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EastisEast
Joined: 29 May 2014
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:51 am Post subject: |
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I dont get their ideology either.
Communist apparatus, police, law and government...yet ridiculously Capitalist to the point of saturating the whole government in Capitalist-style corruption.
The whole cannot hold. Diametrically opposed system and ideology. I wonder how it held for so long ?
Why doesn't a clique BUY/BRIBE the government? Or at least get rid of the old dudes in charge ?? |
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chellovek
Joined: 29 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| EastisEast wrote: |
I dont get their ideology either.
Communist apparatus, police, law and government...yet ridiculously Capitalist to the point of saturating the whole government in Capitalist-style corruption.
The whole cannot hold. Diametrically opposed system and ideology. I wonder how it held for so long ?
Why doesn't a clique BUY/BRIBE the government? Or at least get rid of the old dudes in charge ?? |
Lol are you dense or something?
Authoritarian and corrupt political system with capitalist economy whilst the elite spout some broader idea? Oh man, it can't hold |
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Cave Dweller
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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An adequate description of both China and USA.
| EastisEast wrote: |
I dont get their ideology either.
Communist apparatus, police, law and government...yet ridiculously Capitalist to the point of saturating the whole government in Capitalist-style corruption.
The whole cannot hold. Diametrically opposed system and ideology. I wonder how it held for so long ?
Why doesn't a clique BUY/BRIBE the government? Or at least get rid of the old dudes in charge ?? |
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 12:16 am Post subject: |
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| I don't understand this stuff. Dave's needs to escape the USA to China because it's website might be blocked by the authorities in the US? I should escape to China and avoid the FBI because the FBI is aggressively listening in on about 90 or so individuals they think might be trying to blow up airplanes? I need to flee to China because my rights of free speech are under serious attack and I might face jail time for speaking out? |
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basic69isokay
Joined: 28 Sep 2014
Location: korea
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
Not a US base officially but like all other bases in SK, the Americans will have access. |
This is not true. US Armed Forces in Korea have access to US bases in Korea.
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| Do you not believe that? Jeju people already assume its going to be used by the US. |
What, just like you're assuming something incorrect? Doesn't matter. It's not a US base. |
I guess we'll have to wait and see but if it does go down with China its a foregone conclusion that the US will use Okinawa/Jeju very sstrategically. Let's just say that. Pretty much anywhere in Japan or Korea would be the frontline for the US vs. China.
I doubt the Koreans will say "no its our base" |
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Neil
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 1:24 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Cave Dweller wrote: |
China has the money and the man power. Just not the expertise and they're lagging behind in the technology department, but likely not for long.
USA has a lot more to lose. Thy have a higher standard of living. If Chinese cities look anything like Korean cities, a bombing campaign could be a beautification program.
| Old Painless wrote: |
| Cave Dweller wrote: |
| US has the power but not the finances to fight a long term war. |
And Russia has neither. |
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Part of the reason Korean cities are concrete monstrosities, and not say, wooden houses of yore is because of their unsuitability for a bombing campaign. Japanese houses of wood and paper just went up in flames during WWII. People learned from that.
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And that USS Donald Cook story is bull. |
You're right that post 1950s Korea was built with defense more of a consideration than beauty but it wasn't bombing they feared, it was a land invasion from North Korea that troubled them at the time so narrow streets, tunnels preferred to bridges, high rise apartments out of range of most land based fire.....in general anything to make the land as unappealing to tanks as possible was used. I wouldn't be surprised if Pyeongyang was designed in a similar manner.
Seoul is actually a little unique in that in the event of the cold war going *beep* up for us it would have been destroyed by land. Only really Hong Kong, West Berlin and at a pinch Paris would have suffered the same fate. Everywhere else of importance (NYC, London, Tokyo ect) would have been wiped out by air. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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| basic69isokay wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
Not a US base officially but like all other bases in SK, the Americans will have access. |
This is not true. US Armed Forces in Korea have access to US bases in Korea.
| Quote: |
| Do you not believe that? Jeju people already assume its going to be used by the US. |
What, just like you're assuming something incorrect? Doesn't matter. It's not a US base. |
I guess we'll have to wait and see but if it does go down with China its a foregone conclusion that the US will use Okinawa/Jeju very sstrategically. Let's just say that. Pretty much anywhere in Japan or Korea would be the frontline for the US vs. China.
I doubt the Koreans will say "no its our base" |
So, you're admitting you're just pulling stuff out of your tush. Good to know. |
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rollo
Joined: 10 May 2006
Location: China
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 6:19 am Post subject: |
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Very very complex situation. Japan worries china much more. U.S buildup does not make the Chinese happy but it does make Japanese Russian or Chinese aggression less likly and that please the chinese. the myth that China and the U.S, are embedded in mutual hate for each other falls apart of closer examination. They were allies in WWII. The U.S. open door policy saved China from being devoured by the European powers at the turn of the century. There is certainly some bad blood left from the cold war. But overall the two nations interests are similar: A peaceful Asia, Trade above all. American forces help to stabalize the region
As far as fantasy tales aboutf Russian planes able to throw a switch and disable U.S. ships. That would be an act of war and would have resulted in U.S retaliation. The story is absolutely not true. |
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basic69isokay
Joined: 28 Sep 2014
Location: korea
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 2:30 am Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
Not a US base officially but like all other bases in SK, the Americans will have access. |
This is not true. US Armed Forces in Korea have access to US bases in Korea.
| Quote: |
| Do you not believe that? Jeju people already assume its going to be used by the US. |
What, just like you're assuming something incorrect? Doesn't matter. It's not a US base. |
I guess we'll have to wait and see but if it does go down with China its a foregone conclusion that the US will use Okinawa/Jeju very sstrategically. Let's just say that. Pretty much anywhere in Japan or Korea would be the frontline for the US vs. China.
I doubt the Koreans will say "no its our base" |
So, you're admitting you're just pulling stuff out of your tush. Good to know. |
Uh, no. But you can think so if you like.
Do you really believe the ROK army is independent and self sufficient? Cmon the US presence here has been constant for decades, protecting this house of cards. I'll guarantee that Jeju base ends up being used bythe US. It would be naive to think otherwise. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 6:04 am Post subject: |
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| basic69isokay wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| basic69isokay wrote: |
Not a US base officially but like all other bases in SK, the Americans will have access. |
This is not true. US Armed Forces in Korea have access to US bases in Korea.
| Quote: |
| Do you not believe that? Jeju people already assume its going to be used by the US. |
What, just like you're assuming something incorrect? Doesn't matter. It's not a US base. |
I guess we'll have to wait and see but if it does go down with China its a foregone conclusion that the US will use Okinawa/Jeju very sstrategically. Let's just say that. Pretty much anywhere in Japan or Korea would be the frontline for the US vs. China.
I doubt the Koreans will say "no its our base" |
So, you're admitting you're just pulling stuff out of your tush. Good to know. |
Uh, no. But you can think so if you like.
Do you really believe the ROK army is independent and self sufficient? Cmon the US presence here has been constant for decades, protecting this house of cards. I'll guarantee that Jeju base ends up being used bythe US. It would be naive to think otherwise. |
USFK's most irreplaceable role is military surveillance, Command and Control/Airborne Warning, and midair refueling. The 7th Air Force and 8th Army, primarily the 2nd ID and its combat aviation brigade are nice and can certainly help out, but the bulk of any fighting and dying if there was a full-scale conflict would be born by the ROK Armed Forces.
Yes, in wartime US forces could probably get access to Korean bases since US commanders would have wartime opcon. But that's like saying the US forces had access to British bases during WWII. Yeah, in an emergency you can land your plane or get your unit resupplied if there's some sort of desperate emergency and so forth, but Korean forces would operate out of Korean bases and US forces would operate out of US bases. There's this thing called logistics and supply chains, and having a bunch of M2 Bradleys/Strykers show up at a Korean base is pointless because the ROK doesn't operate the Bradley/Stryker and wouldn't be able to service the vehicles, to say nothing of having a bunch of random people who have never serviced a Bradley in their life suddenly being told to do it in wartime. And we're not even getting into technologically sensitive equipment.
As far as the naval base, again in an emergency maybe or for basic supplies, but anything serious is going to be out of 7th Fleet HQ in Japan. Besides if the war lasts long enough for a US Navy ship to urgently dock at Jeju, that means something has gone seriously wrong.
Sorry, but I think you need to understand a bit more about how much militaries are based on the boring stuff of logistics and supply chains and getting parts to the right places. You don't just send random units off to random bases like they're some oil change shack and expect a 15 minute in and out. |
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:58 am Post subject: |
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| China would win a war with the USA, i.e. The US would have to eventually go away. However the Chinese economy would essentially be destroyed. Russia is far from being an economic giant. If that were so why is the Ruble being devastated by economic sanctions? What there is to fear from Russia is it's engineering and industrial capability. They know how to engineer things that are very threatening and its not Gerry rigging either. |
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