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New immigration rules for university positions?
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Joe Bradley



Joined: 05 May 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 12:52 am    Post subject: New immigration rules for university positions? Reply with quote

Has anyone heard of changes in immigration policy regarding the hiring of instructors at university level? On Friday I was told by a friend at one Busan university that teachers applying for any university position in Korea must now be able to prove the following:

Bachelor's degree holders: 5 years' teaching experience at university level

Master's degree holders: 2 years' experience at university level

It may be that the rule has been brought in as a result of the recent scandal involving people with fake PhDs. If it's true, then it will have serious repercussions for many universities, as there simply aren't enough people applying for university positions with the above combinations of degrees and experience.

This rule apparently only applies to the hiring of new teachers, and not to the renewals of contracts of existing university teachers.

Sorry to be an alarmist here, but has anyone else heard of this new policy?
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chronicpride



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If there is such a thing, the strongest enforcement will be as of now, and weaken further on each following day. As with most things around here.
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Zed



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Shakedown Street

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It wouldn't be possible for everyone to have this experience. Everyone does start at zero.
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Ajarn Miguk



Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Location: TDY As Assigned

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 2:21 am    Post subject: Point Reply with quote

Zed wrote:
It wouldn't be possible for everyone to have this experience. Everyone does start at zero.


Your point is...............?
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Zed



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Shakedown Street

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My point is that it would be impossible for this to be a governmental hiring standard. They would not be able to fill the necessary positions with such a standard.
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Derrek



Joined: 15 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drug tests are coming. Just wait.

The teacher busted was found growing weed.

Personally, I don't care.

If they do enforce the above rules, then the salaries of certain individuals who qualify will go up, up, up!

Gonna be tough to find enough people to fill the spots!
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Ajarn Miguk



Joined: 22 Jan 2003
Location: TDY As Assigned

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:30 am    Post subject: Anway Reply with quote

Derrek wrote:
Drug tests are coming. Just wait.

The teacher busted was found growing weed.

Personally, I don't care.

If they do enforce the above rules, then the salaries of certain individuals who qualify will go up, up, up!

Gonna be tough to find enough people to fill the spots!


Yes, that would be a terrible shame if truly qualified and professional teachers had to be paid higher salaries due to a new government standard.

Should this occur and the salaries be raised, one could almost begin to believe that more and more qualified and professional teachers would be inclined to apply for such positions eventually replacing individuals with lesser qualifications willing and happy to work for less.

IMHO, anyway.
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lawyertood



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul, Incheon and the World--working undercover for the MOJ

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drug tests coming, you say? They have arrived, they have arrived.
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Derrek



Joined: 15 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lawyertood wrote:
Drug tests coming, you say? They have arrived, they have arrived.


Hey, tood.. nice to see you on here again....

I wasn't serious about the tests being here yet, but perhaps they are now? Is your Univ. requiring it? Do tell....
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TECO



Joined: 20 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe,

I could see this very well happening at some point but who knows when...

In September I started a new university position here in Taiwan.

I could not beleive the background checks they do on university teachers here in Taiwan.

I had to get my M.A. degree and transcripts notarized by both the Australian and Taiwanese Governments.

The Taiwanese government office in Australia contacted my university to verify my enrollment in the program and that I had graduated.

I also had to prove that I had at least 2 years teaching experience.

Then, the university applied to the Ministry of Higher Education for my teaching license.

All university teachers are given a teaching license or credential (Looks like a diploma with your photograph on it and the name of the university you work at).

As well, university teachers are not on the same kind of Visas / Work Permits as the hogwon teachers.

There are no English teachers with just a B.A. teaching in Taiwanese universities - You must have an Master Degree minimum.

I have been told that the Taiwanese government takes these steps because of the systemic fraud that was occuring and that they wanted to improve the quality of the teachers.

So, yeah, Korea could very well take these steps if it thought that it would improve the situation.
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fondasoape



Joined: 02 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TECO wrote:
I have been told that the Taiwanese government takes these steps because of the systemic fraud that was occuring and that they wanted to improve the quality of the teachers.



did it work?
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canukteacher



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul, Korea

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is the Taiwanese government still refusing to recognize online MA's from accredited universities?

CT
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TECO



Joined: 20 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fondasoape wrote:
did it work?

The Taiwanese government has really cleaned up the system - in terms of academic fraud.

There is basically no way you could use a degree purchased on Kao San Road or use a fake degree that you had made to get a university position.

The reason being is because the TECO (Taipei Economic and Culture Office) contacts your school or has the local government assist them by contacting your school to verify your academic history.
(in my case, I had to pay the Australian Department of Business and Trade to 'verify' my degree, transcripts and mode of study).

Then, the TECO in Sydney approved all of my documents - ie. determined if Taiwan recognized both my university, mode of study and program of study.

Canuckteacher Wrote:
Quote:
Is the Taiwanese government still refusing to recognize online MA's from accredited universities?


The Taiwanese Government refuses to recognize any degree obtained by distance study.

The Taiwanese Government (Ministry of Higher Education) requied me to produce my student visa to prove that I had physically been in Australia studying.

The MOHE also required that I provide them with copies of my passport pages to show that I had not been in Taiwan at the time of study and that I had actually travelled to Australia.

I don't know how you could get hired without having actually studied for your degree, at least for some of it, in residence.

I don't know of any other system in Asia that is as stringent right now in the hiring of foreign university English teachers - Not even Japan!


Last edited by TECO on Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
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desultude



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zed wrote:
It wouldn't be possible for everyone to have this experience. Everyone does start at zero.


Everyone starts at zero somewhere. There are lots of university jobs in China.

Of course, one has to ask why such a rule? I can see individual universities using it, but why immigration?

I have noticed this year more requirements for an M.A. in select subjects. For the positions open in our university, there were hundreds and hundreds of qualified applicants. The qualification requirements are going up because the pool of candidates seems to be increasing.

Personally, for us here with the mandatory experience, this could be good news. But, as it may actually serve to drive wages up, I don't see why immigration would do it.
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Joe Bradley



Joined: 05 May 2003

PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to clarify on my earlier post:

It seems that this is not actually a new policy, but one that has always existed (though not usually enforced). I guess Immigration has now decided to take a tougher line on it because of the recent publicity surrounding bogus degrees. The good news, though, is that the five-year and two-year period of teaching experience required of BA and MA holders, respectively, does not have to have been at university level. As long as degree holders can prove that they've had this amount of actual teaching experience, then they should be OK.
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