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Zenpickle
Joined: 06 Jan 2004
Location: Anyang -- Bisan
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 Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:52 am Post subject: |
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| bosintang wrote: |
| Zenpickle wrote: |
bosintang--
Sorry to be OT, but where did you find that ramyeon??? |
I dug it up on a google images search, but apparently the product is a Chinese product trying to pass off as a Korean one. However when I visited China, my search for it ended up futile. Too bad, because I was going to enjoy my vegetarian, animal-loving sister's reaction when I mailed her some.  |
I was thinking along similar lines, along with the handful of people I pointed your avatar to -- send it home and play a trick on people. |
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sparkx
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: thekimchipot.com
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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| buncheon bum wrote: |
yeah , you're all fcked.
that and the sky is falling. |
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[quote="billybrobby"]And as far as getting beat up or killed on the street because of this stuff? That's just cowardly paranoia. |
For the life of me i can't understand reactions like these ones. Do you honestly think that those of us concerned about this issue are paranoid and afraid of "getting beat up?" A group of angry Koreans concerns me about as much as the pimple I found on my ass this morning. It's the principle of the fawking thing man.
| ulsanchris wrote: |
| I think that koreans who know a lot of foreigners will know these "news" stories are a load of rubbish. Its the Koreans who don't or haven't had a lot of exposure to foriegners who will be more likely swayed by these stories |
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| I'm not an English teacher, but I'm of the right age and skin color that most Koreans assume I am. (Most Canadians assume I am, anyways). But honestly, if it weren't for this board, I wouldn't have even known that 'incident' ever ocurred. |
I'd really like to know what type of industry you work in. I am as far from the ESL industry as Pluto is from Mercury and I have been bombarded by questions about this story for the last three days. I mentioned in a different thread that 3 different managers at my office asked me about the story monday morning and since that time at least 7 other employees, none of whom have ever attended a hogwan, have made mention of it. If it was wasn't for reading about here on Dave's, I would have shat my fricken pants after being asked three times in a row "So I heard that foreign english teachers give middle school girls drugs and have sex with them."
Where this thing hit close to home for me was last evening when i was standing in the coffee room and a girl came in whom I chat with quite frequently (not the infamous hogwan/MSN girl). She asked me how my weekend was and I told her that I went to Hongdae on Saturday night. She got this pained expression on her face and looked away from me. I asked her what the problem was and she said "I know that all foreigners go to Hongdae for sex parties right?"
| Blind Willy wrote: |
| Funny thing, my boss asked me about it today. I told him I've just been reading second and third hand reports on the web. He said, and I quote, "Foreigners having sex with Koreans? Who gives a *beep*?" |
Jesus, of course your Hogwan director will play this thing off and act like its nothing. You are their cash crop. If you made your living by employing Australians to teach people how to play the didgeridoo and a massive news story broke reaching the eyes and ears of millions upon millions of people in your country which accused 95% of all Australians of being paint huffing necrophiliacs, would you make a big deal about it or play it down to these employees who put food on your table and pay for your childrens education? It kills me those of you that say, "in the real world this thing is a tempest in a teapot...it means nothing." Do you honestly think that the perspective from your hogwan is "real life" here in Korea? I got news for....damn near every Korean in Seoul has heard about this incident either from seeing the documentary, reading the articles or clicking on the links in Naver and whether you want to believe it or not, people HAVE been influenced by it and westerners have every damn right to be pissed off.
This bush league news team took an isolated incident where ONE (1) guy detailed his experiences with Korean girls on the internet and posted pictures of a wet t-shirt contest with a half dozen consenting girls. A month later and suddenly 95% of all white faces walking the street are perverted child molesting drug dealers who frequently attend sex parties in Hongdae for the sole purpose of exploiting poor, unsuspecting Korean girls.
Throughout my whole life i've had zero tolerance for child molesters and sex offenders. I've always been of the mind that anyone, in the right set of circumstances, could commit murder but it takes a twisted, deranged head case to molest a child. Every damn one of them should be castrated with a rusty soup can lid yet here I am, simply because I'm a white 20 something guy living in Seoul, being painted with the same brush as the dregs of society.
Will this be the end of ESL in Korea? Hell no. Will this somehow affect my job in this country? Hell no. Will I be attacked on the street by a mob of angry Korean guys? Not likely and the thought never even crossed my mind. Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| sparkx wrote: |
| For the life of me i can't understand reactions like these ones. Do you honestly think that those of us concerned about this issue are paranoid and afraid of "getting beat up?" A group of angry Koreans concerns me about as much as the pimple I found on my ass this morning. It's the principle of the fawking thing man. |
Exactly. |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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My hagwon has had a couple of new students this week, and parents I've never talked to before have come in to thank me for my teaching.
It seems the media hype over bad foreigners has a flip side:
In a small town reputations are earned quickly, and after two years here, I keep hearing I'm a "good teacher", which to them I guess means I'm one of the 5 percent, a rare commodity in their eyes!
Who else has gotten better treatment these days?
Last edited by VanIslander on Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Merlyn
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Will this be the end of ESL in Korea? Hell no. Will this somehow affect my job in this country? Hell no. Will I be attacked on the street by a mob of angry Korean guys? Not likely and the thought never even crossed my mind. Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
The random adjossi has looked at me and spit on the ground with disgust in his eyes long before this show aired. And other times, they've tried to touch my ***** while taking taxi rides and the list goes on. He's probably glaring at you wondering how he can make his advance. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Merlyn wrote: |
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| Will this be the end of ESL in Korea? Hell no. Will this somehow affect my job in this country? Hell no. Will I be attacked on the street by a mob of angry Korean guys? Not likely and the thought never even crossed my mind. Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
The random adjossi has looked at me and spit on the ground with disgust in his eyes long before this show aired. And other times, they've tried to touch my ***** while taking taxi rides and the list goes on. He's probably glaring at you wondering how he can make his advance. |
Yeah, you know based on my own anecdotal observations over the past few days, it's not so much that this brouhaha has served to reconfirm for Joe Ajusshi his own prejudices, but that it has planted the seeds of doubt in mothers and young women.
There is a definite agenda here, which only the "Blind" refuse to see. |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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| sparkx wrote: |
| A group of angry Koreans concerns me about as much as the pimple I found on my ass this morning. |
| sparkx wrote: |
| Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
oh, ok. now i see. |
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sparkx
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: thekimchipot.com
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
| oh, ok. now i see. |
What exactly do you see? You extracted a couple small sentences from my post, took them out of context and made some obtuse, enigmatic comment. Maybe you should apply for a job at SBS.
It doesn't take Rene mother f***'n Descartes to understand that my first point was in reference to physical violence and my second was indignation for being unwittingly labeled as something that I myself have always abhorred.
Got it now? |
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riverboy
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
Location: Incheon
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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Spark
You made some valid points and I felt the tension on the subway the other day much to my suprise. There is a negative backlash from the news report. However, it will pass eventually. We have to take this all in context with the prevailing economic situation. We are going to take the heat. Also, the trend to blame the monority is the easiest one to exploit.
I for one am not overly concerned, but like you, I detest the idea of being labelled a child molester as well. There is absolutley nothing we can do about ity except try to educate others that you deal with on a regular basis.
This reminds me of the refer madness campaigns of the thirties and the Geraldo Satanist scare of the ninties. HYPE! let it all pass. |
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SarcasmKills
Joined: 07 Apr 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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My school has gone out of their way to show me that they think those reports are foolish..
I walked it for the first time yesterday and my department head was there to assure me that the whole department is behind me, that they think the report is unfair, that I shouldn't worry, blah blah blah... then he took me out to lunch to talk about how asinine he thought the report was..
Then another prof from the department came up to me later and asked me if i had seen the shows.. I told her I saw one and she said that she and the others in the department were embarassed by that report and they hope that it doesn't tarnish my opinion of Korea..
I was blown away.
So it's not just small towns... |
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trigger123
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Location: TALKING TO STRANGERS, IN A BETTER PLACE
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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sparx wrote:
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| Will this be the end of ESL in Korea? Hell no. Will this somehow affect my job in this country? Hell no. Will I be attacked on the street by a mob of angry Korean guys? Not likely and the thought never even crossed my mind. Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
*stands up and applauds*
so true... i wish that as a member of one of the ethnic minorities in korea, (such as caucasians, be they ESL'ers, sparx or otherwise, south east asians and others), had a voice in the public arena to respond to the sort of rubbish we have seen int he last few weeks.
to dispel these stereotypes requires a real effort in the media, and has to be taken seriously.
if the only thing you heard about little green men from the planet zog was that they are gain entry to your country illegally, preyed on your women and children and sold drugs, what would you make of it? and because you had no other representation of those little green men from the planet zog, this idea would stick... and be passed on... and on...
but are we going to get beaten up? no. but do people look at us differently because of this programme? maybe. and can we do anything about it? i hope we do.
surely its time we did something and stopped posting ourselves silly? |
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sparkx
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: thekimchipot.com
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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A formal response to these stories should be well thought out though.
An emotionally charged protest would be dumbest thing one could ever do. Protesting against Koreans in Korea is like fighting a pitbull with your hands tied behind your back using only your teeth. IMO, the only thing that would ever work would be a newspaper story interviewing a select number of teachers (a few of whom are married to Koreans) chalked full of cheezy, sentimental garbage the likes of which would make Tammy Fey Baker cringe.
Half of the story should detail how the interviewee has been in Korea for X number of years and during that time has been showered by kindness and generosity. He/she has made dozens of great friends and constantly raves about how wonderful and hospitable Koreans are to people back home.
"this latest wave of anti-foreigner rhetoric has left me heavy hearted though. I read lies about how most foreigners participate in unethical acts and take advantage of their role as educator. In all my 5 years here, I have never met a teacher like the ones depicted in this broadcast.
I worry that some Koreans will actually believe what they have read and will start judging me based on these unqualified claims. I am worried that this will have a detrimental affect on me and when I go back to my home country, I will speak negatively about Korea instead of positively like I always have hiterto..."
Interviewee breaks down cyrying
"Why god??...why??? What have I ever done except teach hundreds of koreans the gift of English?? Oh. Why god???
Begins sobbing and pounding his/her hand on the desk
Ok maybe not that last part but you get my drift here... |
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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003
Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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| trigger123 wrote: |
sparx wrote:
| Quote: |
| Will this be the end of ESL in Korea? Hell no. Will this somehow affect my job in this country? Hell no. Will I be attacked on the street by a mob of angry Korean guys? Not likely and the thought never even crossed my mind. Will I get on a bus after work and have random adjossi's quietly glaring at me thinking "look at that child molesting pervert?".... this is what disturbs me most. |
*stands up and applauds*
so true... i wish that as a member of one of the ethnic minorities in korea, (such as caucasians, be they ESL'ers, sparx or otherwise, south east asians and others), had a voice in the public arena to respond to the sort of rubbish we have seen int he last few weeks.
to dispel these stereotypes requires a real effort in the media, and has to be taken seriously.
if the only thing you heard about little green men from the planet zog was that they are gain entry to your country illegally, preyed on your women and children and sold drugs, what would you make of it? and because you had no other representation of those little green men from the planet zog, this idea would stick... and be passed on... and on...
but are we going to get beaten up? no. but do people look at us differently because of this programme? maybe. and can we do anything about it? i hope we do.
surely its time we did something and stopped posting ourselves silly? |
I agree with Trigger and Sparx. Good points.
Thing is.....Can you remember the time those two girls got run over by the US tank? That was a scary month. It was the only time in Korea I heard random groups of guys mutter, "Miguk chiro!" as I was walking past them (of course the fact that I'm actually Irish, not American, was funny).
Point is, that anti-foreigner phase passed. It became all rosey in the garden again.
Yes I'm pissed off that Korean media has tarred me with the pervert brush but now is after the fact. Once the program is airred there is nothing you can do about it.
So what to do?
Demo? Too Korean-stylee
Leave? Can't. My future is here thanks to my lovely wife to be. As for those not attached....Vote with your feet. Go to Japan , Taiwan, China etc.... Those countries aren't as insecure as Korea.
Man, Koreans are like teenagers. Moody and volatile. Sometimes the best thing you can do is ignore them. |
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billybrobby
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| sparkx wrote: |
| billybrobby wrote: |
| oh, ok. now i see. |
What exactly do you see? You extracted a couple small sentences from my post, took them out of context and made some obtuse, enigmatic comment. Maybe you should apply for a job at SBS. |
hehehe, yeah that was pretty devious. do you think they're hiring?
but my original point was that people who are afraid that its gonna get really violent or deadly are overreacting. I see that you're not afraid of this, but I've read some but posts that were leaning in that direction. I recall somebody bringing up a soldier that was killed in the wake of the 2 dead schoolgirls incident. i just don't think it's warranted
As far as what you are concerned with, sparkx, I agree, it is terribly frustrating being pre-judged as some kind of molester. but koreans have so many pre-conceptions of foreigners, and they are so fragile (because they haven't had any actual deep interaction with foreigners to back them up). So I'm not too terribly worried about what some stranger thinks. And these news reports aren't gonna change my Korean friends' opinons of me. I agree with you about the situation, sparkx, I just don't feel the same sense of indignation. |
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Merlyn
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Sometimes the best thing you can do is ignore them. |
Speaking of ignoring. Yesterday I went to my neighboring dry cleaner. I usually go there and the woman is quite fast, and nice, although she clearly ripped me off the first time I went. But anyways, yesterday I walked into the small shop and she wasn't there, or at least I couldn't see her. However, the back door leading to her small apt. was slid half open. An adjossi was cooking something about 8 feet away on his frying pan. I said "Hello". There was no response and he continued cooking. I said "Anihasyeo". He muttered to himself and continued cooking. I again said "Hello", and he refused to acknowledge my presence. So I just stood there with my bag of clothes for another 2 minutes. Maybe, he was busy. Still no answer, despite the fact I continued to make rustling noises to remind him there was someone waiting. Then I hear someone waking up in the same room, probably the ajumma, and he did not even mention I was there. So I said, screw this, and went to the next place down the street. They would have made about 20 000 won for all the clothes I was bringing. I'm sure the first "Hello" set this guy in motion. |
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