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joelove
Joined: 12 May 2011
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W.T.Carl
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 5:49 am Post subject: |
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| 40 years of Democratic politics. The city has a black mayor, majority black city council ( 9 to 6 ), and black chief of police and a majority black police force. Two former mayors went on to run the state, which has had only two ( including the current one ) Republican governors in the past four decades. For a better view of the situation, you should watch a HBO series called THE WIRE. It's fictional, but........................ |
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Rteacher
Joined: 23 May 2005
Location: Western MA, USA
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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I don't see anything unusual about Baltimore. Its not just this one case of the guy who had his spine broken, its a laundry list of neglect local, state and federal in communities like these. Cities don't have the say they once had over education (no child left behind is federal) as well as other instutions. And often, as in Baltimore, its sometimes poor leadership.
In fact, I think the Baltimore folks are pretty calm in context. If there was a pattern of police abuse on white teens and 20 somethings, what do you think would happen on the next incident that was the last straw?
Way, way more than what SOME of the blacks in Baltimore are doing. We bring high powered rifles to shoot feds over taxes, not even lives (Cliven Bundy ranch) we blow up buildings (Oklahmoa), if we feel slighted over something we have mass shootings (Columbine, Sandy Hook), look at the Hunting Beach, Ohio State and Unvi. of Kentucky riots and those didn't even have a reason or it was over a lost basketball game.
imagine if it was systemic police brutality? No, the Baltimore people are pretty calm considering. |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| sirius black wrote: |
| I don't see anything unusual about Baltimore. Its not just this one case of the guy who had his spine broken, its a laundry list of neglect local, state and federal in communities like these. Cities don't have the say they once had over education (no child left behind is federal) as well as other instutions. And often, as in Baltimore, its sometimes poor leadership. |
You're right, Baltimore is not unusual, but state and local actors are certainly to blame at least as much as Federal neglect.
For example, Obama's own Chicago and its black site.
Chicago's detainees speak
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A friend of Wright’s swept up in the same police raid described his own brutal treatment at the facility, known as Homan Square, including attacks to his face and genitals. The experiences of the two men line up with the way defense attorneys described the “black site” warehouse to Ackerman: as a place where detainees were held off the books, without access to lawyers, while being beaten or shackled for long periods of time.
Wright claims that nine years ago, he spent “at least six [brutal] hours” at the Homan facility on his 21st birthday. He says that he was never read his Miranda rights, and that his arrest was not put into the police system until after his ordeal was over. Wright was reminded of the facility again this week when he noticed a tweet from a writer he admires, The Atlantic’s Ta-Nehisi Coates, linking to Ackerman’s story. Ackerman compared Homan Square to the network of shadowy torture centers built by the CIA across the Middle East — but focused “on Americans, most often poor, black and brown,” rather than on purported overseas terrorists.
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Siska has known about the goings-on at Homan “since about the mid- to late-2000s.” Siska also said that most of those detained at Homan are poor, black and brown people suspected of street crimes. When I asked why reporters haven’t covered the abuses allegedly occurring there, Siska replied with a slight chuckle, “That’s the million dollar question. The problem is a lot of reporters agree with the police perspective.” |
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Kepler
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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| sirius black wrote: |
I don't see anything unusual about Baltimore. Its not just this one case of the guy who had his spine broken, its a laundry list of neglect local, state and federal in communities like these. Cities don't have the say they once had over education (no child left behind is federal) as well as other instutions. And often, as in Baltimore, its sometimes poor leadership.
In fact, I think the Baltimore folks are pretty calm in context. If there was a pattern of police abuse on white teens and 20 somethings, what do you think would happen on the next incident that was the last straw?
Way, way more than what SOME of the blacks in Baltimore are doing. We bring high powered rifles to shoot feds over taxes, not even lives (Cliven Bundy ranch) we blow up buildings (Oklahmoa), if we feel slighted over something we have mass shootings (Columbine, Sandy Hook), look at the Hunting Beach, Ohio State and Unvi. of Kentucky riots and those didn't even have a reason or it was over a lost basketball game.
imagine if it was systemic police brutality? No, the Baltimore people are pretty calm considering. |
A list of about five white individuals who have behaved worse than the Baltimore rioters is deceptive cherry picking. Actually, most Americans who have been shot by police are white so we should be seeing rioting and looting all over the US in white communities.... |
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, those fox news talking points won't cut it. blacks make up about half of all police shootings. Whites are almost 2/3 of the population, blacks amost 13 percent.
There is no cherry pick. "about 5 whites?' the major media didnt show the extent of the Huntington beach riots, the Ohio state riot and the University of Kentucky riots. In the latter, guns were fired, cops were hurt, tens of arrests over a losing a friggin' game. "about 5 is a straight out intentional misrepresentation' THere is no reason for whites and asians for that matter to riot. There are no issues, certainly not life and death issues. And you didn't answer the question, what if whites had the same number of incidents in context. Lets see if you nuance or just lie.
Also, how many of the white shootings were of white teens and 20 smethings unarmed and the police got off free from it?
Its a fact cops target lower income black and brown neighborhoods. That's a fact. Its easy pickings. Many states have a quota to fill for private prisons. Second, cops are promoted based on arrests. Its easier to arrest some black dude for whatever, even trumped up, the legal system is stacked against him. Try that in the suburbs. Whites take as much and some stats so more drugs than blacks but cops target blacks almost exclusively.
Frat row at my school was pot heaven..everyone knew that, cops knew that, but it doesn't pay to arrest the guys at Kappa Alpha or the Fiji house.
Finally, the anger is over injustice. You never hear blacks rioting over a clear cut case where the cops had every right to use deadly force. ALL the incidents and riots or marches were over perceived injustice. |
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Plain Meaning
Joined: 18 Oct 2014
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 12:21 am Post subject: |
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Nobody knows how many Americans the police kill each year
Here are estimates:
http://www.vox.com/2015/4/10/8382457/police-shootings-racism
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An analysis of the available FBI data by Vox's Dara Lind shows that US police kill black people at disproportionate rates: black people accounted for 31 percent of police shooting victims in 2012, even though they made up just 13 percent of the US population.
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Police were 21 times more likely to shoot and kill black teens than white teens between 2010 and 2012, according to a ProPublica analysis of the FBI data. |
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tophatcat
Joined: 09 Aug 2006
Location: under the hat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 1:53 am Post subject: |
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| This thread is racially attacking white people. I hope the MODs remove it. |
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Kepler
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 4:58 am Post subject: |
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| tophatcat wrote: |
| This thread is racially attacking white people. I hope the MODs remove it. |
It's just how some people make themselves feel better about black crime. Of course, they conveniently overlook how much more dangerous black neighborhoods were in the 70s and 80s when the police were much less active in those areas. None of the liberal solutions to black crime have ever worked. The Great Society programs were a failure. What has worked is much more aggressive policing in areas with the most violent crime. |
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Kepler
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 5:17 am Post subject: |
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About 20 businesses run by Korean Americans have been looted or burned in Baltimore. What does this have to do with protesting injustice?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa8v8FPNXBc |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 9:58 am Post subject: |
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Nothing, but what did the Vancouver riots have to do with hockey? Or the Boston riots with baseball? Or the Penn State riots with football? |
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Died By Bear
Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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What's going on in Baltimore?
People are dying. People are disappearing. Why?
BECAUSE people are disregarding the law. When the law breaks down, WE break down. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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| What's going on in Baltimore? Probably everyone taking a break tonight to see who the Ravens take in the NFL Draft as for one day, Mel Kiper Jr. becomes the most important man in America. |
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sirius black
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Kepler wrote: |
| tophatcat wrote: |
| This thread is racially attacking white people. I hope the MODs remove it. |
It's just how some people make themselves feel better about black crime. Of course, they conveniently overlook how much more dangerous black neighborhoods were in the 70s and 80s when the police were much less active in those areas. None of the liberal solutions to black crime have ever worked. The Great Society programs were a failure. What has worked is much more aggressive policing in areas with the most violent crime. |
BS. The police were ALWAYS active in black communities. Worse back then. Police brutality in poor black neighborhoods are a given and have been for decades pre-dating civil rights.
First of all, the reported black crime rate, ironically has always been higher than whites, even in the deep south and midwest where lynchings were common. Why was that? One would think blacks in the south especially wouldn't be committing crime against white property? Its because the crime stats don't reflect crime much of the time but the prison work system, free labor to replace slavery after the civil war. Google the 'black codes' in the south and actually in urban areas. The police basically criminalized any black behavior. There are hundreds of reports for example of towns simply arresting on any made up charge a black guy so he'll lose his property, usually farm land, and taken over. Hundreds of acres of land were gotten that way. Chicago has a notorious history of not only redlining but forcing blacks to take on what they deemed mortgages for houses and basically stole the property back.
When hundreds of thousands of southern and midwestern blacks were trying to leave for the northern factories when jobs were aplenty in Chicago, etc, during WW2, southern sheriffis would actually arrest black people at the train station for 'loitering' and jail them so they won't lose black labor and in the process get free prison labor and it wasn't a weekend sentence for loitering, they'd give them months in jail.
Johnson started a war on poverty. The Moynihan report in the early '60s took what was deemed an objective look at the problem of rising poverty in black families and poor familiies in general. Their conclusion was that the black male needed jobs to provide a strong family structure. Keep tha family intact, provide a male head of household. At the end of the decade there were riots in over 100 northern ctieis in the '67 and '68. Way worse than we see today. Again, another report, the Kerner Commission on why they were rioting. Again the report noted that when interviewed, amongst other things, police brutality, the one common thing mentioned was a lack of jobs. Blacks were denied entry into unions. Unions were the mainstay of the immigrant class, moved all the Poles, Germans, Irish, Italians from poor to working and middle classes. Blacks were denied most jobs that were working class.
So, what did the goverment do? The complete opposite, it expanded welfare. One of the provisions of welfare is that you can't have a male over 18 in the house. They expanded AFDC care for black women only. No pressure to open up unions and it could have. They did not expand blacks into the city, county or state employment system at the time. That didn't happen till we had black mayors. The fine public school system that many urban areas had to educate immigrants kept getting cuts in education when the school system got more black students. Student/teacher ratios shot up. Money was cut. Prisons built and expanded.
So, we have a government, BOTH Democrat and Republican that knew by expanding welfare and denying legal access to unions, etc, it would create a huge urban underclass of blacks that promoted single parenthood. It worked beautifully and now we have the same people blaming the victim for being on a welfare, having kids out of wedlock, the resulting crime
and gang warfare. This is not uncommon. When the european immigrants of the mid 1800s lacked the same thing they created a mafia for Italians, Jewish mafia as well as Irish gangs (Gangs of NY), the juvenile justice system was created almost specifically because hundreds, sometimes thousands of kids, Irish usually but others roamed the streets of cities.
So, all this worked perfectly but we blame the victims of a system designed to create what we are seeing on tv. Things such as suspended licenes, unpaid child support were never criminalized with jail a generation ago and now make up a huge portion of the black jail population. We criminalized with jail behavior blacks tend to do more than anyone else.
I'm not trying to convince those who simply just look for excuses and grab at any Fox News sound byte to feel okay about their bigotry but for a lot of the non Americans on here who may watch CNN, etc. or hear some of these comments and believe it or that teacher at your school. |
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