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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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 Posted: Mon May 24, 2004 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: hmmm |
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| Grotto wrote: |
I was hired to teach English, teaching English is teaching a whole not just a part. If I, who am a certified teacher, deem that my students are deficient in a certain area I feel it is my duty to help them improve that area and become better English speakers. If they cannot read the material I am using then should I not help them to be able to read it   |
Does this mean that next time you notice they can't make a fine Christmas cake that you will take them to a kitchen somewhere and have them start baking cakes? Or perhaps show them how to correctly solder a microprocessor to a breadboard for use in an unspecified electronics project when you notice they are deficient in their soldering skills?
Plus, pro-tip sweetheart, reading English <> speaking English. For example, I read Korean at about eight words a minute if I'm really lucky and even I have to phonically work out what is being said, but my speaking ability is substantially higher where I can engage in simple conversations and pass off an image that I am near fluent to native speakers as long as I can control the conversation and keep it short (such as to a minute or two).
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If I was teaching chinese checkers I wouldnt worry about it either, but English is much more complex than a childs game. Sorry to have to point this out to you  Since when do analogies to Chinese checkers and digital cameras have anything to do with teaching English  Its like comparing apples, oranges and muffins they are all seperate items. |
What is hard to understand? Your employer, the man paying you money, tells you that you are to teach an English conversation class. The students are paying money to attend an English conversation class. You agreed to teach an English conversation class. Everyone is there as part of the English conversation class plan. Suddenly you want to do something different because it would make your job easier.
Then when people start saying "hey, we are paying for an English conversation class" and the boss says "hey, I am pay you for an English conversation class", you turn around and start getting mad at them for daring to request they get what they are paying for?
And you dare to suggest the problem is with them?
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| Realisiticly Yes I am sure my kindergarten aged students dont have any problem with their reading skills. |
I'm certain they can't bake a fine cake or solder microprocessors to breadboards, but you are not being paid to teach them those skills either.
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| Once again your blatant stupidity consists of making assumptions and then trying to justify them in ways that have no bearing on the topic. |
Stupidity? For stating the obvious in easy to understand terms? Plus, what's with the amateur hour insults? Maybe next post you can call me "silly" and insult my mother.
Plus, how is it an assumption to say that one can teach quite effectively a spoken English class and that you would simply do what you are being paid to do? A substantial number of my classes are bookless conversation classes. I am doing what you claim cannot be done. Can it be that Mr. Businessman can do what Mr. Certified Teacher can not?
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| It is not an English speaking class dipwad, it is an English class. |
Your earlier claims that you are being told that it is an English conversation class would suggest that this statement is a lie. Remember that part where you said "this is only a speaking and listening hogwan".
Perhaps for your next insult, you can tell me that my taste in music is quite poor. That might serve as a distraction and save you from this humiliation you are now experiencing.
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As for stealing their money  If I didnt care then you could classify it as theft, but as I do care about my students you have no standing in which to slander me. |
Pro-tip Mr. Certified Teacher: if I knew that what I wrote was incorrect, that would be an act of libel, not slander. However, you have already claimed that you are unwilling and unable to do what people are paying you to do. Next time you order a music CD off the Internet and the people send you a fork instead because they would rather sell forks than CDs, we'll see what you start calling them.
So, yes, you are deliving a service they do not want while refusing to deliver a service they are paying for. Generally it can be classified as theft, but more specifically it's an act of fraud. Would you prefer I use the specific term or the more general term?
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| Take a long hard look in the mirror. Maybe you have a decent job but some of us are in hogwan hell just counting the days until we can move on to an actual teaching job |
Yes, I do have a decent job. Why, you ask? Because I can deliver what people want! Yes, I could teach them all how to make fine cakes and wonderful soldering projects, but instead I deliver what they want.
It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon May 24, 2004 4:19 pm Post subject: Re: hmmm |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| I try very hard to give my students the best teaching I can, |
Then why in your first post do you claim that "actual teaching don't mean sss hhhh iiii ttt eee you are a white face in a room speaking english thats it."
Surely a certified teacher knows that "don't mean' should be 'doesn't mean'. English should be spelled with a capital E and "thats" is spelled 'that's'. Now these could be passed off as typos. I sometimes make them myself. But certainly a certified teacher should know at least how to use the quote function.
In another post you claim that "some of us are in hagwon hell just counting the days until we can move on to a actual teaching job."
And you claim you care about your students. When called on your evasions and half-truths, don't make up more. It just makes it easier for us to provide proof to refute you with. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 5:39 am Post subject: proof LOL |
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what proof do you have of anything?
general off topic statements that originated out of some business degree holder trying to sluff off his pain in the ass lesson plans to the korean teachers. Look at it from their point of view, you want us to learn your style, spend even more extra time and have you insult their ability to teach.
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| Anytime you want a free lesson on how it's done, step into my classroom, I'll teach you a few things. |
I could give you the benefit of a doubt and say that perhaps just maybe you might have an idea that I could use..but naaah 
I feel that the dead end trolling has come to an end and I will no longer reply to such inane stupidity |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 9:21 am Post subject: teaching |
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A certified teacher is someone who has a degree in Education and has been certified by their provincial or state government as having the minimum? qualifications necassary to teach.
I say that all we are is white faces in a classroom because when I actually try to incorporate teaching methods that I learned earning my degree I am told not too. This goes against everything I have been taught, and my own common sense as well.
If many(not all) of the hogwans in Korea actually gave a rats southern end about their students they would have decent curriculums, give teachers freedom to expand upon the curriculum and back their teachers up.
Unfortunately many hogwon owners are in it for the buck(I have no problem with people making money but when you do not give value for the money it ticks me off) As long a little Min su is coming to school and her parents are paying the cash they are happy.
You try to incorporate good time proven methods and ideaologies instituted by teachers with many years of experience and they tell you not to!
Gord once again what does xmas cake have to do with English? So when your students ask you what time it is you stick your hand up your ass and cluck like a chicken? Stupid stupid stupid...try to stay on track...I know it must be hard for an illiterate inbred scion of retards but do try
Your inability to read Korean at any level is not relevant. What does it have to do with anything
Once again I was never told I was teaching English conversation classes...yet another stupid assumption on your part....I was turned loose in my classes and told to teach English. AFTER 8 MONTHS THEY TOOK EXCEPTION TO MY TEACHING READING AND WRITING
Oh yes your mother wears army boots and fraternises with sailors...hope I made your day 
I also have bookless conversation classes....and those I teach quite well.
I never claimed that it 'could not be done' I meant that it is much more effective if your students can read a word out of a dictionary and understand it than if they can say 'Gord is an inbred moron' and not understand the nuances of the sentence
Just out of morbid curiosity I wonder how many exams/tests/quizzes do you administer per month/week/semester? What is their bearing? Do they actually count towards anything? Who do you submit your statistics to?
Myself personally I give a test once every month...if a student fails it....and many do...even after being given the test in practice the day before and priming them for the exam for two weeks. At the end of the day when many students recieved a low or failing mark the director changed the marks to good(85-90%) saying that if they do bad their parents may take them out of school.
once again music cd's forks
are you on acid heavily sedated Where do you pull these inane comments out of your rectum
You deliver what they want what do they want of you at this wonderful school prattle
If your vaunted lesson plans are so incredible why dont you share them with us since you have not posted them previously I will lable them toilet tissue....much like your words only good for one use |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 10:27 am Post subject: |
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What the hell kind of post is that? You start out with a big ramble saying that it's everyone else's fault that you can't do the job you said you could, follow up with a few amateurish insults towards me, glossing over the lovely metaphors I provided by pretending you don't understand them, insulting your students for daring to request that you provide them with the lessons they are paying for, and then asking me to do your job for you.
This, after you were caught in multiple, contradictory lies (though one might have been true) and you didn't even apologize for your accusation that I had slandered you.
And you say others are the ones doing the trolling?
Though I am curious why you insist on working at a job that you say you cannot do and are going to great lengths to not do but still expect to be paid for. Does it not bother you that you are stealing from people? |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 10:47 am Post subject: troll troll troll |
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gord you are a substandard type of humonoid.
Lovely metaphors  wow did you look that word up in the dictionary all by yourself Or did you have help
Amatuerish? Consider yourself dissed by someone who actually has a thorough grasp of the English language.....it is obvious from you banal posts that you are incapable of grasping the finer points of English
Once again you make widespread accusations of what I do or do not do when you have absolutely no concept of what I do do
What lies have I been caught in I do not recall or see any lies that I have posted I have talked about some concepts that your keen wit and intelligence have failed to grasp.... and I do apologize for using words that are more than one syllable long.
And yet you continue to cast your line into the trolling sea
you are quite possibly the worst possible example of a troll....inane stupid accusations backed up with even more off topic stupidity.....where did you earn your business degree? baskin robins? Sesame street? Or did you have it forged for yourself.
At the end of the day I can hold my head high and know that I have done the best job possible for my students and that I can accept that you are here because you are a white face with a degree...nothing more...nothing less |
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Gwangjuboy
Joined: 08 Jul 2003
Location: England
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| Grotto has already stated that he was scolded when attempting to give a speaking test to his students. If his contract (which we haven't seen yet) stated that he was supposed to teach conversational English, then what's the problem with testing his students (orally) on what he has taught them? I can't believe he is facing so much opposition for wanting a bit of discretion in the classroom. I thought teachers were supposed to be creative. Some seem to be suggesting that the teacher should merely function as a robot, at the beck and call of the wonjangnim. That's absurd. Also, Grotto could have made a better case for himself. A few self contradictions were apparent. Still, I think I know what he was getting at. He just wasn't articulate enough to express himself. |
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Badmojo
Joined: 07 Mar 2004
Location: I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 2:34 pm Post subject: Re: proof LOL |
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| Grotto wrote: |
general off topic statements that originated out of some business degree holder trying to sluff off his pain in the ass lesson plans to the korean teachers. Look at it from their point of view, you want us to learn your style, spend even more extra time and have you insult their ability to teach.
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| Anytime you want a free lesson on how it's done, step into my classroom, I'll teach you a few things. |
I could give you the benefit of a doubt and say that perhaps just maybe you might have an idea that I could use..but naaah |
I'm not getting into this with you anymore.
I left the lesson plans because it was the right thing to do. I was trying to make it as easy as possible for them.
And as for your other comments:
Number one, I'm an English major.
Number two, I'm TESOL certified. And it wasn't one of these 72 hour fly-by-night jobs, it took me four months.
You are the amateur, and I am the professional.
You are the disease, and I am the cure. |
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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@ Badmojo: Yep. good work. Enjoy your vacation, mate. Where will you go, by the way? Have you ever been to the south? Nam-hae, a touch southwest of Pusan is nice. Many small islands, boat tours, swimming...Hae-geum-gang is really cool...a very historical place in it's own right. You could rent a car, which allows much more of a relaxed pace to your travel. Just an idea....have a great time. Detox!!
@ grotto: Friend, you are in a bad cycle here. Kudos to you for getting your cetificate. I am sure it's very, very useful. Shame is, not so where you are working. I wish you the best of luck in your next job hunt. Hopefully you can find a place that will utilize all of your skills, instead of such a narrow, confining channel.
@ Gord: Some funny stuff there, man. The CD-> fork thing made me laugh out loud. You have a keen mind for analogies. Thanks! |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 3:21 pm Post subject: Re: troll troll troll |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| gord you are a substandard type of humonoid. |
Rock on, super amateurish insult action!
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| Lovely metaphors wow did you look that word up in the dictionary all by yourself Or did you have help |
Again, amateurish insult. Masquerading around like a twelve year old does not serve you well. Though it is unwise to toss out dictionary insults when your posts are rampant spelling nightmares such as your inability to correctly spell words like "humanoid".
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| Amatuerish? Consider yourself dissed by someone who actually has a thorough grasp of the English language.....it is obvious from you banal posts that you are incapable of grasping the finer points of English |
What dissing? You've said nothing witty nor creative. Your most interesting insults read as though they are coming from the mouth of a child. That's why I'm continually pointing out that if you really wish to post insulting messages that you should step up the quality of your attacks.
If you would rather I stepped up to the plate and showed you how the pros play in the insult game, then call me when amateur night is over and I'll show up for a game.
Though you really should avoid saying things like "it is obvious from you(sic) banal posts" immediately after you proclaim that you are a master of all things English.
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| Once again you make widespread accusations of what I do or do not do when you have absolutely no concept of what I do do |
If you feel that my observations (along with those of everyone else) where we are questioning why you are continually posting contradictory claims, perhaps you have offer an explanation toward this.
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| What lies have I been caught in I do not recall or see any lies that I have posted I have talked about some concepts that your keen wit and intelligence have failed to grasp.... and I do apologize for using words that are more than one syllable long. |
What lies? Just off the top of my head, your claims that you are a valuable teacher but all teachers in Korea are valueless because we are only meant to be white. Or how you try hard to teach your students but turn around and claim you don't even make a sincere effort because no one cares. That sort of thing.
You've basically trying to play the sympathy card. When it serves you in a conversation to masquerade around as a super teacher, you whip out your "certified teacher" claims. When it serves you to be the victim of a system that does not care, you whip out your "I don't even try" stance.
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| And yet you continue to cast your line into the trolling sea |
All you've been doing is trolling for attention. Including now which is particularly ironic when you are suggesting that I am doing the same. Great, rock on. Feel the power, oh master of all things English. I don't believe anything I said here can be considered trolling. All I have done is comment on how you blame others for your mistakes and shortcomings (with both your employment and postings).
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| you are quite possibly the worst possible example of a troll....inane stupid accusations backed up with even more off topic stupidity.....where did you earn your business degree? baskin robins? Sesame street? Or did you have it forged for yourself. |
I do believe that this statement is in error. Though if you wish us to discuss any suspected trolling claims, you will have to cease in your poor quality trolling efforts.
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| At the end of the day I can hold my head high and know that I have done the best job possible for my students and that I can accept that you are here because you are a white face with a degree...nothing more...nothing less |
If the best insults I could come up with are simply plagerized lines stolen from twelve year olds I'd be hanging my head in shame. I don't believe I can stress enough that you need to improve upon the quality of your insults.
But if it makes it so you can sleep at night, then fine, go right on believing that the reason I make more than twice what you do is because my degree has a shinier foil stamp than yours and my face is sexier than yours. Sounds great to me as I'm a sexy man who likes shiny things. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 4:03 pm Post subject: Re: troll troll troll |
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| Gord wrote: |
| If the best insults I could come up with are simply plagerized . . . |
Bad form to flame another poster's typo while making a worse error yourself.
Substituting the "e" for the "ia" is not a typo, but an indication that one is completely unfamiliar with the word's correct spelling. Altogether too sexy and shiny. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Gwangjuboy wrote: |
| d. Also, Grotto could have made a better case for himself. A few self contradictions were apparent. Still, I think I know what he was getting at. He just wasn't articulate enough to express himself. |
But he is (so he claims) a certified teacher. Certainly a certified teacher (of all people) should have the basic ability to express himself.
Also when said poster makes a number of self contradictions (as you so rightly noted) it makes the other posters wonder what else he is fabricating. |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Demophobe wrote: |
| You were hired, just like all of the non-certified teachers to do whatever your employer wants you to do. |
Don't be so low on yourself.
You are a teacher and can adopt the standards of good conduct in the profession, like the original poster does, or not, if you're doing it with only your eye on a short-term paycheque.
Badmojo, leaving lesson plans is a professional thing to do, and like many posters I applaud the effort while caution you to limit expectations.
Don't try to control the other teachers. You aren't the director. As a teacher you are responsible for the teaching of your students when you are in the classroom. When someone else teaches them, the students are that teacher's students, to be taught as they see fit. If the director doesn't like it, the teacher could be replaced. But what happens in the replacement teacher's classroom is beyond your authority.
Of course you may reach an agreement and get their cooperation, or you may not. Remember: Your expectations of other teachers to follow your lesson plan is on par with their expectations of you to cut your vacation short: both are a reach, and not binding.
Get your mojo going. Have fun!
Last edited by VanIslander on Tue May 25, 2004 4:16 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 4:14 pm Post subject: Re: troll troll troll |
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| dogbert wrote: |
| Gord wrote: |
| If the best insults I could come up with are simply plagerized . . . |
Bad form to flame another poster's typo while making a worse error yourself.
Substituting the "e" for the "ia" is not a typo, but an indication that one is completely unfamiliar with the word's correct spelling. Altogether too sexy and shiny. |
Yet Gord was not the one who claimed he had a "thorough grasp of the English language" and then went on to disprove it.
Gord much like everybody on here (myself included) does make typos. It is one thing to make typos, it is quite another to make claims like "I am a certified teacher" or "someone who actually has a thorough grasp of the English language" and then make basic mistakes like "you" instead of "your" and continue to make them in post after post. |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 25, 2004 5:10 pm Post subject: Re: troll troll troll |
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| dogbert wrote: |
Bad form to flame another poster's typo while making a worse error yourself.
Substituting the "e" for the "ia" is not a typo, but an indication that one is completely unfamiliar with the word's correct spelling. Altogether too sexy and shiny. |
You got me. I thought it was with an E. I'll remember for the future. Though the context was not to say I was a master of all spellings, but rather that one shouldn't play the dictionary insult when one can't spell. My spelling is horrid with many words and I do make many typos on top of that. I fully accept this which is why I do not comment on the spelling issues of others with the exception of when one claims they are an English master but can't spell worth a damn.
Had Grotto not claimed he was an English master as part of his insult platform, I would not have brought up the spelling issue that undermines that claim. |
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