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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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 Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| geldedgoat wrote: |
| Plain Meaning wrote: |
| an African-American woman |
I'm sure the police were able to determine this just from looking at her vehicle and profiled her just for gits and shiggles. Lemme guess: it was Escalade with spinners and a Hope'n'Change bumper sticker, maybe with a gold bra, purple lipstick, and an empty bucket of KFC in the passenger seat? |
Dafuq? |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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You can't have your entire posting history in this thread and pretend that your intentionally highlighting this passage with an irrelevant mention of the woman's race was innocent. Police across the country routinely overstep the bounds of what should be their responsibilities and harass people of all races. By playing into this stupid charade of white-cops-hating-on-the-blacks, you polarize an audience that would otherwise likely be united against real injustices. If you're going to continue ripping the police for their abuses - and please, I hope you do - then stop being a disingenuous asshole about it.
A counterfactual I know, but if all that outrage hadn't been wasted, WASTED, on Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown, what might have happened in response to Eric Garner? ...assuming of course that your idiotic narrative didn't get pushed in every headline. |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| geldedgoat wrote: |
By playing into this stupid charade of white-cops-hating-on-the-blacks, you polarize an audience that would otherwise likely be united against real injustices. If you're going to continue ripping the police for their abuses - and please, I hope you do - then stop being a disingenuous asshole about it.
A counterfactual I know, but if all that outrage hadn't been wasted, WASTED, on Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown, what might have happened in response to Eric Garner? ...assuming of course that your idiotic narrative didn't get pushed in every headline. |
A couple of things:
You can be outraged by the police oppression towards everyone, and still acknowledge that blacks have it worse. Its both true that the police are too oppressive and they are especially oppressive towards blacks.
This thread was created before Michael Brown hit the news. The Ferguson protests were not simply about Michael Brown, that was simply the spark which lit the dry tinderbox. You can see that from the Department of Justice report, which states that the Ferguson protests arose because most of the protesters had themselves felt the heavy hand of the police. Focusing on Michael Brown is a choice you and others have made, and there is a reason this thread's title does not have the name Michael Brown in it.
The passage I quoted was not meant to highlight that the woman was African-American, but simply that she was poor, and she was being slowly harassed by the justice system. That said, yes, she is black. Almost two-thirds of Ferguson is black. |
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W.T.Carl
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:03 am Post subject: |
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| If Ferguson is two thirds Black, it stands to reason that you would have a higher ratio of police contacts. Is this racism? No. Where I live it is about 85% white. 98% of the police contacts are with WHITE people. Some of the cop are pricks. Most are not. Peddle your race theories elsewhere. It is getting old. |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:16 am Post subject: |
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| W.T.Carl wrote: |
| If Ferguson is two thirds Black, it stands to reason that you would have a higher ratio of police contacts. Is this racism? No. Where I live it is about 85% white. 98% of the police contacts are with WHITE people. Some of the cop are pricks. Most are not. Peddle your race theories elsewhere. It is getting old. |
The ignorance is tiresome and old.
From page 4 of the Department of Justice report:
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| Ferguson's law enforcement practices overwhelmingly impact African Americans. Data collected by the Ferguson Police Department from 2012 to 2014 shows that African Americans account for 85% of vehicle stops, 90% of citations, and 93% of arrests made by FPD officers, despite comprising only 67% of Ferguson's population. |
The Ferguson protesters were:
(1) justified in their protests; and
(2) were protesting general police discrimination and brutality and not simply the killing of Michael Brown. |
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W.T.Carl
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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| And we are supposed to believe a report issued by Holder, Perez and Sharpton? |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 9:49 am Post subject: |
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Ferguson Judge behind aggressive fines owes $170,000.00 in taxes
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The judge in Ferguson, Missouri, who is accused of fixing traffic tickets for himself and colleagues while inflicting a punishing regime of fines and fees on the city’s residents, also owes more than $170,000 in unpaid taxes.
Ronald J Brockmeyer, whose court allegedly jailed impoverished defendants unable to pay fines of a few hundred dollars, has a string of outstanding debts to the US government dating back to 2007, according to tax filings obtained by the Guardian from authorities in Missouri.
Brockmeyer, 70, was this week singled out by Department of Justice investigators as being a driving force behind Ferguson’s strategy of using its municipal court to aggressively generate revenues. The policy has been blamed for a breakdown in relations between the city’s overwhelmingly white authorities and residents, two-thirds of whom are African American.
Investigators found Brockmeyer had boasted of creating a range of new court fees, “many of which are widely considered abusive and may be unlawful”. A city councilman opposing the judge’s reappointment was warned “switching judges would/could lead to loss of revenue”.
Brockmeyer, who has been Ferguson’s municipal court judge for 12 years, serves simultaneously as a prosecutor in two nearby cities and as a private attorney. Legal experts said his potentially conflicting interests illustrate a serious problem in the region’s judicial system. Brockmeyer, who reportedly earns $600 per shift as a prosecutor, said last year his dual role benefited defendants. “I see both sides of it,” he said. “I think it’s even better.” |
It is a three-tiered justice system; one for the rich, another for the poor white or affluent black, and the last for the poor black. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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| W.T.Carl wrote: |
| And we are supposed to believe a report issued by Holder, Perez and Sharpton? |
Well, you certainly should not reflexively disbelieve it on such grounds. When a report like this cites actual records or verifiable facts, you can still assess those records or facts for yourself even if you mistrust any editorialization which might accompany them. The tendency of the police to act as revenue-extractors, for example, is a troubling one, and it is not limited to Ferguson. Likewise, contrary to the narrative being pushed -- the narrative against which it sounds like you're recoiling -- police misconduct and brutality are not "Black" problems, they directly affect citizens of all races. Framing this in terms of race instead of in terms of basic justice is just about the stupidest thing the people involved could have done if they want an actual long-term solution, but don't let their foolishness blind you to the fact that basic justice is at stake with regards to concerns about police and court conduct. |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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Fox,
You go ahead and be friendly and agreeable to the guy who just said Al Sharpton had anything to do with the Department of Justice report even as you call my decision to continue this thread stupid.
I don't know why it hurts all your feelings so dearly to be confronted with the obvious; that America is a deeply racist country and some marches and speeches featurting Martin Luther King didn't make the legacy of chattel slavery and then separate but not equal all okay. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Plain Meaning wrote: |
| I don't know why it hurts all your feelings so dearly ... |
You aren't wrong, it actually does hurt my feelings to some extent to see intelligent people in my homeland squabbling over petty identity politics instead of coming together and crafting a solution to a problem which affects the entire nation. Turning national problems into identity-politics problems is a recipe for failure. If the police are using excessive force, or issuing excessive citations; or if the courts are over-sentencing some people, or letting some people off too easily; or if police conduct is not being properly monitored by accountabilty-enforcing agencies, these are all things behind which the public can and should rally. But turn it all into an absurd "check your privilege" style rant focused on racial identity, or frame it as a "Black vs White" issue, and you'll be engineering needless pushback, which will obstruct solutions, which will cause more needless suffering. Of course that bothers me; of course that hurts my feelings.
I don't care whether W.T. Carl thinks Al Sharpton had something to do with this report or not. The important thing is that police corruption, brutality, and excess, all things which demonstrably exist based upon verifiable records and facts, not be seen treated as partisan matters.
Last edited by Fox on Sun Mar 08, 2015 7:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| I really, truly don't see it as being partisan. I've probably used the word privilege once or twice in this thread, but this isn't about bashing whites for having it good or relatively better, so much as rectifying a continuing institutional wrong. Correcting that wrong will help everyone. |
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| sirius black wrote: |
| http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-robinson/the-shocking-finding-from-the-doj-ferguson_b_6858388.html |
From the article:
| Quote: |
In Ferguson -- a city with a population of 21,000 -- 16,000 people have outstanding arrest warrants, meaning that they are currently actively wanted by the police. In other words, if you were to take four people at random, the Ferguson police would consider three of them fugitives.
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In 2013, 32,975 offenses had associated warrants, so that there were 1.5 offenses for every city resident.
That means that the city of Ferguson quite literally has more crimes than people.
To give some context as to how truly extreme this is, a comparison may be useful. In 2014, the Boston Municipal Court System, for a city of 645,000 people, issued about 2,300 criminal warrants. The Ferguson Municipal Court issued 9,000, for a population 1/30th the size of Boston's. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Plain Meaning wrote: |
| sirius black wrote: |
| http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-robinson/the-shocking-finding-from-the-doj-ferguson_b_6858388.html |
From the article:
| Quote: |
In Ferguson -- a city with a population of 21,000 -- 16,000 people have outstanding arrest warrants, meaning that they are currently actively wanted by the police. In other words, if you were to take four people at random, the Ferguson police would consider three of them fugitives.
...
In 2013, 32,975 offenses had associated warrants, so that there were 1.5 offenses for every city resident.
That means that the city of Ferguson quite literally has more crimes than people.
To give some context as to how truly extreme this is, a comparison may be useful. In 2014, the Boston Municipal Court System, for a city of 645,000 people, issued about 2,300 criminal warrants. The Ferguson Municipal Court issued 9,000, for a population 1/30th the size of Boston's. |
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I don't think I'd choose Boston as a comparison. Why did the writer choose Boston and not another city? It would be better to compare Ferguson to the city of St. Louis. I bet the stats would still make Ferguson look extreme. |
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