Korean Job Discussion Forums

[mind_body_and_seoul]

Since the other Korean teacher left, it�s just me and the director, so he�s had to teach every day, not just Tuesdays and Thursdays like he used to. He�s obviously not coping very well, because he�s started hitting the kids with a stick EVERY DAY. The first time I heard of this was when Step 4-B (10-12 year-olds) came into my class (they have one hour with him and one hour with me) complaining that he�d hit them many times for doing badly on their test. James (who�s very good at English despite being badly behaved) only got hit once, while Alice (a really sweet girl who tries really hard but is just not that bright) got hit 16 times, and the rest were somewhere in between. I was a bit shocked that he�d done that, because when I first came here he told me, �If they are bad, we don�t beat them, we just say minus one.� The kids had told me how their elementary school teachers hit them on the head with sticks for falling asleep in class, etc, but I thought hagwons were different, and I�ve heard teachers from other hagwons complain about how they have to keep the kids happy, can�t even tell them off for misbehaving incase they complain to their mom, etc.

Now we�ve got two new students who�ve joined Step 5 (the best class), even though their English sucks, just because they couldn�t come to an earlier class because it clashed with math academy. �But they promised to try very hard.� Anyway, I suggested to the director that they should have an easier textbook than the other kids because their English is so bad. He agreed, so I use an easier textbook for them, and I give them a easier test than the rest of the class, but in his class he makes them do the same stuff as the other kids (who are older/have lived in Malaysia, etc). So they did the same test as the rest of the class and April got 12/60 and James got 6/60. He came and interrupted my class to let them know how bad their test scores were and let the rest of the kids laugh at them. I was thinking, �What did you expect??????� The next day he let them take another test, but they did badly on that one too, so they came to my class complaining about how Yoon Min Teacher had hit them 24 times each. I asked April what her mom would say; wouldn�t she be angry with Yoon Min Teacher? She told me she wouldn�t tell her mom because her mom would be angry with her for getting a bad score on her test. (See my other post to hear about what a lovely woman April�s mom is � April is Jenna�s big sister). I told April that in the USA/England, if a teacher hit one of the students, their parents would be really angry and say to the teacher, �How dare you hit my child?� and the teacher would be fired!

I was annoyed that he started hitting the children, but I like it in Korea (most of the time), so I made excuses to myself because I do want to stay. I haven�t told any of my friends back home that he hits the kids, because it�s embarrassing! I work for a school where the principal beats the kids with a stick! Why am I still here?????? So I told myself, �Well at least he doesn�t hit the little kids.� The next day, Step 3 (8 year-olds) came into my class complaining about how they�d had a spelling test and he hit them once for every word they got wrong. Most of them complained of being hit about 25 times.

The next day, Step 3 Jenny went home crying after Yoon Min Teacher�s class. She didn�t come to my class. I asked the other kids what had happened. �Jenny bad talking, Yoon Min Teacher WHACK WHACK WHACK! REALLY HARD!� I asked them, �Bad talking like F-you (they all know that word, it was NOT me who taught them it) or bad talking like �you are poo poo?� They said, �No, Yoon Min Teacher say Step 1 is good, Step 2 is good, why is Step 3 bad. Jenny say, no everyone is bad! Yoon Min Teacher WHACK WHACK WHACK!� Apparently he spent the whole hour hitting her and yelling at her. Then she went home crying. The kids are supposed to study 2 pages of their textbook with him every day, but that day they�d only done less than half a page. I would be so pissed if I paid all that money for my kids to go to English academy just for them to waste their time watching him hit and yell at one of the girls. And if Jenny was my daughter OMG how dare he!!!!!! Then I just played games with them during my time to try and cheer them up even though I was in a very bad mood after hearing what had happened. Why do their parents even bother sending them to English academy?

I asked him why Jenny didn�t come to my class and he said she�d gone for a picnic with her family, just this once. ?????? It just puts me in a bad mood when those adorable little 8 year-olds (even though they are little monsters) come into my class crying because Yoon Min Teacher hit them. How am I supposed to be cheerful and entertaining when they are so upset? How can I be cruel and make them study? How are they supposed to learn anything?

The next day I asked Jenny what had happened and what her mom said. �My mom said one more chance.� Your mom said Yoon Min Teacher must not hit you anymore? �No, my mom said one more chance for me, Yoon Min Teacher hit me good, my mom is bad.�

Jenny is a brat, she bosses around the other kids, she�s mean, she cries when she doesn�t get her way, but now I feel so bad for her because of what he did to her. How can I be strict with these kids when this is how they are treated by their teachers and parents?

Then Step 4-A (the nice class, the class who are good at English even though they are only 8-10 years old) told me that he hits THEM too! WHY??????

It�s so annoying because they always complain about how I�m not as kind as their previous foreign teacher (a British guy) who bought them pizza and ice-cream and gave them candy and let them speak Korean in class and didn�t care if they drew pictures or listened to MP3s instead of studying. But at least I don�t hit them!!!!!!

So is anyone else�s hagwon like this? Am I crazy for staying just because I like it in Korea (most of the time) and get paid on time? Part of why I want to stay is because I do love the kids, even though I don�t like the director and the school. What should I do? My director isn�t intimidated by me like he would be if I was a 6 food tall guy. People have told me I�m supposed to have a lot of power by being the only foreign teacher, but I don�t feel like I do.

[Rteacher]

It's largely a cultural thing. For many Korean teachers hitting kids seems to be a primary teaching method - and many of them seem to have it down to a science.
At my first hagwon, the director was an experienced teacher, and he - theoretically at least - didn't believe in hitting kids, but his style of discipline involved screaming at kids - and most of the women Korean and native English teachers - until they often cried...
At my second hagwon, all the Korean teachers had about 5 different sticks, and , for the most part, they were moderate about using them mainly to improve test scores. I asked a sixth grade boy who was one of the brightest students what he thought about teachers hitting students with sticks, and he frankly said that the best teachers were the ones that hit their students the most. It really seems that a lot of students, especially older ones, buy into the system and take corporal punishment in stride.
Even at the public high school where I'm at now it's common for teachers to hit students. Sometimes there would be five or six students in "push up" positions lined up side-by-side and spanked in front of the class - or in the halls. The typical reaction from the other students is muffled laughter. One K woman teacher who sits next to me in the teachers' office prefers to smack the bottom of her students feet as they kneel on a chair. It definitely appears to be very painful, but the students tend to just laugh it off. She seems to be a very popular teacher...
I personally don't like to see kids get hit or hurt unnecessarily, but I don't think it's my postition to get overly concerned by what seems to be an acceptable norm among Korean teachers, students and parents...

[Wrench]

Not at my haqwon but they should. Our kids are monsters, hellaliens if you will.

[joe_doufu]

I think it's the humiliation in front of the other students, not the pain, that the K-teachers are going for.

That said, you should kick your principal's ass. Go into the class he treats the worst, and break his stick in front of the students. Yell and humiliate him. Spank him with the stick if necessary. Make it clear that this is just a warning.

If you turn a blind eye to this, don't bother commenting on any post of mine in the future.

[Derrek]

Hmmm...

You must be really shocked by all of the hitting going on around you.

Parents hitting kids (the other thread you made).

Hagwon owners hitting kids, in this thread.


I knew a very devout Christian woman who came here 3 years ago about the same time I did. The pastor lived above her, and would bead his wife nightly. She got really freaked out by that, and left the country inside of a month.

The world is a violent place.

[Dan The Chainsawman]

The most I have seen a teacher do at my school is give them a thwap to the side of the head. When I do it the kids seem to think its funny, so I don't even bother with it anymore.

As for whats going on in your school sounds like your gonna be out of students soon.

This is a bit of a diversion, but isn't it funny how the worst students seem to stick around, while the best get peeved off and leave? Any more I found the way to side step this one is to consistently kick the worst kids out of class during games, and candy hand out. Funny how now they seem to drop out. It works well my classes have gotten alot better, and in some cases the real bad kids have become my best kids.

[Rteacher]

I would have thunk (er...thought) that this thread would be of more interest to EFL teachers than the "Why do Koreans hit their kids?" one - which has been getting many more hits (but not as many hits as the students in my school...)

[ttlesl]

I never actually saw a child get hit anywhere but the bum and it was usually for being a little snot. I would not call it beating as much as a spanking or corporal punishment. And I am sorry to say some of these children needed a smack on the bum!

I don't think I could sit by if I saw someone actually beating a child. I would have to do something.

[Zenpickle]

At my school last year, some teachers got away with hitting the kids. It was disturbing how this trend spread to every teacher, including myself. Then it started making headlines and becoming an issue about corporal punishment in public schools. We talked about it at a teachers' meeting and decided to totally put an end to corporal punishment.

The thing is that those that use corporal punishment aren't doing it as a form of discipline. They're doing it to get out their own frustrations. It reveals their lack of imagination and their own failure and weakness at being a good role model.

"Discipline" comes from the word "disciple."

Hitting a kid only teaches the kid to hit others below him.

[tomato]

People sometimes ask me, "Don't you think there are times when it is necessary to administer corporal punishment?"

I always say, "I don't know. I've never seen a teacher try everything else first."

[keithinkorea]

My Hagwon is outrageous when it comes to discipline, there is none. Kids running around fighting, calling each other shipbals, hiding under tables (kids up to the age of 14 doing this!).


The Korean teachers just go 'aigo' whenever kids are shouting 'f you', I'm one of the only teachers who seems to thing that discipline is important and if I tell them off they just laugh, they know if they complain about the 'mean' weygookin teacher to the Korean staff that they will take the little brats side.

Worst school I've ever worked at. It is horrible perhaps it is because I live in a crappy area.

I do have some wonderful kids but they are in the minority and often get corrupted by the uncivilised ones, which is really quite upsetting.

A lot of the kids in my school need a good hiding, it would do them the world of good.

[rapier]

[TheUrbanMyth]

[natemk]

My school is known for it's good discipline. Not many children get too far out of line. It goes something like this.

Kid comes to school.

Forget your English sentences that you're supposed to read on arrival..
that's a paddlin'

No name tag..
that's a paddlin'

Not bowing to all the teachers in the hallways..
that's a paddlin'

Horseplay in the hallways..
that's a paddlin'

Getting less than 70% on the test..
that's a paddlin'

Not having your homework signed by parents..
that's a paddlin'


That's what comes to my mind now, no doubt there is more paddlins. These very by seriousness and teacher who is delivering.

[rapier]