Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Stunted Wookie]

Stories out of the KOTESOL conference were that is was great --
but stories (rumors) appearing that the ABM at the end of the Conference was anything but what people expected -- allegations of fraud in the election, allegations of money mismanagement - screaming and shouting across the table - full on hostility between two groups it seems.

Did anyone see what happened....???
Something must have been going on
if you read the KOTESOL site the Pusan President has resigned plus others --
http://www.kotesol.org/busan/officers.htm

[Stunted Wookie]

I found this - but no answer yet -
http://efl-law.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=53

on the efl-law.org forum this afternoon -

[schwa]

Your link doesnt open.

I was at the ABM, at least for a while. It began with a raffle for like a hundred trivial prizes, then it seemed the plan was to count the votes for the new executive, announce the winners, & everyone could go home or meet for beers or whatever after a busy weekend running what I would say was a fairly successful conference.

I'm a new exec member with a regional chapter where we try to put on congenial & helpful gatherings & I was curious to discover how the national organization operates. Well it seemed like a highschool politics club gone amok.

There was a Busan contingent that seemed largely intent on being disruptive, I have no idea why. These old guys seemed way overserious (& angry!) about simple points of procedure & insisted on votes on self-defeating motions. (I can say 'old guys,' I'm one myself, but I worried some of these people might give themselves aneurysms.) I thought the stalwarts of the organization did a fair job of trying to keep the meeting sane.

Maybe I should have stuck around for the pure theater of it but after a half hour of amused incredulousness I felt like hitting Subway for a sandwich (no such where I live) & catching the long bus home.

This was my first attendance at one of these conferences & I heard a couple amazing speakers, who will have a positive impact on how I teach, & I took in some crummy speakers too. I met a bunch of nice people. I'm glad I went.

Sorry I cant address the OP's questions exactly. But I do think KOTESOL is well-meaning & offers benefits on a local level. Shameless plug here: Gangwondo has a pretty cool & laidback chapter. Check out our page on the www.kotesol.org site.

[Len8]

Heard that David Breen was there to give a lecture on Korean Culture. His lecture supposedly had the biggest audience.

[visviva]

I reckon that the people in charge of KOTESOL are the sort of people who generally end up in charge of association politics... petty power-trippers trapped forever in their own petty power squabbles.

I love KOTESOL dearly, have been a member since shortly after my arrival 2 years ago, but my brief encounters with the national have never failed to annoy me. (Daegu chapter rocks, though). I skipped the ABM, so I have nothing terribly pertinent to say.

I do have a question which hopefully won't lead this thread too far off-topic: does anyone know the story behind the creation of PKETA (the Pan-Korean English Teachers Association)? This org used to be a local association of teachers from the Yeongnam area, but changed its identity a few years back. Since it would seem a bit silly to have two "national" EFL teachers' associations in such a small country, presumably there was some squabble/schism which led to this. (Nor does it seem coincidental that PKETA scheduled their annual conference on the same day as KOTESOL this year). Anyone know the sordid tale behind all that?

[Paji eh Wong]

[Inigo Montoya]

I was at the meeting at the end but only until the prizes were all given out. I then skipped out for my long bus ride home. I think that I am glad I left and not sorry to have missed the fighting.

I was at the conference from 9 Saturday to 5:30 Sundayand got a lot out of most of the sessions that I attended. I was lucky enough to be in both of Dr. Nation's talks. That man is amazing!

I learned lots, bought lots, picked up lots of freebies and asked for even more to be sent to me for consideration. The conference gave me lots to think about, read about, research and change how I am doing things. I consider it to be an incredibly worthwhile weekend. I also enjoyed interacting with others and running into old friends.

[Stunted Wookie]

The definitive answer has been assimilated based on many phone calls:-

PKETA simply didn't know about the KOTESOL conference - a bad oversight!

The 'old guys' from Pusan mentioned above were asked by ordinary members to ask the National Council certain questions, as that is what ABMs are for.

Seems National KOTESOL didn't want to answer, so Pusan guys got riled as the questions went to why did KOTESOL spend 29 million Won of members money on the Sookmyung University when FREE choices were available and on offer. It was a member who felt this needed raising - not those arguing to be heard -

The old guys were also asked to present 'proxy votes' from members in Pusan who were working that day and could not get to the conference. But the request to have members' votes counted who weren't there in Seoul Sookmyung was defeated (this I think is strange) ~~ surely once you are a Member, you must be allowed to vote wherever you are -

And as it turned out, the voting was Critically close - those votes that were refused Could have meant a Different President in KOTESOL -- does this sound familiar (Florida) - That would have been the difference between a qualified educator and a non-suitably qualified person being the President of KOTESOL.

And if the rumor is true, then the word is that Pusan Kotesol has shut down in protest! But that is a rumor..........But the Chad is watching and listening......

[In the know]

It seems to me and all I know that this organisation is only for University teachers - you won't find one hogwan teacher in the membership - it is purely exclusive - the only time they want you is when you pay the 55,000 or so for the conference - a bit steep to my way of thinking ......

Why is there no teacher organisation for hogwan teachers? I think we are 95% of all teachers in Korea and yet we have nothing -

[visviva]

Now that's just silly. I'm a hagwon teacher, and have been one for the 2 years that I've been a KOTESOL member and attended chapter meetings. No one has ever tried to exclude me from the organisation because of my workplace, and I know a number of other hagwon teachers who are members as well. Granted, sometimes other members get a funny distant look in their eyes when they find out I teach in a hagwon in the sticks instead of a big spiffy uni, but that's life.

KOTESOL is a professional organisation, and is open to all ELT professionals in Korea. Why do so few of us hagwon monkeys join? Because few of us choose to view ourselves as professionals. Sad but true.

PS There are a lot of public-school teachers in KOTESOL also. Not to mention at least one hagwon owner, ILE's Jake Kimball of Daegu.

PPS Whether the national leadership of KOTESOL is really open to hagwon workers is another matter. But as far as I'm concerned, if the uni apes want that can of worms they can keep it.

[In the know]

Thanks visviva - interesting comments -- it's just a perception and I am wrong - it seemed like it was a university only club -- I don't know how i'd feel - one year here and wanting to get advancement but surrounded by many professionals who as you say may look down on my job.....

But I come back to the point - if KOTESOL represents so many of us Teachers, why is it that it has a membership of reporedly less than 4% of foreign teachers and 0.1% of Korean English teachers..

Maybe the perception I have of an exclusive club is wrong - I am sure it's fun - but would my voice ever be heard if I had a good idea? I doubt it - if a whole group from Pusan pull out of KOTESOL, which I read on this thread, what does that say? Either everyone in Pusan is mad, or something is wrong somewhere - The second largest city - I went to KOTESOL international conference in Pusan not so long ago --- a huge crowd there -- I traveled a long way - had a great day -- now that group is shut down.... there is something going on but no-one is telling us teachers what it is...

You mention a professional organisation.... that may just look at the website - it is pretty sick, bad graphics and 3-5 years out of date with it's notices and magazines... the web site these days is the Public Face of a company - Obviously lots of good but somethings' lacking

[In the know]

Well i just asked about my membership (6 months later) and why I haven't been getting my magazine which I paid for and am told I was never a member - and they want me me to pay full membership fees and conference fees to go to the conference - this is wrong -two times in 9 months- -doesn't anyone control what's going on -- I gather there is no-one who is responsible for anything - I rang some other members but they stopped going to meetings as there is no interest at all - but a lot of nastiness and in house back-stabbing -
Is there a Professional Teachers' group I could join that is professional and not made of the Mickey Mouse Club.

[Real Reality]

In the know,
Would you please refrain from insulting the Mickey Mouse Club?

"That show set the standard for professionalism..."
http://christinaaguilera.com/rumormill/rumor_0158.html

[steroidmaximus]

the link doesn't work cuz EFL guy totally pruned what he was on about. The link has been repaired to jump to the 'nice' version. Dave also pruned some stuff here.

I brought up what was being said here and on EFL law when I was recently approached to join at a job related seminar, but was stonewalled, given some mamby pamby stuff about how English teachers need to stick together, then when the time came around to discuss further the representative ran away. I'm like: let's talk about it over beer. Sure, guy said. Then left. Ok then. . .

Maybe it was my cologne.

[steroidmaximus]

What with all the rumours circulating, why not use this forum to explain the situation? I'm interested in joining, but I would like someone from the new management to explain what happened and what steps are being taken to ensure it has been rectified?