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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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 Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| Real Reality wrote: |
rapier wrote,
"I'll search for some other links to post up later.."
If you do enough research, then we could form a research center or think tank.
We can call it the RRR Institute (or the RRR Center).
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korian
Joined: 26 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 11:48 am Post subject: |
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sorry to be a bigger killjoy here but as stated earlier anyone can write anything and post it on the net. the article is from an agenda driven online gay journal. hardly objective there.
moreover, it makes one reference to a book first written in 1736 and last issued in 1987, the influential 'women's four book' hmmm
the claim that 23.3% of women worked as prostitutes in 1989 is not sourced. note it says all women. further, it doesn't say had worked at some time, but worked. so during 1989 1 in every 4 women in korea worked as a prostitute. unsourced.
to top things off are the 3 links at the bottom of the article. i don't know if they were usd as primary or secondary sources, but it proves irrelevany anyway. the first link, a reuters article, is dead or not found. the second link is to an overtly gay online journal and the third link is a gay site written entirely in chinese.
so it's written by a gay journal, with one single reference to a book first published in the 1700's, and with links that go nowhere for our eyes but to another gay website.
whilst i don't deny there is a seedy underbelly to life in korea it will take more than these kinds of cources and inflammatory gobbledigook to get a rise out of me |
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Wisco Kid
Joined: 07 Sep 2004
Location: Changwon
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 5:51 am Post subject: |
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Sex Ratio
Korea
at birth: 1.09 male(s)/female
under 15 years: 1.12 male(s)/female
15-64 years: 1.03 male(s)/female
65 years and over: 0.67 male(s)/female
total population: 1.01 male(s)/female (2004 est.)
China
at birth: 1.12 male(s)/female
under 15 years: 1.13 male(s)/female
15-64 years: 1.06 male(s)/female
65 years and over: 0.91 male(s)/female
total population: 1.06 male(s)/female (2004 est.)
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Blame it on Confucius!!!!!!!!!! |
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Derrek
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 7:21 am Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| Well, I just noticed that in my class of 43 grade 3 students there are only sixteen girls. Annecdotal evidence yes, but it's a fairly random sample. |
I've got plenty of girls at my school, and believe me, they all want a crack at those 27 boys you've got in that class! |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 7:35 am Post subject: |
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Korian: prostitution is illegal in S.Korea- thats why there are no official statistics... but look at this report from the Asia Monitor Resource Center, an NGO.
"there are over 300.000 establishments related to prostitution..1.2 million women involved in these establishments..constituting 20% of all women aged 15-29" (From surveys by civic groups).
http://www.amrc.org.hk/Arch/3309.htm
Or consider this link from newspaper reports: "The sex trade accounts for more than 4% of S.Korea's GDP...20% of Korean adult men buy sex 4 times a month..
http://www.janekeeler.com/weblog/skprost.html
Both links make interesting reading btw... |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Derrek wrote: |
| peppermint wrote: |
| Well, I just noticed that in my class of 43 grade 3 students there are only sixteen girls. Annecdotal evidence yes, but it's a fairly random sample. |
I've got plenty of girls at my school, and believe me, they all want a crack at those 27 boys you've got in that class! |
Your girls like babysitting that much? I teach elementary school. |
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Cthulhu
Joined: 02 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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Rapier wrote:
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| But dig a little deeper. Sometimes it can be quite surprising when a korean opens up to you,tells you personal things...and you realise not all is as rosy as appears on the surface. |
I think that is a far more reasonable statement than your opening post in this thread:
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| Korean society = Hell. |
Especially when there's some backtracking on the stats.
The selective gender/abortion issue is very true and relevant (and embarrassing) as well as Korea's status as a nation high in supplying adoptees. Divorce rates have also climbed, though still lagging behind some other well known western nations. The rest of the stats need to be taken with a bit more than a grain of salt, I think. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 4:26 am Post subject: |
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| Cthulhu wrote: |
Rapier wrote:
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| But dig a little deeper. Sometimes it can be quite surprising when a korean opens up to you,tells you personal things...and you realise not all is as rosy as appears on the surface. |
I think that is a far more reasonable statement than your opening post in this thread:
| Quote: |
| Korean society = Hell. |
Especially when there's some backtracking on the stats.
The selective gender/abortion issue is very true and relevant (and embarrassing) as well as Korea's status as a nation high in supplying adoptees. Divorce rates have also climbed, though still lagging behind some other well known western nations. The rest of the stats need to be taken with a bit more than a grain of salt, I think. |
Rubbish...The only reason Koreas stats on such things as rape, or prostitution, appear to lag behind western countries is because they are tabboo here. The west takes a much more open and practical view of them.
If you report a rape in korea, your reputation is forever shattered, the perpetrator is highly unlikely to be prosecuted, and even if he is, he's likely to be asked not to do it again at most.
A western woman could report a guy winking at her to the police and have him sued for a fortune as sexual harrassment. Or she could decide he was no good as a one night stand, sue him for rape, pocket a fortune, and live with an appealing victimhood mentality ever after. Especially if the guy was famous.
In Korea, there is no incentive for a woman to admit to being raped or being a prostitute..let alone report it to the police!!!
Get real Cthullhu...what planet are you on? I hear a rape in process virtually every week outside my appartment followed by screaming and the woman running for her life...This is a male-dominated society- totally. The men know they can get away with anything when it comes to women.
If you think that prostitution is anything less than rampant here, I have some information for you...you know those 2 spinning poles you see at night outside shops on virtually every street corner, every 100 yards? its not because every adjosshi wants a haircut at 3am.
If Korea is really the paradise you see through your rose-tinted sunny's, why is it that there is a virtual stampede with multiple trampled victims at every Immigration fair? |
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Cthulhu
Joined: 02 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 7:18 am Post subject: |
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You really had no clue what I wrote, did you.
Read my post again--I wasn't trying to make comparisons between Korea and the West. I was pointing out the shadiness of some of the stats you provided, something a number of others have already done in this thread.
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Rubbish...The only reason Koreas stats on such things as rape, or prostitution, appear to lag behind western countries is because they are tabboo here. The west takes a much more open and practical view of them.
If you report a rape in korea, your reputation is forever shattered, the perpetrator is highly unlikely to be prosecuted, and even if he is, he's likely to be asked not to do it again at most.
A western woman could report a guy winking at her to the police and have him sued for a fortune as sexual harrassment. Or she could decide he was no good as a one night stand, sue him for rape, pocket a fortune, and live with an appealing victimhood mentality ever after. Especially if the guy was famous. |
Here's where your post gets bizarre.
You start comparing rape stats with the West (something I never did in my post), then admit to the West having higher stats. And yet you decide that your opinions and anecdodatal evidence trumps the stats.
| Quote: |
| Get real Cthullhu...what planet are you on? I hear a rape in process virtually every week outside my appartment followed by screaming and the woman running for her life...This is a male-dominated society- totally. The men know they can get away with anything when it comes to women. |
I guess I'm from the planet where I didn't hear a rape outside my window every week while living in Korea for 5 years, not that I'm about to make any claims that rape isn't a problem in Korea based on that flimsy evidence. I'm also from the planet that doesn't make sweeping generalizations about rape in Korea based on the sounds outside my bedroom window.
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| If you think that prostitution is anything less than rampant here, I have some information for you...you know those 2 spinning poles you see at night outside shops on virtually every street corner, every 100 yards? its not because every adjosshi wants a haircut at 3am. |
And back in the West the yellow pages advertising escort services aren't about finding a companion for friendly conversation. Prostitution is "hidden" everywhere.
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| If Korea is really the paradise you see through your rose-tinted sunny's, why is it that there is a virtual stampede with multiple trampled victims at every Immigration fair? |
I never said Korea was a paradise. If you'd have read my post more carefully you'd have noticed my post didn't even make any positive statements about Korea--a few negative ones in fact. My post was only commenting on the unsubstantiated claims you were making. And regarding immigration, ever hear of giving children a better education? Oddly enough that's what many Korean emigrants have told me was the reason they went abroad. I have yet to hear of a Korean leaving Korea because of a fear of being raped or rampant prostitution.
However, you did say Korean society=hell.
Prove it. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 8:52 am Post subject: |
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You've just edited your reply... and deleted the homophobic bile you spouted about gays..
Luckily for you, probably nobody read it in time.
You've also edited out several basic errors and statements out of your original reply that shot your feet off.
L |
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Cthulhu
Joined: 02 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 9:13 am Post subject: |
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| You've just edited your reply... and deleted the homophobic bile you spouted about gays.. |
What in god's name are you talking about? That's pretty low.
| Quote: |
You've also edited out several basic errors and statements out of your original reply that shot your feet off.
L |
If I'd have done that you'd have seen Edited by Cthulhu in small type. Since my original post doesn't have it I think it's safe to say that you responded to what I typed. Nice try.
You are definitely not the poster I thought you were--it's pretty sad you have to resort to that kind of nasty, baseless attack. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 9:24 am Post subject: |
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But I'll respond to your edited version as its what other posters will see, (hopefully without involuntarilly being signed out this time before I could press "submit")
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| I was pointing out the shadiness of some of the stats you provided |
Which ones exactly, and why? if you're referring to prostitution, I suppose I'll have to repeat myself.
The reason there are no official govt statistics for prostitution because it is Illegal in korea. However, there are statistics from surveys carried out by civic/women's groups. Credible enough for you? These are available on the Asian Monitor Research Centre website, an NGO, and the same stats you objected to because they were quoted by "gays with no credibility".
I post the link (again):
http://www.amrc.org.hk/Arch/3309.htm
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| You start comparing rape stats with the West (something I never did in my post), then admit to the West having higher stats. And yet you decide that your opinions and anecdodatal evidence trumps the stats. |
Not just my opinions and "anecdotal evidence". I share them with Korean women working with this social problem..read the link again. I think i'll give their opinions more credence than a wehguk who lived an obviously sheltered 5 year holiday here, presumably propping up the bar in Itaewon.
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| not that I'm about to make any claims that rape isn't a problem in Korea |
good, you're coming round..
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| the West the yellow pages advertising escort services aren't about finding a companion for friendly conversation. Prostitution is "hidden" everywhere. |
Prove it. I want official verified government statistics conducted with impartial international observers using sattelite tracking equipmant. Or, I'll just have to take your opinion as a mass generalisation, with a "Large pinch of salt".
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| my post didn't even make any positive statements about Korea--a few negative ones in fact. |
So you agree with me that korean society is hell? Good.
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| I have yet to hear of a Korean leaving Korea because of a fear of being raped or rampant prostitution. |
My former girlfriend fled Korea to escape her ex husband who raped, beat and stabbed her. He had regularly used prostitutes while still with her, so I suppose you could say she was fleeing the rampant Korean male habit of cheating on their wives with prostitutes.
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| However, you did say Korean society=hell. Prove it. |
Have you heard of purposeful overstatement to make a point? Can you distinguish literal statements from rhetorical? |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Cthulhu wrote: |
| Quote: |
| You've just edited your reply... and deleted the homophobic bile you spouted about gays.. |
What in god's name are you talking about? That's pretty low.
| Quote: |
You've also edited out several basic errors and statements out of your original reply that shot your feet off.
L |
If I'd have done that you'd have seen Edited by Cthulhu in small type. Since my original post doesn't have it I think it's safe to say that you responded to what I typed. Nice try.
You are definitely not the poster I thought you were--it's pretty sad you have to resort to that kind of nasty, baseless attack. |
haha You're cracking me up here.!! ithink most posters on here realise that "edited by cthullhu" in small type often appears after not one, but several cowardly revisions of the original text. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| A western woman could report a guy winking at her to the police and have him sued for a fortune as sexual harrassment. Or she could decide he was no good as a one night stand, sue him for rape, pocket a fortune, and live with an appealing victimhood mentality ever after. Especially if the guy was famous. |
Is this a good thing??  |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 9:34 am Post subject: |
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| mithridates wrote: |
| Quote: |
| A western woman could report a guy winking at her to the police and have him sued for a fortune as sexual harrassment. Or she could decide he was no good as a one night stand, sue him for rape, pocket a fortune, and live with an appealing victimhood mentality ever after. Especially if the guy was famous. |
Is this a good thing?? |
No. But I'm just illustrating the point that attitudes in the west are more open to rape and prostitution than in Korea. Women there aren't afraid to report it to the police. here they are,...which is why researchers here have estimated that the figures for reported rape in Korea represent only about 2% of actual cases. Which would put the rate here in front of many western nations- which almost seem to encourage women to make rape accusations and file reports. |
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