| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Gwangjuboy
Joined: 08 Jul 2003
Location: England
|
 Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 7:48 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| What racist about it? Supply and demand dictates where the work goes. The only "sinister" things at work here are basic economic principles. It's unfortunate if you happen to be from Northern Ireland, Wales or Scotland, but crying racism is not remotely appropriate. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
sundubuman
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
wangja wrote
Only here old chap, only here.
FWIW, my (Korean) wife is in USA right now, and taking some free ESL advanced classes. She told me that they are trying to tell her that she pronounces words like better, butter etc wrongly and that they should be spoken as "beddah" and "buddah". I said, no worries, my love, we can put that right again when you come home.
The desire for an American accent here is hardly surprising, given history (2,000,000 plus Koreans have moved to the states in the last 30 years)
Let me point out that there really isn't such a thing as "an American accent" A few years ago, I was doing some recording for a publisher and brought a friend of mine to help out (she is from Mississippi). After listening to the tape, the manager complained that he only wanted American accents. I told him Mississippi was part of America. He was confused.
But honestly, if I were running a hagwon, I'd want the most standard English possible to be taught, which like it or not, is middle-American. It's a business thing. If the mothers of your students are hoping that their kid is going to attend an Ivy League school and may have to take the SAT, GRE, or Toefl......
well.....it ain't no rocket science.
It looks like prejudice, but in reality it's only product selection. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Freezer Burn
Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Busan
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Gwangjuboy wrote: |
| What racist about it? Supply and demand dictates where the work goes. The only "sinister" things at work here are basic economic principles. It's unfortunate if you happen to be from Northern Ireland, Wales or Scotland, but crying racism is not remotely appropriate. |
Bullsh*t, it is racist and its not just Northern Ireland, Wales or Scotland either its Australia and New Zealand as well.
Disregarding a person for a job the way most recruiters in Seoul do, just because we dont have an North American accent is the same as disregarding a black person because the parents are scared of black people.
We wont deny a qualified Korean worker a job in Australia or NZ if they are eligible for a working visa and qualified for the job, because they have a bloody accent.
If we can do the job and we have the right qualifications pertaining to the regulations set by the government, i.e from a native speaking country, degree etc... recruiters shouldnt blankly deny an applicant just because of there passport.
They wont even return an email to let you know that your application hasnt been put through.
Its all about suply and demand, my A$$, its insulting, it says that people with a North American acccent are more capable of teaching ESL than someone who doesnt.
You only have to have a conversation with some NA's (because they are the majority here) to see that some are total freaks, but got a job because of this magical accent they have.
Last edited by Freezer Burn on Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Agreed. And were I a hagwon owner (God forbid, even running a pub would be a better job) I would follow the herd and gear the business towards the market as it appeared - would-be Americans.
My point is, and I'm not that wound up about it, is that outside US, US English is less common than non-US English. But again, it matters not.
Also, i agree with Gwangjuboy that this is nothing to do with racism. (Jeeeez, that's gonna be blamed for the WC having the wrong toilet tissue soon). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Wangja wrote: |
FWIW, my (Korean) wife is in USA right now, and taking some free ESL advanced classes. She told me that they are trying to tell her that she pronounces words like better, butter etc wrongly and that they should be spoken as "beddah" and "buddah". I said, no worries, my love, we can put that right again when you come home.  |
I know you're making a point about the aspiration of the "tt" in British vs the "dd" sound in American english, but let me point out one thing.
In America, there is a letter we use called R |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 9:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, I saw that in the Rockford Files a while back. I am not bitching (female dogging!!!! ) about pronunciation differences, but when I hear "butter" with an American accent I see "buddah".
Should "Buddy" be pronounced "Butty" in UK? Is that where open sandwiches came from? Is the "Butty" how Buddy is written? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keithinkorea
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| MissT wrote: |
| Quote: |
| When a job asks for someone who is a Canadian what flavour of Canuck do they want? Do they want there students to say 'a boot' rather than 'about' in that case they shoudl say we only want people with a weird NW canada accent. |
You must be kidding.  You obviously have never met a Canadian or know what you are talking about. Enough said. 
Cheers,
MissT. |
No I obviously have not met a single Canadian ever. I've only lived in Korea for 3 and a bit years so it would be unlikely I'd ever have run into a Candian
Some Canadians do say 'aboot' it is subtle and they aren't even conscious of it but it is true. I've met several from the NE who do say this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Wangja wrote: |
Yeah, I saw that in the Rockford Files a while back. I am not *beep* (female dogging!!!! ) about pronunciation differences, but when I hear "butter" with an American accent I see "buddah".
Should "Buddy" be pronounced "Butty" in UK? Is that where open sandwiches came from? Is the "Butty" how Buddy is written? |
I mean to say that neither the English "buttah" or American "budder" are pronounced as written. So what's the big deal? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| There isn't. I am just saying how the sound when written looks to me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ed4444
Joined: 12 Oct 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 1:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
I am assuming you are all aware that accent definition is a subjective thing. That means accents and slang from your own region will never sound strong to you.
After living abroad for a while your accent will eventually be slightly neutralised by exposure to International variation no matter where you are from.
Personally I don't like to hear Koreans speak with perfect American accents. It is much nicer to hear a Korean speaking English correctly while still having a mild Korean-English accent to show their nationality. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hari seldon
Joined: 05 Dec 2004
Location: Incheon
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:09 am Post subject: |
|
|
| There are regional accents and some differences in jargon, (like Texans saying "y'all" and "howdy" instead of "you guys" and "hello" )but I've travelled to 48 states in the U.S. and had virtually no problem communicating with people. On the other hand, I've seen a few U.K. films that supplied (indispensable) subtitles for c o c k n e y and other regional dialects...but then I suspect that the vast majority of U.K. university grads are capable of speaking standard English. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MissT
Joined: 06 Apr 2005
Location: Korea
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 6:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
No I obviously have not met a single Canadian ever. I've only lived in Korea for 3 and a bit years so it would be unlikely I'd ever have run into a Canadian Wink
Some Canadians do say 'aboot' it is subtle and they aren't even conscious of it but it is true. I've met several from the NE who do say this. |
Well I am Canadian, and I have never heard ANYONE say that. I also just noticed that you said the location of these people is from NE Canada. So my apologies since this comment was your real experiences with Canadians (the very few NE Canadians I have ever run into in western Canada have lived here for awhile, so I suppose their 'accent' isn't noticeable). FYI The majority of us speak using the Heartland Dialect of Canadian English. "It is spoken from Ontario westward to the Pacific Ocean. Its greatest similarity is to the dialect of English spoken in the northwestern part of the United States (Sampson, 2005, p.81)." 
Cheers,
MissT. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keithinkorea
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 6:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MissT wrote: |
| Quote: |
No I obviously have not met a single Canadian ever. I've only lived in Korea for 3 and a bit years so it would be unlikely I'd ever have run into a Canadian Wink
Some Canadians do say 'aboot' it is subtle and they aren't even conscious of it but it is true. I've met several from the NE who do say this. |
Well I am Canadian, and I have never heard ANYONE say that. I also just noticed that you said the location of these people is from NE Canada. So my apologies since this comment was your real experiences with Canadians (the very few NE Canadians I have ever run into in western Canada have lived here for awhile, so I suppose their 'accent' isn't noticeable). FYI The majority of us speak using the Heartland Dialect of Canadian English. "It is spoken from Ontario westward to the Pacific Ocean. Its greatest similarity is to the dialect of English spoken in the northwestern part of the United States (Sampson, 2005, p.81)."
Cheers,
MissT. |
No problem Misst It's not common, most Canadians -accent wise- speak with the NW US accent in my experience. I believe it is in the NE of Canada that some speak with the strange 'aboot' thing, it's not just a southpark taking the p thing, I think the very few Canucks with this weird habit were from Newfoundland.
FYI. Some scots say 'aboot' too, as in 'there's moose loose aboot this hoose'! in English this would translate as 'there's a mouse loose about this house' they don't have moose in Scotland. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
saharzie
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 8:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Why is anyone surprised at the stupidity and ignorance of the recruiter. He supposes there is one type of Irish accent where there are about six. Someone from the south of Dublin would have a clearer accent than many from Newcastle or Liverpool, or anywhere in England. For years the BBC used Irish news readers as they were supposed to have better diction. Not that some retarded Korean would know that... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hwajangsil Ajumma
Joined: 02 May 2005
Location: On my knees in the stall
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 8:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
Good point. How would most Koreans know one accent from the other?
Newsreaders in the UK have included Peter Sissons (Liverpudlian), Huw Edwards (Welsh), Dermot Murnaghan (Northern Irish) and of course the legendary Trevor MacDonald (born in Trinidad). All of whom have excellent, clear and precise diction, but would have a snowflake's chance in hell of getting an ESL job in Korea.
Luckily for me, I just get Jeeves to do everything for me, including, dear boy, spreading the "buttah" on me crumpets. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
