Korean Job Discussion Forums

[mind_body_and_seoul]

So yesterday Jenna in Step 3 (8 year-olds) was absent. I asked the rest of the kids why she didn�t come, and some of them joked that she was playing with her boyfriend in the playground. One of the girls thought that she might be home celebrating that her elementary school test was over.

Today when Jenna came to class I asked her where she was yesterday. She said she was home because her mom was hitting her. She showed me a HUGE bruise on her leg, and a few marks on her hands and near her ankles. She demonstrated to me how her mom had hit her repeatedly with a ruler and something else. They tried to draw a pic for me of what the other object was, maybe a wooden spoon (or metal spoon? I dunno). She said her mom hit her so many times that she broke the ruler! WHACK! WHACK! WHACK! I asked her what she had done to make her mom so angry, and she said, �Don�t ask me!� (that�s her response to a lot of questions I ask her, and I always say, �Yes I will ask you!�). So I kept asking her, �What did you do?� but she wouldn�t tell me. The rest of the kids said to me, �Don�t ask her!� and acted like it was no big deal that her mom had beaten her, because she had been bad.

I told the kids that in the USA/England Jenna�s mom would be taken to jail for beating her daughter like that. They told me that in Korea it�s okay for parents to beat their kids if they are bad or get a bad score on a test. They asked me if kids in the USA/England go to jail for hitting their parents. I tried to explain to them that grown ups are supposed to know better. I told them that if a teacher in the USA/England hit a child, they would be fired and might go to jail too. I said to them, �If Chris in Step 1 hit me like this (tiny pat) and I got angry and hit him with a stick (WHACK! WHACK! WHACK!), I would be fired and go to jail. I would be the bad person. They didn�t get it.

I explained to the kids how it�s unfair that well-behaved kids who get a bad test score get hit many times by their teachers, while the bad kids who get a good score don�t get hit (or get hit less). They understood that.

Later I asked April (Jenna�s big sister) what Jenna had done to make her mom so mad. April told me that Jenna�s friend had come round to their house after school to study. Remember when we were 8 years-old and our friends used to come round to our houses to PLAY after school? Well in Korea kids� friends come round to their houses to STUDY. Anyway, the little girls were supposed to be studying, but they were playing. <sarcasm>How dare they? Why would 8 year-old girls who�d been in elementary school all day want to PLAY before going to math academy and English academy?????? </sarcasm> Jenna�s mom told her not to play, but �Jenna didn�t hear my mom� (didn�t listen to her mom?), so her mom got really angry and beat her. WHACK! WHACK! WHACK!

I hate people who think it�s okay to hit little kids!!!!!! They make me sick!!!!!! Jenna�s mom has problems! She probably gets beaten by her husband and that�s why she takes it out on her daughters. I dunno.

Jenny told me that when she was 6 years old (in Korean age, so that would be 4 years old in English age), her dad hit her with a huge stick. I don�t know how often he does this to her. I told her that in the USA/England her dad would go to jail.

It made me wonder how many of the kids get beaten like this at home. Is Jenna's mom the most abusive? Is it even worse for some of the kids? I know a lot of Americans smack their kids when they are bad, like with their hand (which I don�t agree with either), but with sticks? Belts? And so many times? And leaving bruises? That�s just wrong!!!!!! I know hitting kids with shoes and belts USED to be common in the US and England, but it�s not common these days, right?

I was reading a story with Step 3 and there was a picture of a girl pushing away a bowl of ice-cream (they are learning �she doesn�t like ice-cream�). One of the girls said, �She�s crazy!� and I said, �Yes, she�s crazy!� Jenna said, �I don�t like ice-cream too, am I crazy?� I told her that she was crazy because her mom hit her on the head so many times. That was mean, I know. I shouldn�t joke about that. But I wasn�t really joking.

I know some people from other countries hit their kids too, and I know there are abusive parents from all over the world. And I know kids in some countries are treated way worse. I�ve heard the stories of how they treat girls in poor muslim countries where the girls �disgrace� their families by talking to/looking at boys, showing the skin from their ankles/wrists in public, etc. So I know it�s not just Korea where they treat kids like this, and that Korea is definitely not the worst country in the world. But it still makes me sick!!!!!! You�d think a technologically advanced country like Korea would be better than this. But I guess not. I guess children and minorities and animals have no rights in Korea. I hate violent people and violent societies! Don�t they know that what they�re doing is wrong? These kids are going to grow up and treat their kids the same way because they think it�s okay. It sucks.

What do you think?

[Rteacher]

Well, it's a violent world. Controlled violence is sometimes necessary, and corporal punishment has some positive as well as obviously negative aspects. Meat-eaters are implicated in causing far worse violence - resulting in the cruel deaths of millions of animals a day.
I remarked on your other thread that I personally don't like to see kids get hit or hurt, but it makes no sense to me to try to interfere with a system that seemingly has wide support - even among students.

[little mixed girl]

when i was younger i got hit with:
hand
hanger
paddle (which was broken over my butt)
my baton =( (which was broken over my butt)
jump rope

i've had welts up and down my legs and butt.
and my mom was not asian or korean for that matter.

there's nothing wrong with hitting a kid if they are bad. if you're hitting them because you're bored...well then that's different.

plenty of kids in the states get hit with no problems...plenty more NEED to get hit...or beat down.

personally, i don't think i'd hit a kid for the study thing.

but korea doesn't sound too different from what my mom got growing up...teachers could hit students, parents could BEAT (not hit) kids...and again, this was in the states.

[pegpig]

It's Korean culture. We should learn to adjust to their way. It is their country.

[jurassic5]

[pegpig]

Friggin' ajoshi get away from my computer. Go for a short bathroom break and look what happens.

People should never hit their kids - especially not to the point of bruising. A few months ago some middle school girls who used to be in my class were telling me that their teachers had beat them because they were bad. They showed me the marks around their ankles. That's gotta be painful.

Growing up my mom might have given us a slap here and there. My dad - nothing. I remember one time where my mom had just finished washing about half of the floor when my brother traipsed in through the front door. My mom swung around and WHAP!. Mop in the face! I almost died laughing and had to make a beeline for the back door or else probably receive a similar fate. Then, I had to avoid my brother, for laughing. Good times. Good times.

[JongnoGuru]

[Wrench]

I believe in passive punishment. Kneeling is much more effective then spanking.

[uberscheisse]

in a vocabulary test, i take off a mark here and there for minor misspellings, unclear definitions, etc. it is very hard to get 100% in my class.

i have at least 5 students out of 30 who will get hit with a stick if they get under 90% on their test. i have one who will get hit if she doesn't get 100% EVERY TIME.

it makes zero sense. the majority of these parent-dictated go-getter students also go to 65,972,798 hagwons a week - so when are they going to have the chance to devote a little extra study time to my class?

it seems that many korean parents have really unrealistic expectations of their children. it also seems that they see even minor flaws as a source of heartbreaking shame. what a bunch of horse shit. let a kid screw up, he/she'll realize that later on in life shit happens and it's not necessarily the end of the world when they do.

[dogbert]

It might be a good idea to get the girl's family members to start calling them "April" and "Jenna" at home. Statistically speaking, it's more difficult for a person to hit an "April" or "Jenna" than a "Young-hee" or "Hyun-ju".

[JongnoGuru]

[desultude]

No, later on kids go on to beat their own kids.

This sort of violence is cyclical and self perpetuating. Beating a child teaches fear and hatred, not respect.

I came from a family where beatings and violence were the norm. Believe me, it does not teach good lessons. It is psychologically scarring.

I suppose it is defensable to spank a child on occasion, although I don't even think that is necessary.

In many ways I think Korea is where the U.S. was in the 50's and 60's. There is a dialogue underway here in Korea about this and other issues, such as treatment of women, etc. We westerners don't have to "teach" Koreans about their problems- they are aware of them and working on them, in the same way that we are in the west, and in the same way, change takes time.

My parents thought it was the norm to beat us for bad behavior- as my sister points out to me, both of them have been arrested in today's U.S. Things change.

[Derrek]

Spare the rod, spoil the child.

This worked for hundreds of years, until recent generations became "enlightened."

Now we can't keep control of kids in school and we have student graduation high school who can't read.

[Moldy Rutabaga]

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[seoulunitarian]