Korean Job Discussion Forums

Ya-ta Boy · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994

Another alternative is to make a counter-offer: your diploma for his/her driver's license.

JongnoGuru · Joined: 25 May 2004 Location: peeing on your doorstep

Zark · Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 8:59 pm Post subject:

How about, "I'd love to give to you - but what if I need to look for another job?"

joe_doufu · Joined: 09 May 2005 Location: Elsewhere

JongnoGuru · Joined: 25 May 2004 Location: peeing on your doorstep

kermo · Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 4:18 am Post subject:

I was approached again today. The manager is very adorable, but her tactics were incredible. I tried to reason with her, explaining that the diploma would not protect the school in case I wanted to do privates or other illegal work. I also explained that I would prefer a relationship based on trust, not hostages.

She tried:

a) guilt trip (for help she offered me earlier)
b) jokingly shaking me by the shoulders
c) threatened to follow me around until I agree
d) appeal for pity
e) threatened to hang herself the following week Shocked

f) citing school policy
g) the peer pressure technique (all the other teachers have done it!)
h) offer a written agreement to give it back to me if I needed it (I suggested a written agreement to give it to THEM if they actually needed it.)

I asked her whether she would keep the degree herself, but apparently they are kept in the director's files. I would love to help her out, and I need her on my side, but this is ridiculous. I asked her to find out whether the diploma would be returned to me in the case that a university offered me a position and I was going to a job interview. This one is tough.

JongnoGuru · Joined: 25 May 2004 Location: peeing on your doorstep

When dealing with Koreans, trust is built on hostages.

(and no, I won't say "some" or "most" or "North" Koreans Razz

)

Was the girl ("manager" ... ha!) joking when she said (e) or was she acting like she expected you to take her seriously?

Kermo, don't do what you suggested in (h) -- agree in writing to hand it over to them whenever they CLAIM to have a valid need for it. They'll "need" it before the ink on that agreement has dried. Oh, and they'll really throw a hissy fit then if you refused to give it to them.

These people are dead set on separating you from your diploma and are, as we now see, prepared to use any device short of aggravated assault to accomplish this.

You remember writing this?

TheUrbanMyth · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Location: Retired

kermo · Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 8:17 am Post subject:

One of the other teachers is really upset with the management right now (for other reasons) but he says he's going to ask for his diploma back. We'll see what happens, and if he gets it.

It's not actually true that the school has every teacher's diploma, but this "policy" is unravelling more every day.

I trust the manager, but I don't trust the director. I can't speak to him in English, and my Korean is only at taxi-driver/dance-floor level, certainly not up to negotiating important issues.

The only reason I feel compelled to do this is for the sake of my relationship with the manager. It's painful watching her trying to get leverage on me, but I'm afraid I'll need a favour from her and will be unable to get it.

ontheway · Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 10:23 am Post subject:

Someone should make a sticky for this:

You never need to give or show your original diploma to anyone, except the Korean embassy or consulate before you come to Korea. Make PHOTOCOPIES of your diploma. Only 50 won / 5 cents US. Get the photocopies certified and stamped. Get a bunch. Use those. Keep your original diploma safe. Wink

I did it. The photocopies have worked for years. I have never shown my original diploma to anyone in Korea. Our newest teacher did the same recently. Maybe some schools are different? But original diplomas are NOT needed for immigration.

canuckistan · Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 11:05 am Post subject:

I was once asked to hand over my diploma and passport to my wonjangnim. I just smiled and told them that piece of paper cost me $15,000 (in other words, no way) and the passport belongs to my government (ditto.) Then they tried for my return ticket and I told them they could have it when they reimbursed me for it at the end of my contract.

The silliness pretty much stopped there.

canukteacher · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Location: Seoul, Korea

The next time she asks you, and starts in with all the reasons you SHOULD give it away, simply smile and say NO, and I have to leave now. Walk away, and don't look back. Koreans love to argue, and unless you simply learn to walk away with a smile on your face they will drive you nuts. My univeristy students argue with me everyday on any number of things. I just smile, pack up my briefcase, and say see you next time.

Here's another tactic.............tell your director you will trade your degree for his.......................would love to see the look on his face then.....haha.

Good luck.

CT

babtangee · Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:46 pm Post subject:

Grotto · Joined: 21 Mar 2004

Simplest word in the world.

N O
NO
no

Dont try to justify, dont argue, dont compromise.....just say no. While they might not like it they will at least be able to understand it. If they have trouble understanding NO try anio.

In my experience I have found that after a while Koreans will come to realise that when a foreigner says no they mean no...not maybe...not i'll think about it....no just means no.

xtchr · Joined: 23 Nov 2004

Kermo; you describe your manager as 'adorable', and then you list 8 tactics that she tried to use on you to get something that is NOT hers.
I think I must have a different understanding of the word 'adorable'.