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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994
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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:42 am Post subject: |
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| American English pronunciation: "certainly" = suh-ruh-ten-li' |
Who says this? I've never noticed it. As far as I know, we all say "certainly" = ser-un-li or ser-tn-li.
Question: Has American English diverged so much that it is now considered a dialect and not just a regional variation (accent)?
Whenever this topic comes up I'm always reminded of an experience I had a few years ago. A couple of friends from Liverpool came to visit me in the US. We took a road trip down to Graceland in Memphis, Tennessee. We stopped at a restaurant and the waiter asked one of my friends what she wanted for dinner. His accent was sooooo thick that she couldn't understand him. I translated for him. She gave her order. Her Scouse accent was sooooo thick that he couldn't understand her. I translated for her. (It was lucky I could understand both of them and both could understand me. I had an encounter with a guy from Glascow who I could not understand at all. I thought he was speaking some Middle European language.)
My conclusion is that although accents can be colorful and interesting, they do at times interfere with communication. Therefore, I think it is OK for each English-speaking country to determine a standard pronunciation spoken in school and in business. That would make the task of learning English much more manageable for our students.
An additional reason for saying so is that I read in one of the Korean papers recently that China is sending 600 teachers to Korean schools. China has decided to 'make' Mandarin an international language. If English is to have a competitor for 'the' international language, it needs all the advantages it can get. |
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gypsyfish
Joined: 17 Jan 2003 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:06 am Post subject: |
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| R. S. Refugee wrote: |
| gypsyfish wrote: |
| Does anyone really say potahtos? Tomahtoes, I've heard, but not the other. |
I can't claim to be that expert on the various pronunciations to be found in all the varieties of English accents, gf, but I think this may just an example of poetic license.
Perhaps you could check in your with your favorite, world-reknowned linguist and get his take on that question.
My bad.  |
You good!  |
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The Great Wall of Whiner
Joined: 24 Jan 2003 Location: Middle Land
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| Quote: |
| American English pronunciation: "certainly" = suh-ruh-ten-li' |
Who says this? I've never noticed it. As far as I know, we all say "certainly" = ser-un-li or ser-tn-li. |
I have also heard "soi-tuhn-lee" like Bugs Bunny...
| Quote: |
| An additional reason for saying so is that I read in one of the Korean papers recently that China is sending 600 teachers to Korean schools. China has decided to 'make' Mandarin an international language. If English is to have a competitor for 'the' international language, it needs all the advantages it can get. |
Being in China, I can tell you that Mandarin is like English in that there are regional differences, too.
In the Yalu River areas, mountain is pronounced "san", while in the capital and Harbin areas it is pronounced "shan". One of many many examples. |
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dulouz
Joined: 04 Feb 2003 Location: Uranus
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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| I teach American because the Koreans are not interested in learning English, they are interested in learning the language of international commerce and that would be American. |
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Veronica

Joined: 29 Aug 2005
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Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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| English of course, but I will point out differences in spellings and pronunciation as and when I need to. They seem quite happy to have British English in the school as opposed to American. |
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SPINOZA
Joined: 10 Jun 2005 Location: $eoul
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:16 am Post subject: |
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I'm English and teach English, but I use American spellings and American words like 'server' and other stuff. I use American spellings a lot anyway (like 'rationalize') because I prefer it and welcome changes to English spelling within reason. I don't feel any bitterness about accepting American English as the dominant or the standard form abroad for the simple reason that the English language, and indeed the North American accent, originated in my country and we have a history and a culture to be proud of.
Very occasionally, when students can't understand what the f__k I'm saying even though what I'm saying seems relatively straightforward and I'm fairly standard English, I'll put on an American accent and...be perfectly understood!
They're more used to hearing it because of business reasons and also American English has presitige because the USA is a political and economic hegemon. Not least, America is the reason they're not a miserable totalitarian desert...so America has influenced the country considerably and this is reflected in the accents that Korean kids speak English in. South Korea is an extremely desirable place to live largely because of the USA. |
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Bo Peabody
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:33 am Post subject: |
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[deleted]
Last edited by Bo Peabody on Thu May 02, 2013 2:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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thursdays child
Joined: 21 Sep 2005
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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As far as language goes - I mix it up - it's all correct after all. With pronunciation i teach what i speak - and i'm a real mongrel British+New Zealand+Canada = me. But I'm always understood and many people complement me on my spoken English and then ask "so where ARE you from????"
English is multi-cultural language spoken and heard in weird and wonderful tones and that's why it is what it is. Enhance and accept it for it's craziness and don't put it in a box.... It's OUR language and we are many!!! ok rant over. |
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fusionbarnone
Joined: 31 May 2004
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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| I taught any form the punters requested even English with foreign accents for fun. |
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ddeubel

Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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and of course Europe which prefers British English (except Dutch & Scandinavians which seem to love American accents for reasons unknown).
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I had to respond to this...lve taught all over Europe and not many places that "prefer" British English -- most are all going the way of world, demanding American English speaking teachers and instruction. Even now the French and French government who were for years staunchly pro British English...
But I think the way of the world, the clarity for a learner too, is to learn american English. It is much more mallable.......more people throughout the world will understand "where can I buy diapers?" than , "Where can I buy some nappies?"
In any case, I don't teach a language -- I TEACH STUDENTS!
DD |
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Wangja

Joined: 17 May 2004 Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yes, "mallable" american (sic) English (whatever that is) permitting French women visiting USA to be spared the embarassment of asking for nappies and not diapers.
Now that's a bandwagon not to be missed.  |
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OiGirl

Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: Hoke-y-gun
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Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:14 am Post subject: |
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I teach my native mid-American dialect, however my youngest students have been spening a lot of time on BBC websites, listening to e-books narrated with a British accent, and have not had any trouble understanding them. Nor has a single child told me that the stories sound funny.
The listening section of our assessment features a guy straight out of New Jersey...I would say they need some practice with that dialect, however they have shown me that dialect matters little. |
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fusionbarnone
Joined: 31 May 2004
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:24 am Post subject: |
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I like to study foreign accents as a hobby. One site I've looked at has a wide range of native nationalities reading from the same text.
The very act of attempting to read the text correctly(because obviously English isn't their first language and I suspect they try too hard to read the passage) forces the readers/speakers to deviate from how they would sound in actual conversation.
Apart from the Vietnamese speakers, the readers ended up sounding like slightly distinctive accented foreigners.
Therefore it seems, speaking slowly forces everyone to speak "school teacher English" with a minimalized accent(american T's no longer sound like D's in slow-mo.,etc). |
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Summer Wine
Joined: 20 Mar 2005 Location: Next to a River
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| myself, an australian with a rather british accent. |
Sacrilige, did you just say that. Here's the soap, here's your mouth, put both in extreme close proximity.
Aussies have at least 3-4 or more accents, that I have noticed. Only the Victorian/South Australian sounds anywhere near British.
Here I am supporting Aussies own independent english and I am your worst supporter. Damm, here comes the soap my way.  |
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Natalia
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
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Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 5:31 am Post subject: |
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Oh, Canberra accents are far closer to British than Victorian accents. The Canberrans make fun of the Victorians' broad accents (my father's from Victoria, and he's our family yobbo).
And, having lived in both England and Australia, I do have more and more trouble telling the difference between some accents these days, as much as the British probably hate to hear that.
I'm not English and I'm not American, but I must say I get sick of hearing people accuse English people of not being able to speak English. Seeing as it's THEIR language first and foremost, I think maybe some people have to accept that maybe they can speak English.
I have real problems sometimes with the American I am supposed to teach. I come accross spelling I didn't even know existed. For example, I was having a hard time trying to explain 'tire', when to me that means you need a rest, not something you put on your car (for the record, we use 'tyre').
I think Koreans could really benefit from a broader English education. There are many Koreans heading out to Australia to study or work, and the American they are learning isn't really helping them in over there.
For example, one of the Korean teachers at my school left for an extended break in Australia. I asked him a number of times in his final week when he was leaving for his holiday, and was met with blank looks every time. At his farewell party, he asked me what I meant when I said, "holiday". He finally had a lightbulb flash and said, "Oh you mean VACATION." I told him, no, I meant HOLIDAY, a word he should be familiar seing as he is supposed to be an English teacher. And especially as he has visions of settling in Australia, where American isn't going to get you very far. |
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