Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Real Reality]

People's Front of Judea wrote,
"Yet, a Korean friend who teaches at a university here in Seoul was surprised when she heard that foreign professors (guest lecturers, or whatever the label is for non-tenured track foreigner) might not receive the full 4 and a half months. She seems to think it was not up the university policy, rather Korean law. I would be interested to know if what she said was accurate. The point here is she was surprised I wasn't offered the full vacation."

The following article excerpts may provide some light on the issue.

Foreign scholars merit equal status
The foreign professor -- colleague or hired hand?
Foreign professors tend to be treated as hired hands, without academic standing, and lacking the possibility of career advancement or tenure. They must submit to yearly contracts (compensated at a rate only 60 percent of their Korean peers) while walled off from the permanent Korean faculty who benefit from travel, research funding, sabbaticals, etc. Moreover, when hundreds of Korean scholars enjoy such perks at American and other foreign universities, something is obviously amiss.... According to the Samsung Group's chairman, Lee Kun-hee, to succeed globally, Korea must forgo the thought that Korea and being Korean is superior, and foreign specialists must be treated with respect.
by John B. Kotch, JoongAng Ilbo (June 14, 2002)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/14/200206142349223599900090109011.html

Professor Salary (2000 Salary)
South Korea: $5,511 per month
Exchange rate per US$1 used to calculate monthly salary; South Korea: 1,134 won equals US$1
http://www.asiaweek.com/asiaweek/features/salaries/2000/popups/content/21prof.html
South Korea Salaries
http://www.asiaweek.com/asiaweek/features/salaries/2000/popups/content/skor.html

from the E-1 (Professor) Visa regulation
* In the case of a national or a public university, a foreigner is not permitted to be a full-time professor.
http://www.moj.go.kr/immi/08_english/02_business/e_1.html
Source site:
http://www.moj.go.kr/immi/08_english/02_business/service_01.html

Foreigners Experience Difficulties in Living in Korea
"Even though Korea has achieved some degree of globalization in going abroad, it has still a long way to go for globalization in embracing foreigners inward," said foreigners residing in Korea. An official in the International Cooperation Division of Seoul City admitted, "The same complaints regarding visas, transportation, education, and environment are raised every year without being solved, due to the lack of cooperation from government agencies involved and their passive attitudes."
http://english.donga.com/srv/service.php3?biid=2004070522448

For Housing Rentals, Foreigners Easy Victims
Foreign residents in Seoul are preferred over any Korean tenant by their landlords because they are paying several times as much as what Koreans are paying for their rent, realtors and industry sources say.
By Byun Duk-kun, Korea Times (August 28, 2003)
http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/nation/200308/kt2003082818233111970.htm

"No chair for foreigner" GM Daewoo head told
He may be the president of GM Daewoo, but he is still an outsider in the Korean car industry. The Korea Automobile Manufacturers Association has decided that Nick Reilly, a Briton, cannot be the new chairman of the organization. The automobile association's rule states that only Koreans can lead the industry grouping. Mr. Reilly has thus stepped aside to allow his vice president, Lee Young-kook, to head the organization. An official at the Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association said it was unthinkable in a global era to have a regulation that denies a foreigner chairmanship. He added that Carlos Ghosn, Nissan Motor president, could head the Japanese association.
by Kim Tae-jin and Lee Ho-jeong, JoongAng Daily (January 18, 2005)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200501/17/200501172228551609900090509051.html

[People's Front of Judea]

Hello there Real Reality. Informative info, as usual. I have actually read this information when you previously posted it. Yes, double standards do apply moreso than not here in sunny Korea!

Over the past few years, most job posts I have seen for "uni" work in Korea seem to offer a pittance for those with a bachelors and teaching experience, masters, and even a PhD. In Japan and Hong Kong, some foreign uni teachers with a masters degree and some published work receive salaries equivalent to 5 or 6 million won a month, as well as other benefits. That's about on par with small community college salaries in America for ESL professors with a masters and much experience teaching overseas. I don't know about the tenure track for foreignors in Japan or Hong Kong.

Anyway, I have seen maybe 10 posts over the last 3 or 4 years on websites, like Dave's or The Chronicle for Higher Education, that advertise jobs at Korean universities for foreign PhD holders offering a salary of US$5,000 to 6,000 monthly. Some names that come to mind are Ewha Women's University, Korea University, Cheju National University, and maybe 3 others whose names I can't remember.

From time to time, there are positions open to foreign PhD's to teach in some capacity involving English studies where the salary is somewhat more appropriate than what most schools and universities would offer foreign teachers.

If you ever find out if it's a rule or law mandated by the Korean government for foreign professors to receive the full allotted vacation, please let me know. If anyone could find it, it would most likely be you. Thanks for the help and insight.

[J.B. Clamence]

Twelve weeks is good, but it`s not the best. It basically means that you`ll be working for 8 weeks during the breaks. �@If your university doesn`t expect you to work at all during the breaks, then you will get 20 weeks vacation (9 weeks in summer, 11 weeks in winter).�@�@�o�������������������CI`d rather work a few weeks during each break to rack up some extra money (a lot of unis offer overtime for every single hour taught during the breaks), which still affords you lots of vacation time.

[Hanson]

the beaver wrote:

I guess that's true. Seoul Women's University used to guarantee 10 weeks (if I remember aright) but we actually got around 14[/quote]

[TECO]

[sprite]

first, there are two yonsei's--one in seoul and their branch in wonju.

if you are discussing the wonju campus, i could help a little.
not everyone likes the package offered, and that's a matter of personal choice. personally, i liked wonju, and dislike living in cities, so was willing to put up with the less marvellous bits (shared housing).

the deposit was returned for a dozen teachers i knew, including myself.
while i was there, no one worked overtime--we were actually about 2-4 hours under contract. this may have changed, as the uni was desperate to cut corners.
however, teachers were expected to cover when another teacher was ill. this is only fair, and part of being in a work force, but some folks just didn't get it.

the 12 weeks is split. the uni has a 2 month break in summer and in winter. teachers, when i was there, got february holiday, and either june or july.
classes were held through the summer, but not at full schedule--meaning you might work only 6-10 hours a week, for the same pay.

the interview process, when i was hired on, consisted of dr. park, and 2-3 other co-ordinators, all foreigners. while i was working there, they switched to a different system, asking applicants to fill out a questionnaire by email, and then by having a quick q-a with 2 co-ordinators (foreign) just before the meeting with park, head co-ord, and 1 or 2 other co-ords, again, all foreigners.

given that yonsei-wonju has about 30-35 foreign staff, there are bound to be problems and bound to be rumours. i could tell you some good stories, but it would be unethical.

[TECO]

[ajuma]

TECO wrote:

[TECO]

[sprite]

teco--
point the first. note i said that teachers were under contract hours. if you sign a contract to work 24 hours a week, and you only work 21, why on earth should you be paid if you work 22?

second, if you want to pull that sort of 'i don't cover for others without extra payment' in north america, you had better be unionized out the yingyang. part of working with a group entails supporting others when they are unable to complete their workload, just as they will support you. (we are assuming proper management of resources, people, etc.)
failure to do so results in failure of the entire group.

third--micromanage? perhaps you should ask more questions, and make fewer judgements. consider 30 foreigners, all hired to work together, who as a group have minimal language skills--enough to survive, but not enough to carry out complex negotiations. remember that these people are working in a country at every opposite cultural spectrum to their own. without some form of management, you're asking for chaos. given that koreans don't manage the same way westerners do, it's vital to have a buffer zone of mature people who can act as go-betweens.

i can assure you that while i worked at yonsei, the korean management came out with some whopper ideas. without the co-ordinators, those ideas would have been forced onto the staff and several people would likely have quit. in the same way, when staff had problems, rather than 30 people screaming different things at administration, we had a small, unified delegation.

why more than one co-ordinator? that was a decision reached as the department grew from a handful of teachers to be much larger. we could have had only one, but the work load would have meant that person couldn't teach. this would have removed them from the everyday life of the other teachers, resulting in a larger gap.
as it was, each co-ordinator had a specific area of responsability, meaning they never got swamped, and the staff knew exactly who to talk to about different issues.