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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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 Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Actually I think the anti-Kpop hate is like going into a local watering hole and wondering why people aren't drinking fine wine. I don't think the "going into a whiskey bar" analogy really works. Also, I don't really give a crap what someone else drinks. I certainly don't think I'm a better person because I drink certain beers or listen to certain music. I certainly wouldn't go over to someone and start mocking them because of what kind of beer they drink. Something is seriously wrong with a person who does that. It's like they have so little in their life that they are reduced to mocking someone over what beer they like |
Yes in an ideal world we would all have that kind of attitude but the fact is most people do judge others to a certain extent on what they like. If you use the analogy of literature or TV programmes, you would form a certain opinion of a person who read nothing but manga comics, for example, or a grown woman who was really into the twilight series. Someone whose favourite programme was the Kardashians. If you claim you wouldn't, I think you'd be in the minority.
Of course everyone's entitled to read/watch what they want but people form opinions none the less. By using the analogy of drinks, you're moving the topic away from the arts to make it seem more ridiculous. Who would judge someone on what they eat/drink etc..? And by using the analogy of literature, I'm moving it in the opposite direction. You will probably argue that pop music is not an art form and is more like a choice of drink, I would argue that for a lot of people, music is more like a choice of book or TV programme. What people like is important, why else would people always mention it in lonely hearts club ads for example? |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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And back to the Cass analogy (which you guys loved apparently), it's not like the guy who ordered Cass is just sitting there drinking it .... no, he's also going around the bar trying to convince everyone how it's an amazing, original beer that deserves attention and trying to get everyone in the bar to sip from his glass, and when they rightly say it's the inferior, cheaper beer... he yells 'snobs! Why all the hate?' What a kook.
He then brings his two friends into the bar (Steels and Noobs) to go around and lecture everyone on the merits of Cass. Everyone drinks some just to shut them up, but end up with awful Cass hangovers. |
First Mix1 was the guy who started the whole alcohol analogy.
And that's only some or actually, few people who like Cass. For every Korean I've met who is a Kpop evangelist, I've met like 10 who don't give a crap what you listen to and 5 who don't listen to Kpop but listen to trot or classical or jazz or rock or oldies or something else. Also, for every person that goes on and on about Kpop, I've met some dumb hipster who goes on and on about their favorite crap sounding obscure band or some metal head who can't understand why everyone isn't listening to Devourment or the Jackofficers.
I wouldn't care much for that guy or the guy who walks into a soju tent and tries to lecture me on why I'm not drinking cognac. I enjoy both. I don't care if someone likes one or the other. What I don't care for is someone looking down on me or my friends because of their taste in alcohol or music and saying so.
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| Yes in an ideal world we would all have that kind of attitude but the fact is most people do judge others to a certain extent on what they like. If you use the analogy of literature or TV programmes, you would form a certain opinion of a person who read nothing but manga comics, for example, or a grown woman who was really into the twilight series. Someone whose favourite programme was the Kardashians. If you claim you wouldn't, I think you'd be in the minority. |
Well, we all have our preferences and what we don't care to be around. I don't care for the coffee shop crowd, but that's for having fun. I don't think I'm a better person because I prefer a bar. I've met wonderful people who do so much for others that have "terrible" taste in music or drinks or TV. I've met crappy people who have great taste.
Thinking people are good or not based on their taste in beer or TV or music is so...high school. There's about as much to that as Koreans judging you based on your fashion choices or some Korean judging you because you don't like flaming red hot deokbeokki or some overwhelming seafood taste and instead prefer a milder version or less pungent seafood.
Again, high school. High school. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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Thinking people are good or not based on their taste in beer or TV or music is so...high school. There's about as much to that as Koreans judging you based on your fashion choices or some Korean judging you because you don't like flaming red hot deokbeokki or some overwhelming seafood taste and instead prefer a milder version or less pungent seafood.
Again, high school. High school. |
Not talking to someone or mocking them because of what they like is high school but forming an opinion about someone based on what they like is something that never really leaves us. Not saying that what people like is the most important part of how we form freindships but it definitely plays a part. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 1:15 am Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
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Thinking people are good or not based on their taste in beer or TV or music is so...high school. There's about as much to that as Koreans judging you based on your fashion choices or some Korean judging you because you don't like flaming red hot deokbeokki or some overwhelming seafood taste and instead prefer a milder version or less pungent seafood.
Again, high school. High school. |
Not talking to someone or mocking them because of what they like is high school but forming an opinion about someone based on what they like is something that never really leaves us. Not saying that what people like is the most important part of how we form freindships but it definitely plays a part. |
Well in terms of forming friendships, I'd agree. In terms of berating people or looking down on someone because of their taste in beer, music, or TV, that's just ridiculous. I just can't fathom the idea of "you drink X or listen to Y" followed by a snort of derision.
Quality of people is found through patience, trust, honestly, loyalty, gentleness, kindness, self-control, honor, duty, responsibility and the like. Not listening to band X, watching show Y, and drinking beer Z.
And there's also humility and being judgmental to consider. |
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jazzmaster
Joined: 30 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 2:08 am Post subject: |
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, generally music is seen as something that brings people together, not something you use to separate and identify yourself with (though of course there are some subcultures here where people do do that). Why is this? What is one of the most dominant social activities that Koreans do? Noraebang. Duh. It's meant to bring people together. That means you need music of, frankly, a low common denominator. That's fine. Drunken standards are fun with music from back home as well. |
What a load of dung.
To suggest that to bring people together music must be a "low common denominator" is garbage. Some of the most popular music in the world has been revolutionary and forward thinking.
Your post sums you up perfectly. Your way of thinking is the very definition of retarded (to delay or hold back in terms of progress, development, or accomplishment). |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:35 am Post subject: |
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| jazzmaster wrote: |
What a load of dung.
To suggest that to bring people together music must be a "low common denominator" is garbage. Some of the most popular music in the world has been revolutionary and forward thinking.
Your post sums you up perfectly. Your way of thinking is the very definition of retarded (to delay or hold back in terms of progress, development, or accomplishment). |
Well yes, some oldies after years of airplay and people moving on from Vietnam, have become mainstream. But if you're talking about a mixed bag of coworkers with noraebang as a team exercise, then they are going to go with hits everyone knows. People aren't going to bust out Crying Nut or Jaurim because they want everyone to sing along and have a good time. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, generally music is seen as something that brings people together, not something you use to separate and identify yourself with (though of course there are some subcultures here where people do do that). Why is this? What is one of the most dominant social activities that Koreans do? Noraebang. Duh. It's meant to bring people together. That means you need music of, frankly, a low common denominator. That's fine. Drunken standards are fun with music from back home as well.
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My experience of noraebangs is people sitting around not really paying attention or trying to shut out the noise the singer's making while they wait slightly impatiently for the chance to sing their chosen song. Mind you, I've never been with a bunch of Koreans, in which case I'm sure they all join together in a heart warming celebration of kinship and their national 'music'. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
My experience of noraebangs is people sitting around not really paying attention or trying to shut out the noise the singer's making while they wait slightly impatiently for the chance to sing their chosen song. Mind you, I've never been with a bunch of Koreans, in which case I'm sure they all join together in a heart warming celebration of kinship and their national 'music'. |
No, they just sing songs that everyone knows and likes and all sing together and have fun. No Korean flag gets busted out and people don't begin with 50 different songs about the greatness of Korea.
If that's really what you think Korean people do when they all go out to noraebang, I think you need to reevaluate the premises you bases these assumptions upon and perhaps consider that your interpretation of Koreans and why they do the things they do is off. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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If that's really what you think Korean people do when they all go out to noraebang, I think you need to reevaluate the premises you bases these assumptions upon and perhaps consider that your interpretation of Koreans and why they do the things they do is off. |
You obviously didn't recognise my tongue in cheek tone. I imagine Noraebangs work better for Koreans because they've produced so little quality music over the years, they're bound to all know the words to the same few songs everyone wants to sing. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
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If that's really what you think Korean people do when they all go out to noraebang, I think you need to reevaluate the premises you bases these assumptions upon and perhaps consider that your interpretation of Koreans and why they do the things they do is off. |
You obviously didn't recognise my tongue in cheek tone. I imagine Noraebangs work better for Koreans because they've produced so little quality music over the years, they're bound to all know the words to the same few songs everyone wants to sing. |
Well, when they go out, depending on the group they are in, they will stick to songs everyone knows. If its older coworkers, a lot of trot songs. Younger? Kpop or some non-Korean pop. Get 4 fans of rock together and you'll get some Rollercoaster or Peter Pan Complex.
People listen to, and enjoy music for different reasons. I'm just saying that a dominant feature of the Korean music experience is the noraebang and everyone singing together and this plays some part in the reason Koreans prefer "generic" music. It has to appeal to many people.
Quality music is in the ear of the beholder. May I ask what your objective criteria are for quality music? Or is this a subjective opinion? |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Quality music is in the ear of the beholder |
Do you feel the same about all art forms? Or do you see pop music as not being an art form? If the latter is your opinion there's very little point in furthering the discussion. |
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