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julian_w
Joined: 08 Sep 2003
Location: Somewhere beyond Middle Peak Hotel, north of Middle Earth, and well away from the Middle of the Road
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 Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 2:05 am Post subject: People's Climate March: Busan Sat. 5pm; Seoul Sun. 10am |
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If you can't make the Seoul 350.org People's Climate March action on Sunday morning at 10am because you're too far from Seoul,
http://act.350.org/event/peoples_climate/7679
... then think about coming to join the Busan Beach Boys and Girls on Saturday night,
on Gwangali Beach from 5-7pm!
http://busanclimateaction.com
We'll have signs to share, and time for food, drink, and catch up after. All welcome: the more the merrier!
For inspiration, check it out:
http://watchdisruption.com
... then book a train or bus, or dust off your bike and come and be a part of the turning tide. |
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cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 3:05 am Post subject: |
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"Let's not only stop traffic, but end civilisation entirely!"  |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:57 am Post subject: |
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Between Mannam and the lads to the North, any event with the word "People's" makes me leery.
Even "People's Elbow" might be a bit much. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 5:13 am Post subject: |
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While it's one of the most important topics facing humans, it is just a symptom of the root problem.
Just rewrite the laws that dictate how "the corporation" as a machine functions. Write into law that 'the estimated cost of all externalities must be deducted from net profit' on the income statement. And 'if the resulting number is negative the corporate charter will be suspended until a plan is submitted to correct their operations'.
Problem solved, not just this one but all problems solved at once. Marching doesn't do anything, because nobody cares what the masses think. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| Oh and population control, you've got to have a central alliance of governments that starts working together on how to decrease the Earth's population back from 7B, to 1B or whatever the ideal number is... |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:12 am Post subject: |
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| KimchiNinja wrote: |
While it's one of the most important topics facing humans, it is just a symptom of the root problem.
Just rewrite the laws that dictate how "the corporation" as a machine functions. Write into law that 'the estimated cost of all externalities must be deducted from net profit' on the income statement. And 'if the resulting number is negative the corporate charter will be suspended until a plan is submitted to correct their operations'.
Problem solved, not just this one but all problems solved at once. Marching doesn't do anything, because nobody cares what the masses think. |
You cannot stop the system/machine. It runs on it's own. You can try to tame it, but it is like a wild animal. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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Hey I have a great idea relating to climate and pollution. How about we regulate all industry to an extreme instead of moderately and drive it out of Europe and North America? Then let it go to China and pollute with infinitity in a way the world has not seen since the Industrial Revolution during 19th century England. Yeah, way to help the earth. At least with moderate pollution in the west, it would have been far less than in China and there could have been jobs for blue collar workers.
Brilliant!! |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Died By Bear wrote: |
| You cannot stop the system/machine. It runs on it's own. You can try to tame it, but it is like a wild animal. |
That's the point of my post! Humans designed the machine the way they designed it, and now it runs on its own. They could redesign it, and then it would run on its own in that new way.
But since nobody at these functions is capable of grasping root cause, I would never show up. |
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Beeyee
Joined: 29 May 2007
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:27 am Post subject: |
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| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Oh and population control, you've got to have a central alliance of governments that starts working together on how to decrease the Earth's population back from 7B, to 1B or whatever the ideal number is... |
You have to be kidding. You're basically calling for a world government working toward genocide.
Are you willing to be slaughtered in order to decrease the Earth's population? |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:33 am Post subject: |
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| Beeyee wrote: |
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Oh and population control, you've got to have a central alliance of governments that starts working together on how to decrease the Earth's population back from 7B, to 1B or whatever the ideal number is... |
You have to be kidding. You're basically calling for a world government working toward genocide.
Are you willing to be slaughtered in order to decrease the Earth's population? |
WTF? Population control is not killing people dummy, it's placing positive/negative incentives on child birth so that over the course of hundreds of years population is managed to some calculated ideal number.
Discussing the environment without discussing population is pointless, hence why I would never show up to these silly hippy meetings. |
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Beeyee
Joined: 29 May 2007
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 2:26 am Post subject: |
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| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Beeyee wrote: |
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Oh and population control, you've got to have a central alliance of governments that starts working together on how to decrease the Earth's population back from 7B, to 1B or whatever the ideal number is... |
You have to be kidding. You're basically calling for a world government working toward genocide.
Are you willing to be slaughtered in order to decrease the Earth's population? |
WTF? Population control is not killing people dummy, it's placing positive/negative incentives on child birth so that over the course of hundreds of years population is managed to some calculated ideal number.
Discussing the environment without discussing population is pointless, hence why I would never show up to these silly hippy meetings. |
Ahh, so 'soft' genocide is okay. Gotcha.
The world as it is now is entirely sustainable. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 2:33 am Post subject: |
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| Beeyee wrote: |
Ahh, so 'soft' genocide is okay. Gotcha.
The world as it is now is entirely sustainable. |
Riiight, because people who aren't ever born are "killed".
And because the population is sustainable, and when it is 12B it will be too, and when it is 24B it will be too... |
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Cave Dweller
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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The number 4 billion has been floating around as the maximum number of people that are sustainable on Earth. Not 7, Not 11, as they're predicting for 2100.
Apparently most of those extra 4 billion people expected to be living are Africans. I know one thing about that. JRs pub will not welcome them.
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Beeyee wrote: |
Ahh, so 'soft' genocide is okay. Gotcha.
The world as it is now is entirely sustainable. |
Riiight, because people who aren't ever born are "killed".
And because the population is sustainable, and when it is 12B it will be too, and when it is 24B it will be too... |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Cave Dweller wrote: |
| The number 4 billion has been floating around as the maximum number of people that are sustainable on Earth. Not 7, Not 11, as they're predicting for 2100. |
I've seen the population forecast models and they are wrong, specifically they do not extend far enough in the future to see the pattern which has repeated for the last 10K years. They assume time will stop in 2050 or 2100, and that technology will not advance. The population problem will never "self manage", at least not in a way that is favorable for humans.
Where did this 4B number come from? Is this a calc of "ideal population", or is this a forecast of what the population will be forced to over time by nature? I'm sincerely interested in the topic and would like to review their reasoning. |
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Cave Dweller
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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The number 4 billion was the maximum number of people that can live on Earth without Earth basically being destroyed, deforested, erosion, desertification, and the such.
As it is, how many people on Earth live without clean water, etc? At least a billion, probably closer to 2 or 3 billion.
| KimchiNinja wrote: |
| Cave Dweller wrote: |
| The number 4 billion has been floating around as the maximum number of people that are sustainable on Earth. Not 7, Not 11, as they're predicting for 2100. |
I've seen the population forecast models and they are wrong, specifically they do not extend far enough in the future to see the pattern which has repeated for the last 10K years. They assume time will stop in 2050 or 2100, and that technology will not advance. The population problem will never "self manage", at least not in a way that is favorable for humans.
Where did this 4B number come from? Is this a calc of "ideal population", or is this a forecast of what the population will be forced to over time by nature? I'm sincerely interested in the topic and would like to review their reasoning. |
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