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Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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| What should plokiju do? |
| It doesn't sound that bad |
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14% |
[ 3 ] |
| Get outta there |
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52% |
[ 11 ] |
| Look around and see what other places I can find |
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33% |
[ 7 ] |
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| Total Votes : 21 |
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shifty
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:16 am Post subject: |
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No doubt, walk away.
Ignore those that question an ethical "you signed a contract" stuff.
Did yr contract even hint that monies would be withheld for a security deposit? I'll bet it didn't. And that's just for starters.
However, you should consider that the release letter may not be easily forthcoming. Also, the next job you take in Korea (I'm assuming) might as well be not so great. And then you'll feel the onus is on you , even though it might very easily be two duds in a row.
You could try changing yr psychological approach, in order to relax between sessions. The schedule's tough, but doable, if you're getting the right bucks.
I think you should confide to yr director, that you 're feeling a lot of stress, but that you're determined. That you came to Korea for the money and the deposit thing is rankling you. This should precipitate a crisis with you coming up trumps. |
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margaret

Joined: 14 Oct 2003
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:21 am Post subject: |
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You are fullfilling your contract by giving notice and repaying airfare. There's no reason to make yourself unhappy to fullfill it by staying for the full year. Will you be looking for another job in Korea?
Margaret |
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just because

Joined: 01 Aug 2003 Location: Changwon - 4964
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:41 am Post subject: |
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| plokiju wrote: |
| They have also taken 200,000 out of my first 3 paycheques as a deposit to cover utilities for the 2 months after I leave. Why do they need 600,000 for 2 months? That seems obscene to me |
That is ridiculous....I don't pay that in a year for electricity and gas combined..
It is more of a holding deposit to make sure you don't leave or if you destroy the house(as i have seen some foreigners do) they have money to clean it up..
Good luck, money isn't everything but your sanity is... |
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inkoreaforgood
Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Location: Inchon
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:53 am Post subject: |
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| just because wrote: |
| plokiju wrote: |
| They have also taken 200,000 out of my first 3 paycheques as a deposit to cover utilities for the 2 months after I leave. Why do they need 600,000 for 2 months? That seems obscene to me |
That is ridiculous....I don't pay that in a year for electricity and gas combined..
It is more of a holding deposit to make sure you don't leave or if you destroy the house(as i have seen some foreigners do) they have money to clean it up..
Good luck, money isn't everything but your sanity is... |
Not sure if they still do that, but some years ago that 200k a month for 3 months deposit was a typical thing that ECC schools did. You were supposed to get it back at the end of the contract. Thing is, withholding pay in such a manner is illegal in Korea. |
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pegpig

Joined: 10 May 2005
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 3:21 am Post subject: |
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| inkoreaforgood wrote: |
Not sure if they still do that, but some years ago that 200k a month for 3 months deposit was a typical thing that ECC schools did. You were supposed to get it back at the end of the contract. Thing is, withholding pay in such a manner is illegal in Korea. |
My school did that for my 1st 3 months. Are you sure it's illegal if you agree to it and sign a contract stating so, or are you just speculating? |
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inkoreaforgood
Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Location: Inchon
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 5:48 am Post subject: |
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| pegpig wrote: |
| inkoreaforgood wrote: |
Not sure if they still do that, but some years ago that 200k a month for 3 months deposit was a typical thing that ECC schools did. You were supposed to get it back at the end of the contract. Thing is, withholding pay in such a manner is illegal in Korea. |
My school did that for my 1st 3 months. Are you sure it's illegal if you agree to it and sign a contract stating so, or are you just speculating? |
Well. if we signed a contract stating that I get to eat your firstborn child, and occasionally murder one of your family members, what do you think? You can't sign away legal rights, or make contracts that are obviously criminal, they won't stand up in court in the least. Also, that bit about withholding pay I got from my father-in-law, who used to be a local bank president. Happened to me in my first year here, he told me it's not legal at all. |
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pegpig

Joined: 10 May 2005
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| inkoreaforgood wrote: |
Well. if we signed a contract stating that I get to eat your firstborn child, and occasionally murder one of your family members, what do you think? You can't sign away legal rights, or make contracts that are obviously criminal, they won't stand up in court in the least. Also, that bit about withholding pay I got from my father-in-law, who used to be a local bank president. Happened to me in my first year here, he told me it's not legal at all. |
Nice example. Obviously illegal contracts won't stand up in court. I'm just not so sure that deposits are illegal in these situations. Legal contracts with deposits are made all the time. It'd be nice to see a link with the proof other than an "I heard from someone..."
Where is RR? |
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inkoreaforgood
Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Location: Inchon
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| pegpig wrote: |
| inkoreaforgood wrote: |
Well. if we signed a contract stating that I get to eat your firstborn child, and occasionally murder one of your family members, what do you think? You can't sign away legal rights, or make contracts that are obviously criminal, they won't stand up in court in the least. Also, that bit about withholding pay I got from my father-in-law, who used to be a local bank president. Happened to me in my first year here, he told me it's not legal at all. |
Nice example. Obviously illegal contracts won't stand up in court. I'm just not so sure that deposits are illegal in these situations. Legal contracts with deposits are made all the time. It'd be nice to see a link with the proof other than an "I heard from someone..."
Where is RR? |
Hopefully being eaten by crazed gibbons.
It's not a case of "I heard from somebody...". It's the law, and a certain amount of common sense. They are withholding pay. It's possible for them to take a deposit on the apartment, but it's not legal to deduct it from the salary in this manner. If they were to do it in a legal manner, they would request the full 600,000 won upfront, before the teacher steps in the door. In fact, I think that a separate contract (a sublease kind of thing) should have been written up, between the school and the teacher in regards to the apartment. The schools, if they had two wee braincells to rub together to produce one small warm thought, would protect themselves in a better manner. Really, what's to stop a teacher from quitting after one month of work, and destroying an apartment on the last day? The school can't really prove that the teacher lived there, legally, so they'd be up the crick. The teacher would be free, walking away from the job after getting their LOR, and their revenge.
Half-Arsed Planning and Forethought Strikes Again. In theatres everyday, everywhere, just to make you looney.
BTW, good luck, OP. |
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Grotto

Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| For the legality of deposits visit EFL law and read up on illegal business practices in Korea |
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pegpig

Joined: 10 May 2005
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:21 am Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| For the legality of deposits visit EFL law and read up on illegal business practices in Korea |
EFL law doesn't say they're illegal.
The deposits are usually done over 3 months or so to make it a little easier for the new teacher to swallow. I know when I first arrived, that if I had to endure that deduction right off the bat with hardly a pot to piss in and just trying to get settled in, it might have been a bit much.
I'm not defending hogwan owners. We know what they are. But, I am trying to be fair. If I was a hogwan owner I would want to protect myself somewhat also.
Anywho, the op has decided to move on. Good luck. |
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livinginkorea

Joined: 11 Jun 2004 Location: Korea, South of the border
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:19 am Post subject: |
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I would walk away. Give them the notice and wash your hands of it. Maybe it might scare the management into changing your schedule? Either way you are better off.
I know exactly how you feel. It feels like you are working 24/7 and even working on Saturday is crazy. I used to work 50 hours a week and it drove me crazy. Got up at 6 am and finished my class at 10 pm. I soon released that eventhough I was making more money I was constantly tired and have very little free time. I began to get cranky in class and basically took it out on everybody around me (incl. the bosses).
Eventually I walked out because of that and other reasons and I have been so happy since. It's the quality not quantity of life that you have here that ensures your sanity!!
Good luck!! |
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justagirl

Joined: 17 Jan 2003 Location: Cheonan/Portland
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:54 am Post subject: |
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I agree that split-shifts suck. Then again, I also believe that people who sign contracts, or agree to split shifts have put themselves in that position. People on this board constantly warn others against having split shifts.
I went back and read the OP's work hours. It looks like this:
morning: 90 min (1.5 hours)
afternoon: 240 min (4 hours)
That's a total of 5 1/2 hours a day, teaching. Really, for a split shift, that's not too bad. |
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jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 10:33 am Post subject: |
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| Bottom line, I suppose, is if you are happy or not working there? It sounds like not. If you think you can do better, it may be worth trying to do so. |
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andrew

Joined: 30 Jan 2003
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:04 am Post subject: |
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.....
Last edited by andrew on Fri May 01, 2009 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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plokiju

Joined: 15 Mar 2005
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:48 am Post subject: |
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The sad thing is that I did know about the website before I signed. I'd scanned it a little when I'd heard it was going to be a Wonderland school. I didn't think that much of it though since it was a chain school and all. Then I got my contract and prayed that it wasn't the exact same school. But no, exact same school.
I figured though that the management was different and really their story wasn't all that horrific. It's definitely not as bad now as it was for them. I get paid on time and don't ever have to fight for wages. The other teachers are alright. There are adequate materials, etc. I also thought that if it was really as bad as what was written I could just leave. I actually emailed the girl and asked if she ended up making any money. I didn't want to have a horrible experience and come out losing money. I also spoke to one of the current teachers. She told me that I'd be working until 8 maybe once or twice a week. She'd based this on her schedule of course and the boss was behind her the whole time so she wasn't as honest as she could have been about other things. The only thing it said in my contract about the schedule was 110 teaching hours and I couldn't be guaranteed of a schedule of my choosing. Very vague. Nothing about split shifts and it doesn't sound that bad on paper really. Anyways, I just decided to jump headfirst. I probably shouldn't have signed the first contract I was offered and I should've asked better questions. Live and learn, I guess.
So here's the update. I talked to my boss and mentioned that I wanted to resign. He told me he realized my schedule wasn't great but in 2-3 months they were going to reshuffle some things. It didn't make me feel much better. He even told me to endure. Maybe a new location will change things. However, if I stay another month, until the end of September (resign mid-August instead), I don't need to repay the airfare. It's tolerable enough that I can last another 30 days to save $1000+. I think a lot of it really was sleep deprivation. I was seriously only sleeping 4 hours max a night. If I tried to sleep in, I would sleep for about 6. I'm sure I was partially insane for a lot of that time. It's been much better since it's cooled down. If it starts to heat up though, I'm just going to make it an ultimatum. AC or I walk, even if I still had to endure the heat wave. I have felt the whole balance of power shift though. Instead of me feeling like I needed to prove myself as a teacher, now I feel like they are trying to make me feel comfortable. My boss even drove me home yesterday and apologized about my schedule. I feel less pressure.
I've been bringing my iPod to work with me the past few days. It's nice to have that little escape. It makes the days and breaks a bit more bearable. I just wonder how long it will be before I make my second attempt. |
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