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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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 Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 1:39 am Post subject: |
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Bobster wrote:
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| It is a fact that things are not going well in Iraq. |
Uh-huh. For example...
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Dec 24 (Reuters) - Following are security incidents in Iraq reported on Saturday, Dec. 24, as of 1330 GMT.
U.S. and Iraqi forces are battling a Sunni Arab insurgency against the Shi'ite and Kurdish-led government in Baghdad.
Asterisk denotes new or updated incidents.
HILLA - Saboteurs blew up an oil pipeline on the outskirts of Hilla 100 km (62 miles) south of Baghdad, fires are still raging. Police said a makeshift bomb was used in the attack.
KIRKUK - One civilian was killed and three wounded when a roadside bomb exploded near an Iraqi army patrol in central Kirkuk, Police Colonel Taha Abdullah said.
BAGHDAD - Two people were killed, including an aide to the Ministry of Justice, when gunmen opened fire on their car in the centre of Baghdad, police said.
BAGHDAD - Three Ministry of Health employees were shot dead when gunmen opened fire on their car, police said.
*BAGHDAD - A U.S. soldier was killed in a rocket-propelled grenade attack while on patrol near Hawija in northern Iraq, the U.S. military said.
BAGHDAD - Seven bodies of civilians with bullets wounds were found in southern Baghdad, police said.
BAGHDAD - Two civilians were killed when gunmen opened fire on an electronics shop in Baghdad's wealthy Mansour district, police said.
FALLUJA - A Lt. colonel in the Iraqi army was shot dead when gunmen broke into his house and opened fire, police said.
BAGHDAD - A U.S. soldier was killed by a bomb while on patrol on Thursday, the U.S. military said.
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http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/MOU420611.htm |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 7:58 am Post subject: |
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I agree that we cannot cut and run- that is what we did to those in Viet Nam who supported the U.S.- whether they chose to or not- such as the Hmong tribes people, as well as the Vietnamese in the south. Then there was a blood bath, and repression that continues today.
The U.S. has a history of setting a game in motion and then bailing- leaving locals to clean up the mess and suffer the consequences.
The best case scenerio would be to transition to a U.N. force, and let people sort out the aftermath as best and democratically as they can without U.S. (quite corporately self-interested) direction and force.
Much as I hate the war- we started it and now, if there was ever a possibility, back our own interests out. As if. Halliburton and Bechtel are not about to capitulate. |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 12:03 pm Post subject: Re: Iraqis March, Say Elections Were Rigged |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
2. It is also a fact that only about of half of the army and police force are ready. However some of these forces are already undertaking operations on their own. Once they are ready, the Iraqi government will likely ask the U.S forces to leave (which most in the U.S. government would apparently like to comply with)
3. If the Iraq forces are trained in order to police their own country, that is "better". |
This is something that has puzzled me for a long time: why the hell aren't they ready? In a country where the standing army was once the fourth largest in the world... what the heck could be taking so long???
I smell yet another rat. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 7:28 pm Post subject: Re: Iraqis March, Say Elections Were Rigged |
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Bee Positive
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Yeah, things will be going really well when someone points a gun at my head!
Like they were in Poland in 1940!
Sieg . . .
HEIL!
Seig . . .
Hail . . .
Bush . . . hail Bush!
HAIL~ HELL- HELL!
oh dear bush rape my wife kill my kids and bring me freedom dear jesus who didst die for the oil, take my oil, my country, my family, all that i am for you bring democracy and yes lord ill vote forever more if you come without regard to count just so long as dear lord were free now forever with american military bases forever and forever more on our soil as it was in the beginning is now and will be forever dear lord uncle sam amen
Stop me, someone,
BEE POSITIVE |
Saddam was one of the greatest killers in the history of the world.
Anyone who says they oppose the Iraq war on humanitarian grounds is either ignortant or disingenous . which one are you?
BEE A MOONBAT
Last edited by Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee on Mon Dec 26, 2005 7:47 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| It is a fact that things are not going well in Iraq. |
they were not going well before the US invaded Iraq.
Besides the Bathists , and the Bin Ladens followers were at war with the US before the US invaded Iraq. They ought to give up their war.
If they don't wan't to give up their war then the US is justifed in doing anything and everything to force them to. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Fisk
Hear this guy the other day giving a lecture on the current situation in Iraq. He's really good! Amazing the things he points out, in particular how much the current US occupation parallels that of Britain back in the early 20th century.
Indeed " ... the more things change, the more they remain the same."
http://www.robert-fisk.com/audio.htm
BTW - Too bad this wasn't a POLL question. Rigged you say, eh? Doh !!! Everyone here who's surprised beyond belief ... raise your hand.
Last edited by igotthisguitar on Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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Robert Fisk the US is bad the US will fail.
There is Robert Fisk.
but there is one difference Saddam was at war with the US , and the Bathists , Khomeni lovers and Bin Laden followers were at war with the US out to get the US.
Just like supporters of Jeff Rense. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Robert Fisk the US is bad the US will fail. |
First & foremost the US gov't ( hijacked by your war-mongering Zionist neo-con buddies ) is pursuing a bloody imperial "terrorist" policy in the Middle East.
For his part, Mr. Fisk is a very well informed & insightful journalist. He's also aware of how history tends to repeat itself.
His knowledge & analysis impresses me greatly. I encourage anyone who's interested to listen to what he has to say.
Last edited by igotthisguitar on Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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| igotthisguitar wrote: |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Robert Fisk the US is bad the US will fail. |
First & foremost the US gov't ( hijacked by your Zionist neo-con buddies ) are pursuing a bloody imperial "terrorist" policy in the Middle East.
For his part, Mr. Fisk is a very well informed & insightful journalist. He's also aware of how history tends to repeat itself.
His knowledge & analysis impresses me greatly. I encourage anyone who's interested to listen to what he has to say. |
Robert Fisk is very well informed and inciteful he also has an anti US agenda. He writes to go after the US.
Last word on the subject he is not.
CHARLES MANSON WROTE:
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| First & foremost the US gov't are pursuing a bloody imperial "terrorist" policy in the Middle East. |
not so .
Anyway Tell the Bathists , Khomeni lovers and Bin Laden followers to give up their war.
they don't have a right to their war
the US is just hitting back. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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"I'd like to believe that what the Americans say is true, but living here I don't believe it is".
Robert Fisk
http://www.robert-fisk.com/audio.htm |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:30 am Post subject: Re: Iraqis March, Say Elections Were Rigged |
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| EFLtrainer wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
2. It is also a fact that only about of half of the army and police force are ready. However some of these forces are already undertaking operations on their own. Once they are ready, the Iraqi government will likely ask the U.S forces to leave (which most in the U.S. government would apparently like to comply with)
3. If the Iraq forces are trained in order to police their own country, that is "better". |
This is something that has puzzled me for a long time: why the hell aren't they ready? In a country where the standing army was once the fourth largest in the world... what the heck could be taking so long???
I smell yet another rat. |
(Breaks self-imposed rule to respond)
The problem is that there are a large number to train and only a few trainers since the Americans are a bit busy to give their full attention to this issue. Another problem is the lack of IRAQI officers. The Americans kicked out the ones that were put in power by Saddam and only now are belatedly hiring many of them back. The Administration went in with too rosy a view of how they would be treated. They should have had a serious back-up plan all ready.
A third problem is that many of these soldiers and police aren't (or at least don't appear) "serious". They just don't appear to have the stomach for being shot at.
That said there are reasons to be optomistic: The violence in Iraq is mainly confined to four of the 18 provinces and a lot of that is in one city. Nearly half the Iraqi troops are "combat ready" or "very close" And the insurgents continue to lose popular support with every civilian they kill. And more Sunnis seem likely to join the government. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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No he probably believes what the Ayatollah Khamani says 
And in the case of Robert Fisk , the truth is that he doesn't want to believe what the US says.
he is biased against the US and always has been. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2005 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| And in the case of Robert Fisk , the truth is that he doesn't want to believe what the US says |
Joo ... you're always going on about the US this & the US that.
What EXACTLY do you mean when you use this vague little label: the US? Please explain. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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Fisk has got in in for the US. He always has been so. Well before Bush was president.
Notice - silence from him about Iran or Hezzbollah? Wonder why that is?
Some journalist. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:46 am Post subject: |
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| igotthisguitar wrote: |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| And in the case of Robert Fisk , the truth is that he doesn't want to believe what the US says |
Joo ... you're always going on about the US this & the US that.
What EXACTLY do you mean when you use this vague little label: the US? Please explain. |
Joo ol' chap. Did you catch this? Could you clear this up? What exactly do you mean when you say "the" US? |
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