Korean Job Discussion Forums

[joe_doufu]

Just reading thaitom's post it's very interesting how people interpreted the boss's e-mail. While by and large it seemed like a mature and constructive e-mail, a few teachers replied "He's a sleazeball, screw him!" and the like.

It makes me think that the bad reputation of hagwon owners is largely a self-fulfilling prophecy. The guys who wrote those comments clearly buy into the "hagwon owners are the devil" worldview, and if they express the same opinions at their places of work, I think there's no doubt that they alienate their bosses and produce the very effect they imagined in the first place. Those who saw the owner's e-mail for a positive attempt at cross-cultural communication are probably earnest about working together with their own colleagues at school and typically have positive experiences. Your thoughts?

[joe_doufu]

or, am I just stating the obvious?

[Kimchieluver]

I was one who replied negativelly to the post. I have a great working relationship with my director but I did not my first year here. The reason why I said what I said was because the director emailed it to him. Why e-mail it? Probably because he has a sent copy on his computer and can use it as a tool if things go astray. A good director will have a sitdown meeting with the employee and talk one on one. Also the fact that he makes 2.5 times the amount of a Korean teacher shouldn't have been mentioned at all. I think he's laying a guilt trip on the teacher for no reason. Self-fulfilling prophecy? I don't think so.

If you have been here long enough you will know what your boss is like but even then you don't know exactly what they will do. Even though my director treats me like family in the academy, I am still a money maker for him. Once you had your fair share of bad experiences with Korean directors you will learn never to blindly trust your director. Case in point, the director at my first academy kept telling me he was going to get me health insurance. I was sick for three months and could not see a doctor. When he finally got it, about thirty times of me asking, I was three months into my contract and he legally had to get it or pay a fine. I had to pay half of the three month medical coverage for the first three months even though I was never covered. Everytime I would ask him for something he would always smile and say tomorrow. Now that I'm married my wife and I take care of such matters on our own.

[captain kirk]

It's the hierarchical grind that gets on a foreigner's nerves. It's not what we're used to. Once you start buying into it by being a good little underling where's that going to lead; I've seen Korean teachers lined up and berated ritually with their heads hung low. Apparently it's normal and they shrug it off.

For example I've got a manager/supervisor who today told me to stand when the owner of the school appears. Hop up like electrically shocked and shake hands smiling madly. While the owner smiles benignly and shakes my hand. I'm thinking about getting into the swing of things on this but it's weird to me. Meanwhile a Korean teacher is being shafted. Late pay and not the full pay. They used her to start the school up, until they hired foreigners.

I've seen that before, too. I was the first foreigner at a school once. Working with a kyopo and a Korean English teacher. One was promised an apartment. Then management hired two Kiwis and when the Kiwis arrived, the two Korean teachers were given the boot, no matter what they were promised to string them along and get them doing their best to start the school off right. Rally for the cause carrying on in the Korean way of the business being one big family, with the boss the benign patron.

But what you say about a self-fulfilling prophecy, seeing management as shysters and untrustworthy and not worthy of respect. One has to respect their boss. Not just to keep one's job. To keep a good, generally respecting outlook going on, like a postitive vibe. Korea, though, is big on appearances and nobody minds lying to get what they want. Or switching things around, like what happened to the two loyal Korean teachers. There's a lot going on behind the show of appearances, and it's true a self-fulfilling prophecy doesn't help, tending to make things fall apart.

Oh, here's the school owner, pardon me while I close and leap to attention and smile madly.... Apparently it's the relationship with one's boss that's so important. But what if preserving the relationship, going gung-ho on that, means making concessions. Getting into selfless for the good of the cause mode. The cause is making money for the boss, and he's one's boss, not one's fake father. The whole hierarchy thing seems to be begging one to throw away their identity. So you get the worst case scenario seers with their negative self-fulfilling prophecies protecting themselves, perhaps neurotically.

[Ya-ta Boy]

I think it was Grotto who mentioned on another thread something to the effect of:

If you go looking for trouble, you will find it.

That fits this thread quite well.

[Tiny_Tibbo]

You know I was thinking the same thing today. Like would I be responding to my boss the way I do if I hadn't read these forums before I came here.
I really enjoyed reading that letter. I like it when i'm spoken to that way at work. but I think alot has to do with tone of voice. I think i'm used to bosses talking as a "we". so once in a while when I get the "you" scoldings I usully react the way people do here on the board. Usually with the "this is what they talk about on dave's" voice in the back of my head as i'm being accused of weird things.
And I do believe that after reading this forum I have to be careful to not let my negitive perceptions manifest in times of conflict because I have seen it happen. or maybe its the PMS talkin...lol
However, its funny that this post is here...because that was one thing i was meditating on my cab ride home......cool

[sheba]

Same with me...

After all the negative things I have heard about teaching here, I am just waiting for something to happen - I just cant seem to drop the paranoia! Ive been drilling the staff about tax, insurance, expenses, and pay... they all know I how Im feeling about the situation and I feel really bad because so far they have been absolutely great!

I know I have to be aware of whats going on around me, but I came into my job expecting something bad to happen! Thats not a good thing!

[Grotto]

If your boss is upfront with you(sending an email isnt really being upfront)
Signed you up for health care and pension without trying to scam out of it. Pays on time and pays you overtime when you work it then and doesnt try to get you to do things that arent in the contract thenI respect my boss.

When I am lied to, expected to donate my time outside of the contracted hours or taken for granted then I stop respecting my boss.

ESL jobs in Asia? Thousands upon thousands.
Good ESL teachers in Asia? Many but not near enough.

Getting screwed over...take the money and run.

Every person that I know who gave notice got screwed. Every single one. Good boss, bad boss they will both screw you. The only difference is the good boss is gentle and doesnt rape you totally.

[jajdude]

[jajdude]

[joe_doufu]

[captain kirk]

Well, J, if the boss refuses to learn how to handle a Westerner the way Westerners are used to being treated/respected that's as much of a pity as a foreigner who refuses to learn how to pander to a Korean boss (the way the boss, in Korea, deserves to be pandered to).

No sense in a standoff. Like violence, it's just stupid.

[Kimchieluver]

In the contract it usually says furnished apartment, you would have to be an idiot to sign with an unfurnished apartment. Agreeing to a 15 minute meeting, holy smokes Joe, that is a big sacrifice.
I'm not saying one should automatically resent or be suspicious of his boss, just don't trust them blindly.

Oh, and Joe, you might want to wait until you have been here two or three months for the honeymonn to wear off. You might have a different perspective of things. Kudos if you don't but wait and see.

I will not argue further because you haven't even got you first paycheck yet. You don't really have the experience to take the moral highground here.

[jajdude]

[tomato]