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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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 Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Most of us aren;t going to get those fancy shmancy jobs in Singapore, Hong Kongor anywhere's else. So, there's no point in comparing them. |
That's the attitude that wins. |
That's the attitude that prevails round these parts. |
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Fallacy
Joined: 29 Jun 2015
Location: ex-ROK
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2015 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: |
| Fallacy wrote: |
| Leon wrote: |
| One of the best steakhouses I've ever been to was in Seoul, for example. |
Can you be more specific? To know of this location would interest me much more than to find out wherever beats the pants off Seoul. I would love to go eat there. |
It was an outback....
Ok, sorry, not funny. I haven't been there for awhile, but it is called Kitchen 272, it is in Insadong and in the same building as the Fraser Suites hotel. |
That was great! There is my big laugh for the day. Thanks for the 2-for-1. I will be sure to wander into the Kitchen 272 all blinking and touristy-like, then ask the staff if this is the Outback, followed up by a query about whether their steaks are just as good or not! |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Most of us aren;t going to get those fancy shmancy jobs in Singapore, Hong Kongor anywhere's else. So, there's no point in comparing them. |
That's the attitude that wins.
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Outside of this region is the Middle East for pay and benefits.
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If you're the kind of person who thinks he can't get a job in Hong Kong or Singapore, what makes you think the Middle East would have you? |
Apply and find out. If you can get a good high paying job or an ok paying gig with a nice free apartment in these two cities with your 4 year degree and a TESOL certificate, then good for you. It's not about attitude. There are some Middle East jobs that do hire with a Bachelor's and a TESOL certificate.
It's like an Arts grad not applying for a high paying rocket science position and then having someone tell him he has a bad attitude and is being negative. Attitude and negativety have nothing to do with it. Korea, China, Vietnam, and some Middle East jobs will hire. Other places, including Taiwan public schools don't hire so easily. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Most of us aren;t going to get those fancy shmancy jobs in Singapore, Hong Kongor anywhere's else. So, there's no point in comparing them. |
That's the attitude that wins.
| Quote: |
Outside of this region is the Middle East for pay and benefits.
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If you're the kind of person who thinks he can't get a job in Hong Kong or Singapore, what makes you think the Middle East would have you? |
Apply and find out. If you can get a good high paying job or an ok paying gig with a nice free apartment in these two cities with your 4 year degree and a TESOL certificate, then good for you. It's not about attitude. There are some Middle East jobs that do hire with a Bachelor's and a TESOL certificate.
It's like an Arts grad not applying for a high paying rocket science position and then having someone tell him he has a bad attitude and is being negative. Attitude and negativety have nothing to do with it. Korea, China, Vietnam, and some Middle East jobs will hire. Other places, including Taiwan public schools don't hire so easily. |
I'm not particularly keen on the expression but , since you brought it up, doing the CELTA or equivalent is not exactly rocket science. The point in comparing jobs that don't fit your immediate skill set/qualification range is that it can be aspirational. People with the online cert might go, 'hey I'd like to work in Hong Kong or Singapore one day, how do I go about it? I sometimes even find it interesting when the likes of PRajic go on about knocking out PHDs and getting tenure track as it might be something I'd like to try one day. |
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Fallacy
Joined: 29 Jun 2015
Location: ex-ROK
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| Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 2:09 am Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| I sometimes even find it interesting when the likes of PRajic go on about knocking out PHDs and getting tenure track as it might be something I'd like to try one day. |
A cost/benefit analysis suggests that it may not be a good idea at all. I personally cannot recommend the extended college try. There are many ways to skin a cat. |
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Chaparrastique
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallacy wrote: |
| A cost/benefit analysis suggests that it may not be a good idea at all. I personally cannot recommend the extended college try. |
The cost:benefit ratio for a liberal arts PhD has never been worse.
That is if you can even find a bursary/ scholarship for one in the first place. The corporations of this world prefer to sponsor doctors, nurses and engineers. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2015 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Weigookin74 wrote: |
| Most of us aren;t going to get those fancy shmancy jobs in Singapore, Hong Kongor anywhere's else. So, there's no point in comparing them. |
That's the attitude that wins.
| Quote: |
Outside of this region is the Middle East for pay and benefits.
|
If you're the kind of person who thinks he can't get a job in Hong Kong or Singapore, what makes you think the Middle East would have you? |
Apply and find out. If you can get a good high paying job or an ok paying gig with a nice free apartment in these two cities with your 4 year degree and a TESOL certificate, then good for you. It's not about attitude. There are some Middle East jobs that do hire with a Bachelor's and a TESOL certificate.
It's like an Arts grad not applying for a high paying rocket science position and then having someone tell him he has a bad attitude and is being negative. Attitude and negativety have nothing to do with it. Korea, China, Vietnam, and some Middle East jobs will hire. Other places, including Taiwan public schools don't hire so easily. |
I'm not particularly keen on the expression but , since you brought it up, doing the CELTA or equivalent is not exactly rocket science. The point in comparing jobs that don't fit your immediate skill set/qualification range is that it can be aspirational. People with the online cert might go, 'hey I'd like to work in Hong Kong or Singapore one day, how do I go about it? I sometimes even find it interesting when the likes of PRajic go on about knocking out PHDs and getting tenure track as it might be something I'd like to try one day. |
I understand that. But a TESOL certificate alone isn't going to get you into those places. You need lots of advanced degrees for the few positions that do exist. When you're paying off thousands of dollars of student loans, credit cards, and whatever, then have to turn around and save up the cash for these advanced degrees, it can take years and years and years. We weren't all born with a silver spoon in our mouths. I seriously doubt anything less than a bricks and mortar in the classroom PHD is going to get you in there and even then the relatively few positions will make it competitive. I'd be a lot better off going home learn to be a stock broker or do some other advanced field and then try to go live there. Even then, that would take years, but at least the pay would be much better.
Most places pay crap for ESL, including back home. Some parts of east Asia and some places in the Middle East are an anomoly. I'm here for the cash. If the cash dries up, I'll move on. What I don't get is why folks think they can only do ESL. I wouldn't do it if the wages were crap. Some folks do. I won't judge folks if they truly enjoy it. But, I think most folks are pretty poor who work in it, with a few exceptions asides. My point being if I were going to plunk down thousands more for training, it wouldn't be in ESL. I'd find the future direction of jobs with good salaries and go in that direction. I hope to have my debts gone perhaps by the fall of 2016 if there are no major surprises or my contract gets cut next year. Lots of EPIK downsizing. |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2015 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I understand that. But a TESOL certificate alone isn't going to get you into those places. You need lots of advanced degrees for the few positions that do exist. When you're paying off thousands of dollars of student loans, credit cards, and whatever, then have to turn around and save up the cash for these advanced degrees, it can take years and years and years. We weren't all born with a silver spoon in our mouths. I seriously doubt anything less than a bricks and mortar in the classroom PHD is going to get you in there and even then the relatively few positions will make it competitive |
Did you actually bother to find out if any of this is true or did you just pull it out of your ass? I suspect the latter. This is what I meant by people having the attitude of a loser. if you listen to people, do the research and find out you don't want to do it, that's one thing but giving up before you even know what you're talking about is just defeatest. |
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Yaya
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2015 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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Back to the topic. I've been to Singapore once and it was impressive, but I also knew that it would get old after a while. It seems that so many things happen in a mall because being outside is so darn hot, plus Singlish is annoying to hear for me.
Because Singapore is one of the world's top three places to do biz, you can expect New York or London-type competition (and pressure) for good jobs. I'm also thinking British English is preferred (but I could be wrong). I was also quite disappointed in Singapore-style Chinese food as Hong Kong's was WAAAAAAAAAAAY better. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I understand that. But a TESOL certificate alone isn't going to get you into those places. You need lots of advanced degrees for the few positions that do exist. When you're paying off thousands of dollars of student loans, credit cards, and whatever, then have to turn around and save up the cash for these advanced degrees, it can take years and years and years. We weren't all born with a silver spoon in our mouths. I seriously doubt anything less than a bricks and mortar in the classroom PHD is going to get you in there and even then the relatively few positions will make it competitive |
Did you actually bother to find out if any of this is true or did you just pull it out of your ass? I suspect the latter. This is what I meant by people having the attitude of a loser. if you listen to people, do the research and find out you don't want to do it, that's one thing but giving up before you even know what you're talking about is just defeatest. |
Are you really stupid or on drugs or something?
http://www.asiateachingjobs.com/singapore
All these jobs require more than a Bachelors degree and a TESOl ceritificate.
https://www.jobsbank.gov.sg/ICMSPortal/portlets/JobBankHandler/SearchDetail.do?id=JOB-2015-0281661
Teacher's licence is required for this one.
I mean really, I have done more than 2 seconds of research idiot.
It's not being negative or having a bad attitude when I don't have these degrees. Something isn't connecting in your brain, man. As for going out and taking this training, I already told you about my thousands of dollars of debt that I'm currently paying. I already told you I don't have the money to go home for a couple of years and take real degrees (online ones are most likely not accepted). It's not being defeatest, it's being a case of no money in the bank account. After another year when I get my debts done, then how many more years must I save up money to go and take the training? How many thousands more do I need and how old will I be by then considering all the years it's taken me to have paid off my credit cards and student loans?
Just because you're rich and have all kinds of money doesn't mean you get the arrogant or obnoxious right to chastise the rest of us that don't rich boy. I'm happy you can go abroad and live the fantasy life, but don't assume everyone can. Some of us came here to pay off our debts as opposed to travelling, being free, or whatever dumb BS it is you do. Some of us actually can't afford stuff. You must be one of the biggest @$$h0les on this board.
I mean calling someone a loser just because they're poor. I'd punch you in the effin mouth if I ever met you in person and you said that crap to my face!!! Kiss my @$$ snob!!! |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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So it took you 2 days to find a few job adverts requiring higher qualifications. I could find just as many advertisements for jobs in Korea or China that also require those qualifications, what does that prove? That you can't get a job in Singapore or Hong Kong with just a BA and a CELTA? No.
E.g. This advert from the HK NET scheme
http://www.edb.gov.hk/en/sch-admin/admin/about-sch-staff/net-scheme/recruitment-primary-net.html
or some random one I found on this site in 2 minutes
http://www.eslcafe.com/joblist/index.cgi?read=35953
Here's one in Singapore
http://www.britishcouncil.sg/about/jobs/english-teacher
| Quote: |
| I mean calling someone a loser just because they're poor. I'd punch you in the effin mouth if I ever met you in person and you said that crap to my face!!! Kiss my @$$ snob!!! |
Where did I say you were a loser because you were poor? I said you have the attitude of a loser because you rejected the idea about working in certain countries without bothering to find out about it (see above) You're also a loser because your first reaction to someone saying something you don't like would be to launch a physical attack on them, which makes you a loser in most people's eyes. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:01 am Post subject: |
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That escalated quickly  |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:14 am Post subject: |
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| Zyzyfer wrote: |
| That escalated quickly |
Yep, just trying to help the guy (at first) |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:50 am Post subject: |
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No one is worth going to jail over or having to pay blood money over, so I'm not actually going to punch anyone in the mouth. But, running around bad calling folks losers might result in negative reactions from someone else who doesn't care about such things.
It didn't take me two days to look things up. I already knew this and had known this info for a long time. I'm surprised you never looked it up yourself and accused me of being ignorant. (I just assumed it was common knowledge which countries offer the most opportunities.) The reality is teaching there is not really possible for most folks in Korea. There are fewer jobs there anyhow. I already explained the reasons why it's quite difficult to do and get in.
I mean I'm happy that you have no debts and lots of money saved up and can afford to go home for a couple of years to get a Master's of Education or TESOL at a brick and mortar real university. (Online certificates really don't cut it in most countries.) I don't begrudge you of that, but don't assume you know everything about everyone else. I guess the fact that I actually pay my debts makes me a loser rather than defaulting like many others have and then live the high life of bumming around SE Asia on vacation staying in cheap 2 dollar a night rooms.
The truth is comparing Hong Kong, Singapore, etc are apples and oranges to Korea, China, etc. Paying down tens of thousands of dollars of debt will have been one of my proudest achievements. (The 2008 to 2013 bad exchange rate slowed that down, but hasn't stopped me.) |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:21 am Post subject: |
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It didn't take me two days to look things up. I already knew this and had known this info for a long time. I'm surprised you never looked it up yourself and accused me of being ignorant. (I just assumed it was common knowledge which countries offer the most opportunities.) The reality is teaching there is not really possible for most folks in Korea. There are fewer jobs there anyhow. I already explained the reasons why it's quite difficult to do and get in.
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I just showed you three job adverts for Singapore/Hong Kong that require nothing more than a BA and a CELTA. Not going to mention that? |
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