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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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 Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 8:52 am Post subject: |
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Will the "Patriot Act" catch Osama bin Laden?
No. |
No but it might trip up his followers , and make it harder for them to do stuff.
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Will it incovenience American citizens and infringe upon their rights?
Yes. |
How so?
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Was it drafted by a third-world immigrant born with no concept of freedom?
Yes. |
I am a lot less worried about a Vietnamese immigrant than Al Qaiada.
Al Qaida is determined to attack the US again. They will show no mercy. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
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Will the "Patriot Act" catch Osama bin Laden?
No. |
No but it might trip up his followers , and make it harder for them to do stuff. |
"Might" is simply not good enough.
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Will it incovenience American citizens and infringe upon their rights?
Yes. |
You know how so. It's been debated many times.
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Was it drafted by a third-world immigrant born with no concept of freedom?
Yes. |
| JRGR wrote: |
I am a lot less worried about a Vietnamese immigrant than Al Qaiada.
Al Qaida is determined to attack the US again. They will show no mercy. |
My point is that Vietnamese have no business writing our laws. Hell, Vietnamese alive today were committing terrorist acts against the U.S. in recent memory. Why can't Americans draft American laws? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:07 am Post subject: |
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"Might" is simply not good enough. |
In this world there are no gurantees. but the world is very dangerous
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| You know how so. It's been debated many times. |
I think most of the critics are either reflexive liberatarians or don't know the what the law says.
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My point is that Vietnamese have no business writing our laws. Hell, Vietnamese alive today were committing terrorist acts against the U.S. in recent memory. Why can't Americans draft American laws?] |
I don't care what nation the author is from. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:14 am Post subject: |
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You don't care what nation the author is from? Why don't you invite someone from the Taliban or from Iran to write our laws then? Korean laws are written by Koreans -- American laws should be written by Americans. Why is that such a "foreign" concept to you?
Get real and try not to shoot America in the foot. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:16 am Post subject: |
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If they were on our side and smart then more power to them.
American isn't a race , often immigrants have made good Americans.
If it wasn't for the US letting in Germans then then the US wouldn't have gotten the atom bomb.
Your argument sounds like something Han Chong Nyun would make. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
If they were on our side and smart then more power to them.
American isn't a race , often immigrants have made good Americans.
If it wasn't for the US letting in Germans then then the US wouldn't have gotten the atom bomb.
Your argument sounds like something Han Chong Nyun would make. |
The North Vietnamese were not on our side and their southern brethren were the Iraqi insurgents of their day.
Letting Nazis build bombs in a true emergency is one thing; did we invite Oppenheimer to draft our national security laws?
Often immigrants turn out to be terrorists -- ask the British, French, Dutch, Germans, etc. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Dogbert would you rather see Bush die or Bin Laden die? Just curious.
If several Al Qaida attacks in the US caused such disorder and discredited the US government to such an extent that the current people ruling the US were removed from power do you think it would have worth for the US to suffer the attacks ? |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Dogbert would you rather see Bush die or Bin Laden die? Just curious. |
I don't see how the "Patriot Act" will help accomplish either.
| JRGR wrote: |
| If several Al Qaida attacks in the US caused such disorder and discredited the US government to such an extent that the current people ruling the US were removed from power do you think it would have worth for the US to suffer the attacks ? |
No.
What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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I don't see how the "Patriot Act" will help accomplish either. |
the patriot act isn't something made to catch bin Laden it is something that is used to trip up AQ so they can't carry out attacks in the US.
That someone who wrote it came from Vietnam isn't important. By the way was the person in question a US citizen? |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
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I don't see how the "Patriot Act" will help accomplish either. |
the patriot act isn't something made to catch bin Laden it is something that is used to trip up AQ so they can't carry out attacks in the US. |
That's just silly.
We could have tripped up AQ before 9/11, if we had just had the sense to abide by our own visa-issuing and confirming procedures. But we didn't.
| JRGR wrote: |
| That someone who wrote it came from Vietnam isn't important. By the way was the person in question a US citizen? |
Were the London bombers British citizens?
Most Western nations have debased their citizenship.
It is important, because someone who grew up in a cultural milieu that does not value independence, freedom, human rights, etc. has absolutely no business drafting laws in a nation having a culture that does. It's no coincidence that the "Patriot Act" infringes on such values. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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That's just silly.
We could have tripped up AQ before 9/11, if we had just had the sense to abide by our own visa-issuing and confirming procedures. But we didn't. |
Maybe the US could have stopped AQ before 9-11, but the Patriot act is something else that could help.
By the way one provsion in the PAct is that the FBI and the CIA can now talk to each other - they could not before 9-11 and if they could have then perhaps 9-11 would have been stopped.
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| Were the London bombers British citizens? |
Yes,
but it is interesting LONDON BOMBINGS
And what do you know the US with its PAct wasn't hit.
but you think that the writer is a veitnamese agent out to hurt the US?
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| Most Western nations have debased their citizenship. |
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| It is important, because someone who grew up in a cultural milieu that does not value independence, freedom, human rights, etc. has absolutely no business drafting laws in a nation having a culture that does. It's no coincidence that the "Patriot Act" infringes on such values. |
For me it is no problem. I am glad that person is in the US.
Please tell m e which values the PAct infringes on so I can learn more. |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| No in fact Europe has been pretty ineffective when it comes to terror. That is why they never got rid of it. |
Not exactly the case. Prior to 7/7, and discounting Madrid, there had been very little terror violence in Wester Europe for a long time. Compare the late 80s and all of the 90s with the late 60s and all the 70s. The IRA gave up their weapons just a week or so before the London terror attacks, and who's heard of the Red Brigade and the Bader-Mienhof recently - heck, plenty on this board, even some of the younger UKers, will have to Google those names.
Europe has been very effective in countering terrorists in the past, and they did in fact mange to be free of it for a long while. Their methods really ought to be studied to see if they can be used in the present situation, in my humble opinion. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 3:35 am Post subject: |
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| Not exactly the case. Prior to 7/7, and discounting Madrid, there had been very little terror violence in Wester Europe for a long time. Compare the late 80s and all of the 90s with the late 60s and all the 70s. The IRA gave up their weapons just a week or so before the London terror attacks, and who's heard of the Red Brigade and the Bader-Mienhof recently - heck, plenty on this board, even some of the younger UKers, will have to Google those names. |
The Red Brigagde cause of the end of the cold war. They did nothing when Iran set hit squads to kill Kurds , ex Iranian officials Iranian or , dissidents,translators of books. They also allowed those who attacked the Israeli athletes during the 1972 olympics to go free.
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Europe has been very effective in countering terrorists in the past, and they did in fact mange to be free of it for a long while. Their methods really ought to be studied to see if they can be used in the present situation, in my humble opinion. |
Again they need zero about Iran hit squads that went to their nations. Spain still has ETA,
And there is one difference The IRA settled for something less than total victory , groups like Hezzbollah , Hamas and Al Qaida will not. |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 8:05 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| And there is one difference The IRA settled for something less than total victory , groups like Hezzbollah , Hamas and Al Qaida will not. |
Unlike the rest of us, here's a guy who knows the future, but only when it applies to how the muslims will react ... wierd kind of talent, but hey, go with it.
Just curious. WHY do you think islamic groups will behave differently than other religiously-inspired terror groups have in the past? Do you think there is something unique aboiut Islam that makes the extremist murderers and their supporters different from the rest of humanity?
I've said many times that humanity is a stronger cohesive force than religion or ideology - the above quote seems to say that you think there is something about Islam that is stronger than the desire for peace and prosperity that the majority that the rest of us share. So what is that all about? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Unlike the rest of us, here's a guy who knows the future, but only when it applies to how the muslims will react ... wierd kind of talent, but hey, go with it. |
nothing to do with muslims has to do with those groups. Bin Laden and Khomeni and Saddam all killed many muslims. though the anti war people hardly ever noticed -maybe it is intentional - The Kurds were muslims.
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| Just curious. WHY do you think islamic groups will behave differently than other religiously-inspired terror groups have in the past? Do you think there is something unique aboiut Islam that makes the extremist murderers and their supporters different from the rest of humanity? |
No not about muslims.but Bathism , Khomenism , and Al Qadia are like world war II fascists. World war II fascists were not muslims. So this is not a muslim phenomenon but rather a human phenomenon,
It is not about Islam is is however about fascism and Al Qaida and the Bathist and Khomeni followers are all fascists.
It is not theat Muslims behave differently it is that totalitiarian fascists behave differently
If you look at the words of groups like Al Qaida and Hamas, and Hezzbollah - and leaders like Saddam and Khomeni they oppose any compromise.
It was much the same with the bathists of Iraq.
It would be great if someone like Sistani were in charge in Iran instead of that fascist Ali Khamani.
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| I've said many times that humanity is a stronger cohesive force than religion or ideology - the above quote seems to say that you think there is something about Islam that is stronger than the desire for peace and prosperity that the majority that the rest of us share. So what is that all about?[ |
It is not about Islam .Khomeni was a fascist, Bin Laden is a fascist , ahd Saddam is a fascist.
And all of those guys and their followers do not believe in compromise. Not cause they are muslims but- because they are fascists.
They wont' give up their war cause if they did they would lose their reason for existance.
No Bob evil needs to be looked in the eye - these governments , terror organizations and those that support them need to be called for what they are. Appeasement is not the answer and the very worst thing the US could do is give in to their demands.
Last edited by Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee on Fri Aug 19, 2005 2:18 am; edited 2 times in total |
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