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To those who are back in the US....
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KimchiNinja wrote:
maitaidads wrote:
KimchiNinja wrote:
Sorry, but what is anyone going to do with a marketing degree/certification?


Work in a marketing department.


Have you ever actually taken your marketing degree and tried doing that?


I actually think it would be more helpful if you were looking to hook up with a startup, hopefully one in a field that you were actually interested in working in. I have to do a ton of marketing in my current position, for both US and overseas markets. Part of this is because my company is run by cheap Koreans who refuse to invest in a real marketing team, but I can say I wish I had something more than common sense and a way with words guiding my actions.
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KimchiNinja



Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam

PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JMO wrote:
KimchiNinja wrote:
maitaidads wrote:
KimchiNinja wrote:
Sorry, but what is anyone going to do with a marketing degree/certification?


Work in a marketing department.


Have you ever actually taken your marketing degree and tried doing that?


You seem to have personal experience. Tell us more.


Yes. I would not recommend it.

Marketing is soft. There's no real point in a degree, since there is nothing to master. The people leading these departments are rich kids / sorority-house types who got the job cause they knew somebody, or because of their demonstrated results in markets (entrepreneur who invented a trendy shoe line that sold big). These people slide into cushy marketing gigs.

Something hard and functional that can land a job and pay back the education costs, seems like a better starting place. But that's just me.
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swashbuckler



Joined: 20 Nov 2010

PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KimchiNinja wrote:
Income inequality is another reason to avoid the US job market. The middle class are slaves to the 1%; with wages held constant, while cost of living increases. If you hit upper middle class you receive some scraps, but middle class gets raped from all sides.


Funny you should mention that, wages in EFL teaching in Korea have also remained stagnant for the last 10-15 years, while cost of living has increased exponentially.
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KimchiNinja



Joined: 01 May 2012
Location: Gangnam

PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

swashbuckler wrote:
KimchiNinja wrote:
Income inequality is another reason to avoid the US job market. The middle class are slaves to the 1%; with wages held constant, while cost of living increases. If you hit upper middle class you receive some scraps, but middle class gets raped from all sides.


Funny you should mention that, wages in EFL teaching in Korea have also remained stagnant for the last 10-15 years, while cost of living has increased exponentially.


Well yeah, I imagine those jobs get simultaneously raped in every orifice.
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mscoop1085



Joined: 12 Feb 2009

PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm 29 and my wife is 27. I had lived in Seoul the past four years and miss certain things about life as an expat. I moved back here to the US about 8 months ago and found a position within two months. I'm doing inside sales and making 40k/yr. gross. It's not the greatest position but entry level and I'm getting experience. Networking is really the key. It's not what you know but who you know. LinkedIn is a great networking site. My friend from University actually got me in with this company. My Korean wife also found work at a Korean company here in Charlotte, NC. She makes about 32k/yr. I made 40-45k/yr. in Korea including privates while my wife made around 24K/yr. We are able to save about 1,000 dollars a month right now. In Korea, we saved around 1.5 a month. I personally wouldn't try for the mega cities like NY or LA unless you have some connections there or family. Get a year or two experience somewhere else and then try NY or LA if you really miss the Seoul like atmosphere of a huge city. You can burn through your savings real quick in those places. Anyways, don't be scared of taking the jump back over if you feel that time has come. Take care and good luck to everyone all across the globe who has gotten to experience life as an expat in Korea.
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jsk



Joined: 31 Oct 2008

PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I left Korea in '10, found a temporary gig that turned into a full-time position, married my Korean girlfriend and paid off my massive law school debt. I make more now than my wife and I made combined in Korea. Sounds like a rosy story but there are often times I wish I was back in Korea. Although the job politics, constant threat of getting fired/laid off, pettiness, and incompetent management seem to be universal truths in this day and age, whether you work in a hagwon or U.S. office, the reason I often think aboht Korea is I remember the fun weekends/holidays I had there, traveling, meeting new people, etc. Where I live now, its mostly swamplands and hillbillies for hundreds of miles around and we spend most weekends and evenings at home. We've talked about making a move near a major metro area but the job feelers I've sent out havent been successful.

I told my wife that if I get laid off or fired, I'd be up for going back to Korea, although I understand the job market there is even worse than when I left.
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mscoop1085 wrote:
I'm 29 and my wife is 27. I had lived in Seoul the past four years and miss certain things about life as an expat. I moved back here to the US about 8 months ago and found a position within two months. I'm doing inside sales and making 40k/yr. gross. It's not the greatest position but entry level and I'm getting experience. Networking is really the key. It's not what you know but who you know. LinkedIn is a great networking site. My friend from University actually got me in with this company. My Korean wife also found work at a Korean company here in Charlotte, NC. She makes about 32k/yr. I made 40-45k/yr. in Korea including privates while my wife made around 24K/yr. We are able to save about 1,000 dollars a month right now. In Korea, we saved around 1.5 a month. I personally wouldn't try for the mega cities like NY or LA unless you have some connections there or family. Get a year or two experience somewhere else and then try NY or LA if you really miss the Seoul like atmosphere of a huge city. You can burn through your savings real quick in those places. Anyways, don't be scared of taking the jump back over if you feel that time has come. Take care and good luck to everyone all across the globe who has gotten to experience life as an expat in Korea.


Even if you do know people in those cities, it's going to be tough if you don't have any skills or experience besides English teaching. I have a lot of connections throughout the Northeast and I'm fortunate enough to have parents who can and will help me out if necessary, but it's only recently that I've really felt I have the experience I need to make it in Boston/NYC/DC.
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bmaw01



Joined: 13 May 2013

PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would tell anyone who wants to teach in Korea to only do it for 1-3 years max. The problem is you're not developing any marketable skills while working in Korea, unless you want to teach. I guess you are building soft skills that employers value. You can say that you worked cooperatively, etc.. Also, having overseas experience can be a plus as well. Still, only spend a few years and get out of there. It's going to be very difficult to return to America if you've spent a long time in Asia. I miss the transportation system, and the low cost of living.

I have returned and I'm currently working as a special needs teacher in New Jersey. My time teaching in Korea was valued and the school that I am currently working at found my time there to be very interesting.
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Yaya



Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jsk wrote:
I left Korea in '10, found a temporary gig that turned into a full-time position, married my Korean girlfriend and paid off my massive law school debt. I make more now than my wife and I made combined in Korea. Sounds like a rosy story but there are often times I wish I was back in Korea. Although the job politics, constant threat of getting fired/laid off, pettiness, and incompetent management seem to be universal truths in this day and age, whether you work in a hagwon or U.S. office, the reason I often think aboht Korea is I remember the fun weekends/holidays I had there, traveling, meeting new people, etc. Where I live now, its mostly swamplands and hillbillies for hundreds of miles around and we spend most weekends and evenings at home. We've talked about making a move near a major metro area but the job feelers I've sent out havent been successful.

I told my wife that if I get laid off or fired, I'd be up for going back to Korea, although I understand the job market there is even worse than when I left.


I have a friend who graduated from law school and lived in Korea for a time. After he returned to America, he missed Korea greatly but with his Korean wife and child and eventual promotion at his job, he says he no longer misses Asia. Of course, he lives near a major metro area and that helps, but just know that transitioning back takes time but that it does eventually happen. You CAN go home again.
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basic69isokay



Joined: 28 Sep 2014
Location: korea

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bmaw01 wrote:
I would tell anyone who wants to teach in Korea to only do it for 1-3 years max. The problem is you're not developing any marketable skills while working in Korea, unless you want to teach. I guess you are building soft skills that employers value. You can say that you worked cooperatively, etc.. Also, having overseas experience can be a plus as well. Still, only spend a few years and get out of there. It's going to be very difficult to return to America if you've spent a long time in Asia. I miss the transportation system, and the low cost of living.

I have returned and I'm currently working as a special needs teacher in New Jersey. My time teaching in Korea was valued and the school that I am currently working at found my time there to be very interesting.

Hmm special needs teacher after a couple years of dealing with Koreans? Seems like a logical step hahah!
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bmaw01



Joined: 13 May 2013

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As other people have stated the success you have when going back to America is going to depend on your skillset. I can't tell you how many people that I've met in South Korea who were communication, history, anthropology, and lit majors. The chance of them finding work in their field is going to be very difficult. On the other hand if you major in a field that's currently in demand you will not have much difficulty in finding work back home. How many people have I met in South Korea that had high a skillset? Zero. Why would they go to Korea when they could be making inroads in their career back home?

The sad fact is most people who are currently teaching in Korea are having a difficult time back home finding work. They are deluding themselves if they think the job market is going to miraculously improve, and employers are going to be begging for people to work for their business. Nope. Things are much different now.
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Adam Carolla



Joined: 26 Feb 2010

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bmaw01 wrote:
As other people have stated the success you have when going back to America is going to depend on your skillset. I can't tell you how many people that I've met in South Korea who were communication, history, anthropology, and lit majors. The chance of them finding work in their field is going to be very difficult. On the other hand if you major in a field that's currently in demand you will not have much difficulty in finding work back home. How many people have I met in South Korea that had high a skillset? Zero. Why would they go to Korea when they could be making inroads in their career back home?

The sad fact is most people who are currently teaching in Korea are having a difficult time back home finding work. They are deluding themselves if they think the job market is going to miraculously improve, and employers are going to be begging for people to work for their business. Nope. Things are much different now.


Very true. I have a degree in English Literature. The worthlessness of that degree is what led me to Korea back in 2002. Surprisingly, it was just as worthless when I returned to the U.S. in 2010.

For two years I worked in the energy industry, which you can't really compare to anything else because there are actually a lot of jobs and not enough bodies to fill them. The pay was pretty amazing, the hours brutal, and the conditions at times were pretty dangerous. It was hell on my marriage as well, because I would at times be away from home for 2 and 3 weeks at a time.

I decided that I didn't want to end up divorced in the not-so-distant future, so I decided I'd get a 9-5 job at a normal business. Age 37, and working at an entry level position and entry level salary. In a job I had no special affinity for. Wonderful.

However, being competent allowed me to be promoted to sales when we had significant turnover when our company was acquired. Doing a decent job in sales (along with some networking) helped me apply for and get a much better job at a much better company.

So now, 4 years later, I'm in a career I enjoy and making a decent living. It really isn't easy. But it's not impossible either.
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PRagic



Joined: 24 Feb 2006

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second much of the advice outlined on the thread so far. By and large, the people I know who have made successful transitions back to the US and Canada have fallen into two categories:

1. Taught short term (1-3 years), paid off their student loans, traveled Korea and got in a big SE Asian trip on the way home. Took jobs in their respective fields (primary education, marketing, corportate communications, IT...) and worked their way up fairly quickly. Some moved back, did their Master's degree or other professional certs, and then entered the workforce.

2. Taught long term while building up their TESOL credentials. These people moved back into management positions in ESL programs at US and Canadian universities. These jobs DO exist. Check out the Chronicle of Higher Education's job portal sometime.

A third, though definitely thinner, category encompasses those who went back and got their Ph.D.s. They're now sticking it out in academe, not an easy slog these days in N. America.
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JMO



Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PRagic wrote:
I second much of the advice outlined on the thread so far. By and large, the people I know who have made successful transitions back to the US and Canada have fallen into two categories:

1. Taught short term (1-3 years), paid off their student loans, traveled Korea and got in a big SE Asian trip on the way home. Took jobs in their respective fields (primary education, marketing, corportate communications, IT...) and worked their way up fairly quickly. Some moved back, did their Master's degree or other professional certs, and then entered the workforce.

2. Taught long term while building up their TESOL credentials. These people moved back into management positions in ESL programs at US and Canadian universities. These jobs DO exist. Check out the Chronicle of Higher Education's job portal sometime.

A third, though definitely thinner, category encompasses those who went back and got their Ph.D.s. They're now sticking it out in academe, not an easy slog these days in N. America.


This makes me somewhat worried in that when I'm back, it will be 10 years here. I came here pretty young (21) so that is one good thing. I will have completed a grad cert in another field, so I'm hoping that helps.
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Lucas



Joined: 11 Sep 2012

PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Hmm special needs teacher after a couple years of dealing with Koreans? Seems like a logical step hahah!


There are lots of people in NJ with special needs too, so velvet glove and all that!
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