lines
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:21 am Post subject: |
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| What is so bad about bowing? Get over yourself. No one is going to come from behind and start raping you if you do it once |
It is not a matter of "getting over myself" nor is it a matter of "raping" as you so dramatically stated it. Don't polarize my statement, asshole.
I simply would not bow to her parents...simple.
So, get over YOURSELF. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 5:31 am Post subject: |
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| trueblue wrote: |
| Quote: |
| What is so bad about bowing? Get over yourself. No one is going to come from behind and start raping you if you do it once |
It is not a matter of "getting over myself" nor is it a matter of "raping" as you so dramatically stated it. Don't polarize my statement, asshole.
I simply would not bow to her parents...simple.
So, get over YOURSELF. |
Why? What would horror would happen if you bowed to her parents? Is it a religious thing? I can understand that. |
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Chaparrastique
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:15 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| trueblue wrote: |
| Quote: |
| What is so bad about bowing? Get over yourself. No one is going to come from behind and start raping you if you do it once |
It is not a matter of "getting over myself" nor is it a matter of "raping" as you so dramatically stated it. Don't polarize my statement, asshole.
I simply would not bow to her parents...simple.
So, get over YOURSELF. |
Why? What would horror would happen if you bowed to her parents? Is it a religious thing? I can understand that. |
Bowing is about respect, so they'd have to do something to earn my respect first.
No way I'd bow to some abusive soju bore. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:33 am Post subject: |
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| Chaparrastique wrote: |
| Steelrails wrote: |
| trueblue wrote: |
| Quote: |
| What is so bad about bowing? Get over yourself. No one is going to come from behind and start raping you if you do it once |
It is not a matter of "getting over myself" nor is it a matter of "raping" as you so dramatically stated it. Don't polarize my statement, asshole.
I simply would not bow to her parents...simple.
So, get over YOURSELF. |
Why? What would horror would happen if you bowed to her parents? Is it a religious thing? I can understand that. |
Bowing is about respect, so they'd have to do something to earn my respect first.
No way I'd bow to some abusive soju bore. |
It's also a basic greeting akin to a handshake. I see no difference between the two. Any difference that exists is based on one's own mental psychology and perceptions rather than any basis in physical reality. |
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Chaparrastique
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr. BlackCat wrote: |
Sadly, I think this is a big part of Korean society. By showing that you're having fun, Koreans think you're showing off. It's the same reason why when you ask a Korean how they're doing you'll likely hear 'terrible', 'bad', 'busy', etc. This has been confirmed by countless adult students and friends I've had here. That's why getting hammered is so common here, because it's the only time Koreans allow themselves to project positive emotions. I laugh at the idea that Koreans don't show emotion. They totally do, but usually just the negative ones. How many times have we seen Koreans throw a tizzy fit with crying, screaming and whining? But laughing, smiles and joking are only reserved for 5 bottles of soju after work. That's actually the stated reason, so a Korean can get to know 'the real you'.
Unfortunately, I think that's why us foreigners are expected to play the clown in class. We're outside this rigid structure, and then it's taken to the other extreme. We're not here to discipline or be taken seriously. We're here to be the clowns in class. Again, how many of have been told to be 'fun' and 'funny' in the classroom. It's because that's not allowed in Korean society. And then our co-teachers get jealous seeing the kids have fun with us and it creates resentment. Vicious circle, all of it |
| trueblue wrote: |
But, I don't tolerate much from the scamming co-teachers. As long as they stay on their side of line, I stay on mine. However, once they start utilizing that passive aggressive agenda, I just remind them that they would not have their way of life if it were not for the taxpayers of my country.
Sorry, I am not trying to hijack the thread.
However, I would never marry a Korean woman. And, I don't mean any disrespect to those that have done so.
I just could not marry into their culture. I would NEVER bow to her parents or tolerate the cultural "challenges" that come with the relationship, including how the children are handled. |
| MrBlackCat wrote: |
I re-read my original post several times and never did I see where I said no Korean ever has fun, laughs or jokes around. I said that in general they don't show positive emotions as much as other cultures, unless they are getting drunk. In my hogwan days, foreign teachers had one staff room and the Koreans another. When going into the foreign room there'd be a good chance that at least a few of them were laughing, telling a funny story, making a joke or goofing around on some level. I rarely ever saw the same sort of behaviour in the Korean staff room. And I'd say that has stayed true throughout my time here. Most Korean work environments are like funerals. It's not a language barrier issue, most of the time the Korean room was completely silent. I'd have to do work in there some nights and you could hear a pin drop unless one of them was scream-talking on their phone (which rarely sounded like a fun conversation, it was mostly whining if not crying and yelling). I'm not saying Koreans don't have fun or enjoy laughing or whatever, I'm saying they're generally much more reserved and hide that sort of thing.
Like I said, this isn't just coming from me, countless adult students have told me the same thing. In Korea, if you look like you're enjoying yourself then others will think you're shoving your good time in their face while they are 'suffering'. That's why it often goes to the other extreme of people having (mostly fake) breakdowns and panic attacks, running all over the places waving their arms screaming about how busy they are.
As for saying "terrible" and the like every time someone asks how you're doing, I do think it's rude because I'm not here to solve you're problems. I'm not your best friend or your mother. "How are you today" is just a greeting, not an invitation to dump all your problems on me. It's like how Koreans ask, "Have you eaten rice?". I don't go into a long detailed story about how I'm so hungry and it must be nice for them to have so much rice, because I have to work for every damn grain I can get because my life is so terrible. It's just a figure of speech, a greeting. Besides, often there is nothing actually terrible in the person's life here in Korea, it just fits back into that contest to see who can act the most victimized I mentioned above.
"How are you today?"
"Terrible!"
"Oh no, what's wrong?"
"I'm a bit tired."
"Oh my god! What a travesty! Thank you for sharing it with me. Your life must be a rollercoaster of hardships, you poor hard working martyr!" |
Insightful posts. |
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