Korean Job Discussion Forums

[d503]

I have a couple of handwriting questions.

First one of my kids is a left hander, I am teaching her to hold the pencil as a righty would do it (middle and thumb to the sides index on top) I was wondering if this was the right way for left-handers to write? (isn't there some sort of hook or something)

Cursive writing, do they ever learn it? I'm just curious, I write primarily in cursive, but I know my kids haven't learned it. And if they don't why not?

Has anyone found the old school lined paper that you had to use in 1st and 2nd grade. Each line is about and inch tall, has a dashed line through the middle, and there is a fourth line below the base line for "drop down letters." I want it for a group of five year olds who I have to practice letter writing with, the Notebooks they have now are too small for them (lines are only about 1-1.5cm tall.)

[David76]

The technique is no different than for right-handers. (Are you teaching them how to do it too?) The hook is a matter of personal preference, just as it presumably is for right-handers.

As far as I can tell, cursive is not something they are familiar with. It would add another layer to Western writing they would have to deal with, so I have not attempted to teach it. I'm not familiar with the stylistic development of the Korean script, but imagine how much more difficult it would be for you if you were studying Chinese or Japanese (Yes, I know we use an alphabet) and on top of all the other things to keep track of, were expected to be able to handle the different writing styles -- yikes! I think it is best to keep things simple unless the students are very advanced.

Since we're on the topic of writing. . .
I have been printing in capital letters in class. I am used to writing in cursive and now find printing in lower-case letters cumbersome as I have not done so since elementary school. Korean students sometimes seem slightly thrown off by this. Has anyone else experienced such?

[d503]

Thanks I'm teaching the right handers as well, but I am right handed so I know how to do that.

Also I don't know about your students, I would tack it up to all upper-case being somewhat novel. But if I ever see people writing in all upper-case, I just assume the person is yelling or excited in their writing.

[Wisco Kid]

WHY ON EARTH WOULD YOU TEACH YOUR KIDS TO WRITE IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS! OF COURSE THEY WILL REACT STRANGELY TO IT. THEY SHOULD. BECAUSE IT IS NOT CORRECT STANDARD ENGLISH. JUST TAKE THE TIME TO PRINT THE LOWER CASE LETTERS THE CORRECT WAY.

Also, you should be glad your kids don't write in cursive. It is hard enough just being able to dicipher their regular writing. I taught some kids in Taiwan once who had learned cursive, and that's all they ever wrote

The only time I ever write in cursive is when I sign my name, and that can't even really be considered writing.

[Scott in HK]

I am left-handed and hold my pen the way most right-handed people do....if you don't hook...and i don't...then you have to turn the paper you are writing on on an angle...or you will get a slant to your writing...teachers hated the slant...so they taught me to turn the paper to compensate for the slant...

[peppermint]

I had a class of kids that really wanted to learn how to write cursive, but in general it;s not taught here. I wrote on the board in cursive my first day and a businessman asked me what language it was!

I believe www.enchantedlearning.com has lined paper in a couple of sizes, and they may even have practice sheets for individual letters. I use the blanks to teach my students to print.

[d503]

Hey thanks for the site, that was what I was looking for. I was getting annoyed with trying to get little five year olds to make tiny letters--that site will help a lot.

Also I have a class of kids who want to learn to "sign their names in English." They think my signature is really cool , so I was thinking of teaching them one day and was just curious if they ever learn it. However they know I am a stickler for correct letter formation, so I am wondering how many will actually take up cursive--it is far harder to keep legible.

[desultude]

http://www.abcteach.com/DNealian/cursivearrow.htm

You can find lined exercise pages here for cursive writing- with the double lines and the sample letter at the beginning of each line.

The kids love it when I give it to them at camp- it is new to them, and most of them have been in hogwons for years. I also give it to my university students- they also love it, and have never learned how to write in cursive.

[David76]

Wisco Kid, who is teaching students to write in all capital letters? I am not teaching writing, they already know how to do that.

Seems like at least some of you do not limit "netiquette" (sp?) to the internet and apply it to other areas such as the classroom. Do you think South Korean students would also interpret writing in capital letters as shouting?

Cursive is "correct standard English," is it not? Yet we are not using it in the classroom. More power to you if you are good at printing your letters in lower-case (been teaching English a looooong time? ), but I just can't give up cursive (other than when teaching English or when addressing an envelope or filling out a form). Cursive worked well for me when I was a student, and I have not stopped writing since I finished schoool, so I have not stopped using cursive. Did it take a lot of effort on your part to go back to "proper" printing? Maybe I will give it a try, but it seems so strange to revert to a way of writing I left behind when I was 7 to 8 years old.

[schwa]

I was drilled on cursive waay back when in elementary school & never did master cursive capitals. Later in life I created my own 'hand' which is a mix of cursive & printed letters & its both quick & legible. Problem with pure cursive is people get sloppy with it & deciphering it is an exercise in graphology & guesswork. Not conducive to clear communication. Not unlike quick handwritten han-geul that takes shortcuts & poses similar problems.

With upper & lower case letters, english already presents 2 distinct 'alphabets.' Why muddy the water further with 2 more? Adult Koreans who majored in english show a nice clear style of printing -- I say call it done. Most everyone types most of their 'writing' anymore anyway.

[matthewwoodford]

We call this joined up writing where I come from and everyone learns it when they're about 6. You mean....you guys can't do it, seriously?!

[d503]

First let me put in an age and country disclaimer.

In the US cursive is being de-emphasized. Most of my friends had stopped using cursive by 5th grade, I was an odd one who still wrote in it (thanks to private schooling). So it is really not uncommon for people to not know how to do it. Also internet typing is not the soul place they use all capitals for stress. This is also standard in print media (a lot of headlines will be in all upper-case) That being said I think cursive should be taught at some point, if anything just so that they can sign their name.

Also I don't normally write in "standard" cursive, in college the only time I ever hand wrote was for my Russian classes and it changed my English script some. Also when I write for Koreans I print, and my printing style is slightly warped--I often write uppercase letters small size, this is a habit I picked up in math class, where n and r, + and t, are just all too confusable. So maybe if you made your uppercase letters small sized it would be less offensive to them.

Thankfully I have lovely board writing, it is just at times a little slow.

[Wisco Kid]

I'm from the US. We started learning cursive in 3rd grade. I used it all through middle school, because it was "more proper". Sometime around high school I stopped using it because I realized that I could write a lot faster if I printed the letters instead (with some letters getting joined). i also just liked the way the letters looked more. The way we were taught cursive everything is overly loopy.

Also, I'm not saying that you shouldn't write in all caps only because it looks like shouting, but it could also look like the writer is 3 years old.
I understand that you are not teaching the students how to write the letters, but it is still setting a bad example. It would be the same if you wrote in all lowercase letters. With 90% of my students, I still have to correct their tendencies to use a lowercase letter to begin a sentence and not use any punctuation.[/b]

[bosintang]

Is "cursive writing" the same as "handwriting"?

Assuming the definition above, I have taught cursive writing as a supplementary activity in a few of my classes. I don't know how important it is anymore, but I don't think it hurts to at least learn how to *read* it, which many students are not able to do.

As for me, whenever I write in my diary or anything to myself, I usually handwrite, because it's a lot faster for me to do so. However, my handwriting is unintelligible, so whenever I'm writing anything anyone else has to read, I have to print. I vaguely recall my little blue grammar book having specific rules when to print or handwrite, but I don't have it with me at the moment so I can't look it up.

[peppermint]

I use cursive whenever I'm writing for an adult English speaker, cause that's just what feels natural to me. Printing feels childish, but it's necessary here.

At the moment I've got a few Christmas cards from home on my desk, and all the little notes inside are written in cursive. One of my co- workers came by to ask me something, looked at one of the cards and asked what language it was!(and yes, the writing was pretty legible)