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cmxc
Joined: 19 May 2008
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:28 pm Post subject: Improving manners of Koreans |
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Perhaps I should add some background here. I first visited Korea as a backpacker in 1989, and lived here in the early 1990s before returning for good in 1998. Korea back in those early days was very, very rough around the edges.
In the streets, people had a habit I had experienced nowhere else ― Barging forcefully into one other while walking, with nary an "Excuse me." Ajummah were infamous for kneeing, elbowing and shouldering everyone else out of the way to occupy seats on public transport. Gangs of children, if they spotted a foreigner, would chant a semi-racist song: "Hello, hello, Mr. Monkey." (Adults generally looked on with smiling indulgence at this jollity.)
Men did not converse; they snarled and barked, interspersing their discourse with table banging, finger pointing and cigarette chewing in noisy attempts to out-alpha the other males. And everywhere you went, you would encounter blokes hawking theatrically, then spitting dramatically.
Virtually all of these behaviors have since evaporated. |
Umm, have all of these behaviors evaporated??? I seem to see such behavior on a daily basis still...
Improving manners of Koreans
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/opinon/2014/09/351_164584.html |
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Died By Bear

Joined: 13 Jul 2010 Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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There was still pissing/pooping going on in the streets in broad daylight out in the rural towns in 1990. I couldn't believe it because to me 1990 was such a modern time...I was just a kid and my dad was a USAF pilot at Osan. It was an interesting time. |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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The Korea Times will print any crap. Koreans are still shockingly rude by any measure. Young and old alike. |
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le-paul

Joined: 07 Apr 2009 Location: dans la chambre
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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I have seen people shitting on the street at 4 times in the last 3 years. Once in Daegu and 3 times in Gyeongju.
The elevator in my gfs building was also regularly shat in until she moved - I believe it still happens.
Anyway, something that has surprised me a lot lately is Koreans perceptions of themselves. Ive been doing a little social experiment to make sure iM not making any presumptions. This is what I have done;
During a basic writing exercise for adults, I ask the students to list as many adjectives as they can. I offer them a simple subject to start 'your home' (I explain this can be your actual abode, country, whatever).
Without fail, every time, students mention Korean people and usually describe them with the following information 'Kind, generous, well mannered, open minded' ('kind' and 'well mannered' always come up). (They also always describe Korea as 'very clean' and 'safe', i.e. no crime, accidents or sexual assault etc.)
I next follow the lists up by writing examples on the board so we can expand on them - and I can tell you, there seems to be no doubt in these peoples minds that the way they have described Korean people, is 100 % accurate.
I have my own theories as to why this is, though Im not at the bottom of it yet. For example;
a/ It is what you are accustomed to, so therefor have no comparison.
b/ I am missing something - perhaps being too negative.
c/ They dont want to say anything negative in front of a foreigner.
d/ They spend their majority of time around people who display these characteristics, and therefore don't notice other behavoiur.
e/ They arent looking for it (whereas perhaps I am), so dont see it. |
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Captain Corea

Joined: 28 Feb 2005 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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We must chat with different ppl, le-paul. I can't imagine any of my students saying that there are no accidents in Korea. Hell, this year alone we covered the topic of safety in culture numerous times, the Sewol being a huge factor.
As well, I've never once found shit in or near my building. Come to think of it, never around any of my buildings. The only time I've seen it was on the sidewalk or near some grass - likely by a dog. But I very much expect this is neighborhood/city/area dependent.
When it comes to discussions on safety though, I find that myself and my students often approach it quite differently. When they say the roads are "safe", they are saying (upon further discussion) that the roads are safer than years past. When I say they are dangerous, I'm using my home city in Canada as a comparison. |
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le-paul

Joined: 07 Apr 2009 Location: dans la chambre
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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Captain Corea wrote: |
We must chat with different ppl, le-paul. I can't imagine any of my students saying that there are no accidents in Korea. Hell, this year alone we covered the topic of safety in culture numerous times, the Sewol being a huge factor.
As well, I've never once found shit in or near my building. Come to think of it, never around any of my buildings. The only time I've seen it was on the sidewalk or near some grass - likely by a dog. But I very much expect this is neighborhood/city/area dependent.
When it comes to discussions on safety though, I find that myself and my students often approach it quite differently. When they say the roads are "safe", they are saying (upon further discussion) that the roads are safer than years past. When I say they are dangerous, I'm using my home city in Canada as a comparison. |
Like I said, Im treating this as a social experiment and not leading them in any way, simply just collecting the results. These are their words, not mine (I did something similar around 2001 about Koreans perceptions of mental health and submitted the results to my university for a research project).
You have to remember the demographics of our students will differ significantly if you are living in Seoul. You even posted yourself this morning/yesterday about issues at a smaller airport in Korea, which is further South. |
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Captain Corea

Joined: 28 Feb 2005 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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le-paul wrote: |
You have to remember the demographics of our students will differ significantly if you are living in Seoul. You even posted yourself this morning/yesterday about issues at a smaller airport in Korea, which is further South. |
Oh ,yeah, for sure. That's why I underlined that one bit. |
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Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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Koreans are excessively considerate and generous to the point of neurosis and smothering if they feel affinity to you.
If youre just another rat out there in the rat race they can be shockingly indifferent.
I also feel that sometimes people feel overly entitled to kindness and politeness. Some if it is reasonable entitlement. Some of it comes across as spoiled. |
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Captain Corea

Joined: 28 Feb 2005 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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Steelrails wrote: |
Koreans are excessively considerate and generous to the point of neurosis and smothering if they feel affinity to you. |
Yup, I see this every day in the offices. Team members tripping over each other to hold the door/pay/compliment/whatever. It's comical.
And then they let the door slam on the next person going through because they don't know them.  |
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Chaparrastique
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:18 pm Post subject: Re: Improving manners of Koreans |
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Thanks for posting. A fun and well-penned piece.
Quote: |
Umm, have all of these behaviors evaporated??? I seem to see such behavior on a daily basis still... |
I do too but its dmostly the 0ver-50's. So its dying out.
Unless the younger generation is simply waiting til they get older to come out with all these behaviors.
Le-paul wrote: |
something that has surprised me a lot lately is Koreans perceptions of themselves. |
Koreans are mostly totally oblivious to how they are percieved or the effect of their behaviour.
Koreans have invariably told me the same speel: "foreigners like Korea because they have a good life here because koreans are so kind and polite".
CaptainCorea wrote: |
I've never once found shit in or near my building. Come to think of it, never around any of my buildings. |
Its a dying practice but its still too common. My former hogwon building used to frequently have a shit left in the stairwell, I used to think it was some drunk who couldn't make it until a Korean told me that its what disgruntled former employees or neighbours do to eachother. |
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le-paul

Joined: 07 Apr 2009 Location: dans la chambre
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:31 pm Post subject: Re: Improving manners of Koreans |
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Chaparrastique wrote: |
Thanks for posting. A fun and well-penned piece.
Quote: |
Umm, have all of these behaviors evaporated??? I seem to see such behavior on a daily basis still... |
I do too but its dmostly the 0ver-50's. So its dying out.
Unless the younger generation is simply waiting til they get older to come out with all these behaviors.
Le-paul wrote: |
something that has surprised me a lot lately is Koreans perceptions of themselves. |
Koreans are mostly totally oblivious to how they are percieved or the effect of their behaviour.
Koreans have invariably told me the same speel: "foreigners like Korea because they have a good life here because koreans are so kind and polite".
CaptainCorea wrote: |
I've never once found shit in or near my building. Come to think of it, never around any of my buildings. |
Its a dying practice but its still too common. My former hogwon building used to frequently have a shit left in the stairwell, I used to think it was some drunk who couldn't make it until a Korean told me that its what disgruntled former employees or neighbours do to each other. |
I have heard that exact same speech so many times. Its uncanny that you said that![/u] |
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le-paul

Joined: 07 Apr 2009 Location: dans la chambre
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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Captain Corea wrote: |
le-paul wrote: |
You have to remember the demographics of our students will differ significantly if you are living in Seoul. You even posted yourself this morning/yesterday about issues at a smaller airport in Korea, which is further South. |
Oh ,yeah, for sure. That's why I underlined that one bit. |
That is stimmt. |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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Steelrails wrote: |
I also feel that sometimes people feel overly entitled to kindness and politeness. |
LOL. You never give up, do you? |
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Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009 Location: Earth, Solar System
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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Smithington wrote: |
Steelrails wrote: |
I also feel that sometimes people feel overly entitled to kindness and politeness. |
LOL. You never give up, do you? |
Look, some people have legitimate gripes, but sometimes people are complaining that people basically aren't fawning over them and hinging on their every move.
That and you get the irrational complaints like "People here don't say 'bless you' after you sneeze, its so strange and rude, blah blah blah". Someone sneezed, who gives a crap? |
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atwood
Joined: 26 Dec 2009
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Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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Steelrails wrote: |
Smithington wrote: |
Steelrails wrote: |
I also feel that sometimes people feel overly entitled to kindness and politeness. |
LOL. You never give up, do you? |
Look, some people have legitimate gripes, but sometimes people are complaining that people basically aren't fawning over them and hinging on their every move.
That and you get the irrational complaints like "People here don't say 'bless you' after you sneeze, its so strange and rude, blah blah blah". Someone sneezed, who gives a crap? |
Can you link to such a post?
How about if someone sneezed all over you and didn't say sorry or excuse me? |
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