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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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 Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
Of course it didn't negatively affect you, not back when it didn't apply to you because you're Korean-American. But for those of us not born into "the cleanest race," the way that requirement was implemented certainly was racist as hell. |
An international child predator was found to have been teaching students and was able to do so despite having a record? Sorry, but CBCs following such a story isn't racism, its common sense. The complete and utter lack of any screening meant that sooner or later something was going to happen. To make an analogy, that's like saying new airline regulations that bar you from strolling on a plane with box cutters and unidentified liquids are "racist" because this was in response to anti-Islamic terrorism fears. It wasn't racist, it was a response to the fact that there was so little screening that it was only a matter of time before it got exploited and something catastrophic enough happened that it forced a policy shift. It also has to do with liability and not getting sued. Was it racist when there were no regulations? Were Koreans racists then?
There is a common misconception that Korean-Americans are somehow not affected by the CBCs and what not. THIS IS 100% FALSE. Korean-Americans on E-2 visas, of which there are plenty, still have to go through the same process as everyone else. Also, F-4s who work for public schools have to go through the same process.
Now, for private institutes F-4s MIGHT not have to go through all of that. It is up to the owner. However, it should be noted that other F-series visas can also be exempt, and there are F-series visas where people are NOT of Korean background.
Anyways, I love how people get up in arms over me "not being like other foreigners and understanding it", but apparently they understand exactly what my experience is like. I cannot comment on their experience here, but apparently they are allowed to comment on my experience here and also to tell us how things are for minorities back home. This doesn't seem consistent to me.
Question- If the government/institutes had failed to institute any CBCs or Drug Tests, could they have been held financially liable if they failed to screen for such things?
Common sense should dictate that covering one's own ass and not getting sued is as much, if not more of a motivating factor than "racism". Also, if Koreans really did think of you as a drug-addled pervert, they would NOT be sending their kids to be around you. They just want to make sure no bad apples get in.
| Jazzmaster wrote: |
| You really are clutching at straws nowadays. |
Dude, even atwood is saying your point is a bit of a stretch, if I am to understand him correctly. No one is denying nationalism and xenophobia, but to suggest that this is an example of deep rooted racism is a bit of a stretch. This guy's target is an ambassador, not some foreigner club in Itaewon. I think politics is more at play than race.
Anyways, most people don't have much of a perception of SOUTH Korea and people don't care much about it. The story is already moving to the middle pages. Harrison Ford is a bigger story now than this.
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| SR - quick question. Are you on an F visa? |
Yes, and? I believe several other posters, some of whom are not of Korean descent, are on F-visas? In fact, there was an attempt at an organization called AFEK as I recall. |
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andrewchon
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Location: Back in Oz. Living in ISIS Aust.
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Smithington wrote: |
Yikes. I had no idea the cut was that serious. Then again, noone did as the initial photos made the cut look rather minor. Clearly though I underestimated the extent of his injury.
On another matter, why was the attacker not shot by the ambassador's body guard? Was there no security present at all? Something's not right. |
1. Number of stitches can be mis-leading. More important the person (or animal for that matter) more stitches with finer silk. Latest report was 5cm gash on cheek and 2cm stab wound on wrist. Do the math: that's about one stitch per milimetre. Do you think it was possible to fit more in?
2. If you look at the video, there was a scrum wrestling the assailant down in less than a blink. You remind me of a Bill Maher comment: "We're Americans. We shoot first and ask questions rarely."  Security level is ambassador's call. |
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Neil
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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| An international child predator was found to have been teaching students and was able to do so despite having a record? |
Dont really care about CBCs (though you'd think the market would have demanded them sooner) but Chris Neill the nonce had a clean record until some computer geeks unswirled his face and made him famous. Had CBCs been about in 2005 or when ever he entered Korea he'd have still recieved an E2 no problems. |
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
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| So do you consider the US forces here to be occupiers? |
What does that mean? Also, asking me questions what I think is not going to solve anything. |
It was a straight forward question. Part of what we sometimes call a discussion.
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| If you want violence to stop, stop being violent. |
So was the ambassador at fault?
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| America has escalated war, fear, and violence in the world through its "technological advances". |
OK. But we are talking about South Korea and this specific incident. |
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EZE
Joined: 05 May 2012
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| to tell us how things are for minorities back home. |
But you often play that card even to people who are minorities back home. You don't have some unique knowledge about being a minority back home that other minorities back home don't possess. CentralCali is correct and atwood's point is also valid.
All of your opinions regarding Koreans vis-a-vis others are always a one way street, whether it's about official policies, private businesses discriminating, or political opinions. Korea doesn't owe any thanks to our generation of Americans (and I agree, by the way), but the current generation of Japanese owes Korea another apology. That's a one way street. Complaining about racism back home and then being an apologist for racially discriminatory policies when they benefit ethnic Koreans is a one way street. |
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Brooks
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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Security level is for the Korean government to decide.
Obviously it needs to be improved. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
Of course it didn't negatively affect you, not back when it didn't apply to you because you're Korean-American. But for those of us not born into "the cleanest race," the way that requirement was implemented certainly was racist as hell. |
An international child predator was found to have been teaching students and was able to do so despite having a record? Sorry, but CBCs following such a story isn't racism, its common sense. |
You play the fool rather well; one might even put it as professionally. Nowhere did I say that CBCs were not a good idea. I said--and I did so quite clearly--that the way the requirement was implemented was incredibly racist. And it was because there were exemptions from that requirement, said exemptions based solely on the applicant's race or the applicant's family member's race.
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| There is a common misconception that Korean-Americans are somehow not affected by the CBCs and what not. THIS IS 100% FALSE. Korean-Americans on E-2 visas, of which there are plenty, still have to go through the same process as everyone else. Also, F-4s who work for public schools have to go through the same process. |
Now. What you describe is not the case when the requirement was first implemented. |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/attack-u-s-ambassador-lippert-how-did-assailant-get-so-n317976
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| "Is it a lapse in security when someone, anyone, can get so close to a U.S. ambassador as to wound him?" Lebaron asked. Some, he said, would argue no. |
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| The security services' success could be measured on the ability to intervene quickly in case of an attack — but not necessarily prevent one. |
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| "All ambassadors have to get out and do their jobs," former U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine William B. Taylor said. "If the diplomatic security or South Korean security forces were surrounding the ambassador it would be hard for him to do his job." |
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jazzmaster
Joined: 30 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Jazzmaster wrote: |
| You really are clutching at straws nowadays. |
Dude, even atwood is saying your point is a bit of a stretch, if I am to understand him correctly. No one is denying nationalism and xenophobia, but to suggest that this is an example of deep rooted racism is a bit of a stretch. This guy's target is an ambassador, not some foreigner club in Itaewon. I think politics is more at play than race.
Anyways, most people don't have much of a perception of SOUTH Korea and people don't care much about it. The story is already moving to the middle pages. Harrison Ford is a bigger story now than this.
| Quote: |
| SR - quick question. Are you on an F visa? |
Yes, and? I believe several other posters, some of whom are not of Korean descent, are on F-visas? In fact, there was an attempt at an organization called AFEK as I recall. |
Resorting to selectively taking parts of my posts is low, even for you SR. I wrote "I haven't quantified how much I think people care about Korea, therefore your comment "Get a clue. No one cares as much as you think they do" is clearly deluded.
You really are clutching at straws nowadays. You've been unraveling on other threads with your racist comments. It's pathetic."
So here's a question for you: If I haven't told you how strongly I think people care about Korea, how can you possibly have the necessary knowledge to make the comment "No one cares as much as you think they do"?
The other points I have dealt with. I feel that people with racist, xenophobic, and bigoted are drawn to the type of ideology that North Korea propagates. To suggest that because an action performed under a "political" motive, doesn't disprove that the person has racist tendencies. I particularly think a person who never experienced the Korean war or Japanese occupation would possibly have feelings regarding foreigners that run deeper than political beliefs.
My other point raised the fact that you seem to think using Kakaotalk seems to eradicate people's racist beliefs. It's fairly plain to see that isn't the case and that your post was poorly thought through nonsense.
In regards to your visa you answered "Yes, and? I believe several other posters, some of whom are not of Korean descent, are on F-visas? In fact, there was an attempt at an organization called AFEK as I recall."
I actually have some friends who got an F visa by jumping through the hoops of becoming a Korean citizen. I was incredibly impressed. Their Korean was brilliant due to studying for the TOPIK test. I also have some friends who have the F visa due to marriage. In the future I may find myself on an F marriage visa.
Which visa did you get SR? Do you speak Korean? I'm actually trying to learn it myself, but it's proving rather difficult. |
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radish kimchi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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| catman wrote: |
| It was a straight forward question. Part of what we sometimes call a discussion. |
I asked what do you mean, not what is it. What do you mean by occupier? Do you have a perceived negative view of "occupier"? What do you mean by it?
I don't. We can all occupy land. I occupy land, I don't have a military base in my closet or near a capital city. So, what do you mean?
Instead of asking vague questions, provide something to discuss.
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| So was the ambassador at fault? |
I don't know him personally. I read up and found out he was nominated based on his activity in the Middle East. So, I am assuming he is a "floater". I won't make you figure it out. What I mean is that he seems like he is willing to go wherever. He was trained that way, and perhaps he shouldn't have taken this job in Korea.
If he has a genuine interest in Korea and showed it to this Korean guy then it is less likely he would have been attacked.
I am not saying he is at fault for not showing his appreciation for the country he is currently residing in, but to understand him more he needs to communicate to us what he is there for.
Does he want to bring America and 1 Korea together or does he want to continue pushing a wedge between the North and South?
Your question of fault depends on him. He may not be at fault, but I am not surprised it happened. It might happen again if America continues military presence in a region not welcoming of those people.
| Quote: |
| OK. But we are talking about South Korea and this specific incident. |
No we aren't. We are talking about the ramifications of keeping a military presence.
It doesn't matter if the act is wrong or right. There is cause and effect. This guy didn't attack a Chinese ambassador. Why is it American embassies get closed down, bombed, and attacked causing people to evacuate but other countries don't face the same problem to the same degree?
This psychological trip you are on by asking me questions doesn't address the issue. Don't ask me about my opinion. Ask me more how to stop the problem.
I am not here to be conditioned to support American atrocities. |
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jcd
Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
| catman wrote: |
| It was a straight forward question. Part of what we sometimes call a discussion. |
I asked what do you mean, not what is it. What do you mean by occupier? Do you have a perceived negative view of "occupier"? What do you mean by it?
I don't. We can all occupy land. I occupy land, I don't have a military base in my closet or near a capital city. So, what do you mean?
Instead of asking vague questions, provide something to discuss.
| Quote: |
| So was the ambassador at fault? |
I don't know him personally. I read up and found out he was nominated based on his activity in the Middle East. So, I am assuming he is a "floater". I won't make you figure it out. What I mean is that he seems like he is willing to go wherever. He was trained that way, and perhaps he shouldn't have taken this job in Korea.
If he has a genuine interest in Korea and showed it to this Korean guy then it is less likely he would have been attacked.
I am not saying he is at fault for not showing his appreciation for the country he is currently residing in, but to understand him more he needs to communicate to us what he is there for.
Does he want to bring America and 1 Korea together or does he want to continue pushing a wedge between the North and South?
Your question of fault depends on him. He may not be at fault, but I am not surprised it happened. It might happen again if America continues military presence in a region not welcoming of those people.
| Quote: |
| OK. But we are talking about South Korea and this specific incident. |
No we aren't. We are talking about the ramifications of keeping a military presence.
It doesn't matter if the act is wrong or right. There is cause and effect. This guy didn't attack a Chinese ambassador. Why is it American embassies get closed down, bombed, and attacked causing people to evacuate but other countries don't face the same problem to the same degree?
This psychological trip you are on by asking me questions doesn't address the issue. Don't ask me about my opinion. Ask me more how to stop the problem.
I am not here to be conditioned to support American atrocities. |
haha " What do you mean bastard? I was simply saying you have no father. I can be a bastard like if my father passed away. Do you have a perceived negative view of bastard. "
Did I miss something on this news story? Did the ambassador do something to this guy?
Isn't it because the countries they are in a messed up?
How do we stop it? That should be interesting.
I think you mean logical not psychological.
Also you should know what embassies are for. |
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jcd
Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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| radish kimchi wrote: |
| catman wrote: |
| It was a straight forward question. Part of what we sometimes call a discussion. |
I asked what do you mean, not what is it. What do you mean by occupier? Do you have a perceived negative view of "occupier"? What do you mean by it?
I don't. We can all occupy land. I occupy land, I don't have a military base in my closet or near a capital city. So, what do you mean?
Instead of asking vague questions, provide something to discuss.
| Quote: |
| So was the ambassador at fault? |
I don't know him personally. I read up and found out he was nominated based on his activity in the Middle East. So, I am assuming he is a "floater". I won't make you figure it out. What I mean is that he seems like he is willing to go wherever. He was trained that way, and perhaps he shouldn't have taken this job in Korea.
If he has a genuine interest in Korea and showed it to this Korean guy then it is less likely he would have been attacked.
I am not saying he is at fault for not showing his appreciation for the country he is currently residing in, but to understand him more he needs to communicate to us what he is there for.
Does he want to bring America and 1 Korea together or does he want to continue pushing a wedge between the North and South?
Your question of fault depends on him. He may not be at fault, but I am not surprised it happened. It might happen again if America continues military presence in a region not welcoming of those people.
| Quote: |
| OK. But we are talking about South Korea and this specific incident. |
No we aren't. We are talking about the ramifications of keeping a military presence.
It doesn't matter if the act is wrong or right. There is cause and effect. This guy didn't attack a Chinese ambassador. Why is it American embassies get closed down, bombed, and attacked causing people to evacuate but other countries don't face the same problem to the same degree?
This psychological trip you are on by asking me questions doesn't address the issue. Don't ask me about my opinion. Ask me more how to stop the problem.
I am not here to be conditioned to support American atrocities. |
I know the effect of the holocaust, but I am unfamiliar with the cause. Please explain. |
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jcd
Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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Why did the parade him around in a green jump suit like hannibal Lector. Of course those were orange but still.
And why didn't he give the shakra sign to the camera with his tongue out, displaying the gash. |
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radish kimchi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
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| Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I was simply saying you have no father. |
And this relates to tea in China, how? How was I born without a father?
NEXT....
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| Did the ambassador do something to this guy? |
If you are going to represent the most dangerous mob on the planet and you don't want to be attacked, then you should not take up a position titled, "Ambassador to the USA".
Next....
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| How do we stop it? That should be interesting. |
Pack up your toys and leave Korea. Don't do military exercises. Kinda simple.
Next....
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| Also you should know what embassies are for. |
What do you mean "are for"?
There are embassies for uniting countries, and there are embassies used to divide countries.
Next....
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| I know the effect of the holocaust, but I am unfamiliar with the cause. Please explain. |
Intolerance would be a big one. America is doing a holocaust on Native American Indians, Palestinians, Koreans, Hawaiians (who don't want to be a part of the 50 states), etc....
Pack up your military gear and allow other countries to exist without US influence. |
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T-J
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Seoul EunpyungGu Yeonsinnae
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| Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:07 am Post subject: |
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Some people need to get a clue.
The U.S. military is only here as long as the R.O.K. wants it here. Military installations are leased. They are only present as the result of mutual agreement.
If the R.O.K. decides to ask the U.S. military to withdraw all they have to do is ask.
Doubt that?
Look to the Philippines.
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