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patchy
Joined: 26 Apr 2005
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 Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:24 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
Perhaps not in Australia yet, although you will no doubt reach such a point as your muslim population increases with the inevitable conflicts that will bring. In Europe, particularly in France and the Netherlands, there are millions of people, who after realising what muslim immigration is doing to their nations, hold precisely the same views as myself. |
The interesting thing about the Lebanese Muslims and all the focus on them lately is that the Lebanese Muslims are the least Muslim of the Muslims in Australia. As I have said before, there is not much separating the Christian and Muslim Lebanese culturally. People coming from Lebanon are familiar with western culture. Beirut used to be called the Paris of the ME; it was a big entertainment and tourist hotspot (lots of trendy nightclubs and drinking) before the war. Large numbers of French people settled there at one point a couple or more centuries ago (many Lebanese can speak French). The Lebanese population is a real mix and less Arab than most of the other nations in that area: they can claim people from Mediterranean Europe (Phoenicians) as their earliest ancestors.
Given that in general the migrants from Lebanon are quite cosmopolitan in outlook in and less Muslim in practice and more 'white/European' ethnically compared to say a migrant from Pakistan, it hasn't been hard for them to adapt to white Australian society at all (some might say "too well"). The latest incidents are a reflection of this - that the Lebanese have reached the point where they feel capable of engaging whites in turf wars and I think this is what is upsetting to the whites - not so much that the Muslims are committing crimes - because as we can see whites are no strangers to criminal activity themselves (and compared to whites, migrants on the whole in general commit less crime) - but that the fact the Lebanese feel comfortable encroaching on the whites' territory - they're not behaving like the typical immigrants who have come to Australia in the past, not striving to be seen as a model minority. Because at the end of the day despite the brouhaha in the media lately, all the statistics show that the Lebanese commit fewer crimes than indigenous (white) Australians (perhaps the main object of the deliberate obfuscation of the statistics is to shield the white majority from this embarrassing fact, and less to reduce discrimination against minorities). So that's not the real problem. The real problem is that the Lebanese are 'too similar' to the white majority and this is upsetting the accepted order of things in Australian society.
The crimes you talk about in Europe are more POLITICAL in nature than the ones committed by Lebanese that have been publicized (except for the alleged planned sabotage or spying on of the Lucas Heights nuclear facility), and they have been committed by people from other backgrounds than Lebanese I believe, by people from more traditionally religious (Muslim) societies and backgrounds (by fundamentalists; the Lebanese involved in the gang rape and so on are not of the fundamentalist persuasion - probably just Muslim in name only, although of course fundamentalist Lebanese exist and do commit crimes in the name of their religion).
If the Muslim religion was to blame for the gang rapes and other gang-related crimes by the Lebanese, you would expect to see a spike in similar crimes (rapes Etc) by the Afghanis, the Sudanese, the Turkish and other Muslim groups in Sydney, which you don't. In Islamic societies, crimes like rape are dealt with harshly; by capital punishment in some cases, especially in fundamentalist Islamic nations. Rape is relatively less frequent in these places than in the west; women have reported that they feel safer walking alone by themselves at night - I suppose much like the way women feel safer doing that in Korea (as they tend to feel in more traditional societies) than they do in a western country (though of course there are no absolutely safe places anywhere in the world). |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:37 am Post subject: |
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| In Islamic societies, crimes like rape are dealt with harshly; by capital punishment in some cases, especially in fundamentalist Islamic nations. Rape is relatively less frequent in these places than in the west; women have reported that they feel safer walking alone by themselves at night |
You are very, very naive. You have no basis for saying that rape is less frequent, because in such countries rapes often go unreported, due to the emphasis placed on 'honour' and 'shame' in those societies. In fact, there have been many cases of women being charged with adultery after being raped, or even killed by their own family members for staining the 'honour' of their families. There was a recent case in Pakistan, where a woman who had been raped was then sentenced to be gang-raped (yes, you heard correctly) by a tribal court. Yes, such civilized, female friendly countries.
In such societies, the justice system is totally biased against women, and in Islamic states this is even more the case, perhaps because of the Koranic injunction that a women's testimony is worth half that of a man's. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:10 am Post subject: |
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Here's what the 'women are safe on the streets' Islamic Propagandists will not tell you.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=20935
Rafayda Qaoud shared a bedroom in her Ramallah home with her two brothers. After they raped and impregnated her, she gave birth to a baby boy who was adopted by another family. Her mother then gave Rafayda a razor blade and ordered her to slash her own wrists. When she refused to commit suicide, her mother pulled a plastic bag tightly over her head, sliced open her daughter�s wrists and beat her with a stick until she was dead.
Palestinian feminist Abu Dayyeh Shamas claims that: "Men feel they have lost their dignity and that they can somehow restore it by upholding the family's honour. We've noticed recent cases are much more violent in nature; attempts to kill, rape, incest. There is an incredible amount of incest." One women�s group reported over 400 cases of incest in the West Bank alone in 2002.
When 17-year-old Afaf Younes ran away from her father after he allegedly sexually assaulted her, she was caught and sent home to him. He then shot and killed her to protect his honor.
In 2005, Amnesty International issued a public statement that called for the Palestinian Authority not to resume executions of those convicted of murder, rape or collaborating with Israelis. It simultaneously called for an end to the �impunity so far afforded to those responsible for certain crimes� including �honour killings.�
Due to mass immigration from muslim societies, Europe has now been 'enriched' by such 'culture'. |
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bangbayed
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:02 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
| You are very, very naive. |
Don't be too offended by his insults, he really doesn't know what he's talking about. The fact that you tried to bring this thread back on track hasn't deterred him. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 5:04 am Post subject: |
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| bangbayed wrote: |
| bigverne wrote: |
| You are very, very naive. |
Don't be too offended by his insults, he really doesn't know what he's talking about. The fact that you tried to bring this thread back on track hasn't deterred him. |
No, it hasn't deterred me from challenging his assertion that rape is less frequent in muslim countries and that women can 'walk the streets' without fear. He also forgot to mention that in many muslim countries, women aren't allowed to walk the streets along, during the day or night, without permission of a male relative. I also posted an article to back up my rebuttal of his point, whereas you, once again, bring nothing to the table. |
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bangbayed
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 8:04 am Post subject: |
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Verne, your tactics are so predictably lame, it's hard to take them seriously anymore. You ignore patchy's excellent post about the Lebanese (topic of this thread) vs other muslims (topic of your head) and zero in on some sub sub sub topic of his post about the rate of rapes in muslim socieities.
Talk about having an agenda. But what else can you do when his post has not only brought the thread back on topic, but pretty much shattered your 10 page diatribe to pieces? One can only read his post and pity you, I suppose. Your nitpicking at a minor subpoint only proves his point. *sigh*
And your double-consecutive posts? A half hour apart? I chuckled.
It was also laughable that you think posting a link to some reactionary-David Horowitz-Free Republic wannabee-rationalizing-bigoty screed is a worthy reply. Shameful though, that you would use rape as some kind of counter-argument. Will have to take off a couple points for that.
bigverne: 3/10 argument
8/10 amusement - but don't worry. I'm sure you'll post something else that'll raise that score! |
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Futooomsh
Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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| It was a massive media beat up....stay away from Cronulla anyway, it's a s&ithole |
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