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Leon
Joined: 31 May 2010
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 Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Well this is somewhat rare. I think I agree with every poster, more or less, on this thread but one. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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Listen to what the warmongering imperialist John Kerry said yesterday:
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| “What we have learned is that Mr Erdogan wouldn’t mind if Kurds were weakened and then annihilated...Erdogan’s “dealings with the ISIS are unacceptable. I could not believe that Turkey harbors an ISIS militant camp in Istanbul...Turkey has also allowed weapons to be transported into Syria through its borders. Also that the ISIS has been able to sell its oil via Turkey is extraordinary.” |
Wait a sec, it was the German deputy speaker that said it.
http://rudaw.net/english/middleeast/12102014 |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| I am actually shocked that a German minister was that harsh about a NATO member. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| aq8knyus wrote: |
Oh come on you were laying it on thick in your last post, wailing about 'muderous wars of aggression'. |
I was being honest.
| aq8knyus wrote: |
| It is very telling that you were not able to make a proper reply to my last post. |
ng terrible things for self-professedly selfish reasons, and that wellspring of patience has reached its end. |
You care so much that you don't care about rescuing them from the twin threats from IS and Assad.
You also failed spectacularly at being civil. In your world is calling someone an armchair warmonger civil? Despite my clarifications to the contrary you nevertheless proceeded to depict my argument as advocating wars to conquer the region.
Although for my part I will apologise, without qualification, for any rudness that I have shown to you personally.
So in the new spirit of respectful dialogue, I would ask you again the following.
How is the war against IS a 'muderous war of aggression'? Do you also not accept that inaction can result in heavy bloodshed? |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Titus wrote: |
A couple journalists get their heads cut off and we have to blow a few billions defeating a 4G enemy in a war that will last 30 years? How silly.
Amusingly enough, one of the journalists who got his head cut off was very declared in his intention to discredit the "Assad Regime" and was going on and on about the inherent moderation of the rebels. (for a very aggressive take on this see: http://www.radixjournal.com/journal/2014/8/22/who-makes-history it is aggressive, don't blame me)
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-08/leon-panetta-says-brace-30-year-war-isis
Maybe, just maybe, this ISIS fiasco is a backdoor for the American regime to work over the Syrian government (destroy infrastructure and the rest) to make the full removal easier, and the path to the eventual HRC-led war against Iran (for women!) cleaner. Maybe USG doesn't really care about a couple headless reporters. |
Assad has been pretty competent in destroying his own infrastructure.
The US doesn't need to manafacture a huge own goal to achieve that end.
You are right though, outside forces in Syria are helping to prolong the misery in order to achieve their regional goals.
Those forces are Putin's Russia and Iran. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| Well this is somewhat rare. I think I agree with every poster, more or less, on this thread but one. |
Congratulations, you are in agreement with Titus and Kimchininja.... |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
You care so much that you don't care about rescuing them from the twin threats from IS and Assad. |
No, I simply see that the philosophy which you exemplify is in the long term far more threatening to them than either of those things. The denizens of the Middle East, in the long term, can prove equal to the challenges presented by the likes of the Islamic State. They will never, on the other hand, prove equal to the challenge of western militaries, held in check only by hedonistic consumers who can be talked into a war over anything, dropping bombs on them. Your philosophy needs to be taken out of the equation before anything can be better here. You don't understand that, and you can't understand that, and that's why I'm not interested in pushing this issue further with you.
This conversation is over. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| aq8knyus wrote: |
You care so much that you don't care about rescuing them from the twin threats from IS and Assad. |
No, I simply see that the philosophy which you exemplify is in the long term far more threatening to them than either of those things. The denizens of the Middle East, in the long term, can prove equal to the challenges presented by the likes of the Islamic State. They will never, on the other hand, prove equal to the challenge of western militaries, held in check only by hedonistic consumers who can be talked into a war over anything, dropping bombs on them. Your philosophy needs to be taken out of the equation before anything can be better here. You don't understand that, and you can't understand that, and that's why I'm not interested in pushing this issue further with you.
This conversation is over. |
We should start calling this Fox’s Law, as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of Fox pompously declaring himself the intellectual superior and refusing to engage further approaches 1.
Fine, run away and keep dodging the questions. |
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Titus
Joined: 19 May 2012
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox would debate you for 40 pages if you were worth debating. If any of us want to know what you believe about any given issue we'll watch CNN. |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
| It is a very important point, how is the war against IS a war of aggression? Also do you still seriously not understand how inaction can lead to horrific consequences? Turning away and pretending that it is not happening would lead to far more casulties and death without any hope of things getting better. |
The same way our inaction towards Saddam Hussein led to so many casualties and so much death? Or was that our action? The next time Western intervention in the Middle East results in positive change will be the first. Save blood and treasure and stay the hell out. |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Titus wrote: |
| Fox would debate you for 40 pages if you were worth debating. If any of us want to know what you believe about any given issue we'll watch CNN. |
Worth debating? From the mouth of a neo-nazi.....
At least I can argue my ideas in the real world as well as online. You on the other hand wouldn't dare say half the stuff you say online in the real world.
edit- I am the only dissenting voice on this thread, without me there is no debate. So what you are really saying is 'wouldn't it be nice if nobody disagreed with me'.
Last edited by aq8knyus on Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:55 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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aq8knyus
Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| The same way our inaction towards Saddam Hussein led to so many casualties and so much death? Or was that our action? The next time Western intervention in the Middle East results in positive change will be the first. Save blood and treasure and stay the hell out. |
I would say that the policy of containment was inaction.
Instead of dealing with the problem policy makers did the very minimum to avoid a genocide that would compel them to act. As you know that policy was every bit as murderous as military intervention, only without any hope of trying to achieve a better outcome.
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| Save blood and treasure and stay the hell out. |
I sense this is what Fox cares about as well. Save the tax dollars and let them go to hell.
The US goes through these periods of 'leaving them to it' and always returns when things go south quickly.
Last edited by aq8knyus on Thu Oct 16, 2014 12:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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GENO123
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 12:20 am Post subject: |
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where is the proof that anyone who is critical of the ISIS engaging in hyperbole or war mongering? Or does that not matter ? What is going on is sort of like what the apologists for Pol Pot did in the 1970s or what Stalin did in the 1950s. Or what apologists for North Korea do today.So if someone calls North Korea an Orwellian state are they fear mongering?So anyone who is an enemy of the US is above being criticized. Say a word against them and you are a fear mongering . way stop any discussion on the merits or the facts.
Of course Isis is very similar to Al Qaeda before 9-11. I wonder those posting now would have called anyone who said anything bad about Osama Bin Laden a "warmonger" or a "fear monger".
Make sure you can take it if you are willing to dish it out Labeling and polemics works both ways. |
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GENO123
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 2:03 am Post subject: |
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| Titus wrote: |
| Fox would debate you for 40 pages if you were worth debating. If any of us want to know what you believe about any given issue we'll watch CNN. |
You mean he has mainstream views. That is an insult to some but a complement to most of us.
But anyway by implying that he basically has mainstream views I think you have adulterated or neutralized all the bad stuff that Fox or Kimchee Ninja was saying about him. |
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KimchiNinja
Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 2:42 am Post subject: |
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| aq8knyus wrote: |
| We should start calling this Fox’s Law, as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of Fox pompously declaring himself the intellectual superior and refusing to engage further approaches... |
You did get intellectually bested though, and there was no real point in following your posts after that. |
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